Sea Shepherd Protesters Ram Japanese Whalers in Intense Clash

Originally posted by Leto

Originally posted by jfj123
reply to post by Leto

 

Just curious. Do you think we need to hunt whales? If so why? If not why?

Thanks.

Do we need to hunt cows and chickens? No we could probably survive on a simple bland diet of plants. Do we like to eat beef and chicken? Definitely, so we eat them. Japanese like the taste of whale, so they eat them.

Actually humans are omnivores meaning we require meat for proper health.
Just saying

Japanese like the taste of whale, so they eat them.

reply to post by Leto

People really don't like the taste of whale meat. Much of Japan's history of whale eating stems from the aftermath of WWII. American Occupiers in the 1940's recommended that Japan feed its starving people whale meat.

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few Japanese see the point in eating whale, which doesn't taste that special

Link for above text.

Sato-san is one of the men who harpoons whale.

Noriko Sato: For young people we don’t have any interest to commercial whaling, because we didn’t eat any whale meat from our childhood. But for example, my grandparents or my grandmothers ate, they had lots of whale meat from their childhood, so they really miss the whale meat.
Selene Alcock: So, Noriko, do you eat whale meat as well?
Noriko Sato: No.

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I could keep going all day, but I have other things to do. Just google a question about Japanese liking whale meat and there will be 100s of links saying that they really don't.

Yes, I have eaten whale. However, I am 100% against whaling and not just because I do not like to eat whale meat.

I do not support Watson at all. Violence or force does not always bring public opinion to your side. In many cases it can turn people against your cause. I actually do know some people who were against whaling or could have easily been swayed in their opinion to be against it, but have taken a pro-whaling stance simply because of the tactics they see used by certain people. I will say it again. Watson makes us all look bad.

edit because I spelled harpoon wrong.


[edit on 9-2-2009 by tamusan]

Originally posted by tamusan

Japanese like the taste of whale, so they eat them.

reply to post by Leto

 

People really don't like the taste of whale meat. Much of Japan's history of whale eating stems from the aftermath of WWII. American Occupiers in the 1940's recommended that Japan feed its starving people whale meat.

Link for above text

few Japanese see the point in eating whale, which doesn't taste that special

Link for above text.

Sato-san is one of the men who harpoons whale.

Noriko Sato: For young people we don’t have any interest to commercial whaling, because we didn’t eat any whale meat from our childhood. But for example, my grandparents or my grandmothers ate, they had lots of whale meat from their childhood, so they really miss the whale meat.
Selene Alcock: So, Noriko, do you eat whale meat as well?
Noriko Sato: No.

Link for above text.

Interesting, so it's more of an acquired taste. Well I guess now that whale meat is increasingly being served to schools in Japan they'll probably end up liking it like their grandparents.

[edit on 9-2-2009 by Leto]

reply to post by Leto

Let's hope not Leto. The kids have plenty of other things to eat and they do not really seem to like eating whale. The people left over from post WW2 really did not have anything to eat.

I found lots of Japanese language references with figures for the percentage of Japanese who do not support whaling and after some heavy surfing on the subject I was able to find a reference in English.

Most Japanese (69%) are against this practice and even more (95%) don't eat whale meat.

kyoto journal in English for above quote

So why does the Japanese government defy the wishes of the people? Oops. Hope they don't yank my spouse visa for that one.

Originally posted by tamusan
I found lots of Japanese language references with figures for the percentage of Japanese who do not support whaling

Care to post or U2U them? I'd be interested in reading that - especially the details on where and when the polls were conducted.

From where I sit - ie. rural Hokkaido - I have a hard time finding whale meat if I leave my shopping until after I finish work. It tends to sell out fairly quickly earlier in the day. That has been the case for as long as I've been here (7 years, give or take a bit).

In my experience, opinion polls in Japan can be extremely misleading, depending on where they're centred - on pretty much any topic. The differences between Osaka and Tokyo, or Sapporo and Nagoya tend to be pretty extreme. If you've been to any of those places, you'll know what I mean. The difference of opinion - and difference of lifestyle in general - between urban and rural is at least as pronounced here as it is in the USA

Sea Shepherd are terrorists, seems pretty simple. Everyone has an opinion and if everyone acted as judge, jury, and executioner the world would be chaos. No matter what your beliefs they do not give you the right to do what the Sea Shepherd is doing. If it is actually illegal then the Australian governement should act, why haven't they? Here is the Sea Shepherds history of terrorism and wanting to hurt people who do not believe in what they believe. www.activistcash.com...

Originally posted by Anonymous ATS
Sea Shepherd are terrorists, seems pretty simple.

I would consider them people who are attempting to prevent criminals from profiting from their criminal enterprise.

Everyone has an opinion and if everyone acted as judge, jury, and executioner the world would be chaos.

In many states in the United States, you're required to get involved if you know a crime is taking place. They're trying to prevent a crime.

No matter what your beliefs they do not give you the right to do what the Sea Shepherd is doing.

Ever hear of citizens patrols? That's what they're doing but with water

If it is actually illegal then the Australian governement should act, why haven't they?

Maybe for the same reason Bush wasn't impeached even though he and his entire administration committed many crimes. Even darth cheney admitted to ok'ing torture yet he isn't being charged??

Here is the Sea Shepherds history of terrorism and wanting to hurt people who do not believe in what they believe. www.activistcash.com...

I consider the japanse terrorists and criminals and so do many others.

Originally posted by jfj123

Originally posted by Anonymous ATS
Sea Shepherd are terrorists, seems pretty simple.

I would consider them people who are attempting to prevent criminals from profiting from their criminal enterprise.
I consider the japanse terrorists and criminals and so do many others.

Actually what the Japanese whalers are doing in the Southern Ocean isn't against any law, the ICW is completely voluntary, this is a fact:
en.wikipedia.org...

Originally posted by Leto

Originally posted by jfj123

Originally posted by Anonymous ATS
Sea Shepherd are terrorists, seems pretty simple.

I would consider them people who are attempting to prevent criminals from profiting from their criminal enterprise.
I consider the japanse terrorists and criminals and so do many others.

Actually what the Japanese whalers are doing in the Southern Ocean isn't against any law, the ICW is completely voluntary, this is a fact:
en.wikipedia.org...

The Southern Ocean Whale Sanctuary is an area of 50 million square kilometres surrounding the continent of Antarctica where the International Whaling Commission (IWC) has banned all types of commercial whaling. To date, the IWC has designated two such sanctuaries, the other being the Indian Ocean Whale Sanctuary.

and here's japans abuse of he loophole

As sanctuaries only apply to commercial whaling, Japan has continued to hunt whales inside the Southern Ocean Whale Sanctuary because its whaling is done in accordance with a provision in the IWC charter permitting whaling for the purposes of scientific research

They're pretending to do scientific research to get away with commercial whaling.

The catch of the 2005 season (Dec 05-Mar 06) inside the sanctuary included 856 minke whales and ten of the endangered Fin whale. In 2007 - 2008 Japan planned to take 935 minke whales and 50 fin whales.

Notice the endangered part in this quote?

Information from your source.

I guess this makes the japanese the good guys?

Originally posted by jfj123
I guess this makes the japanese the good guys?

Yes, I assume you now understand that the ICW is completely voluntary and that the research/whaling Japan is carrying out in the Southern Ocean isn't breaking any laws.

reply to post by jfj123

vox-san
Looks like I have not earned the right to U2U, yet. If the mods give me the greenlight to post links to some Japanese websites, I will.

In the meantime, you can research an activist named Nao Inoue or Mark Brazil. Mark Brazil has his students conduct a survey every year about whaling attitudes in Japan. There is also a website called what Japan thinks. I am unsure about the data from that website. It does not seem to have a large number of people polled. The biggest difference I see in poll results has nothing to do with demographics. It depends on who is giving the poll the AL crowd or the pro-whale crowd.

I see that someone else brought up one of my earlier questions about who owns the south seas. I think if it was really Australia's, the military would be all over this. I think the only people who recognize the claim on that part of the ocean is the Australians themselves and they do not send military because they know they really do not own it.

vox, maybe you can second my opinion that all Watson is accomplishing is uniting the Japanese into a nationalistic frenzy. Any progress that has been made here by peaceful activists will probably be negated. I'll U2U you once I get the privelage. I love trading gaijin tales. Oh, I'm in the 10th largest city , my wife's hometown. We've been married since '91.








[edit on 10-2-2009 by tamusan]

I'm from Australia am neutral on the issue. I don't support it nor do I oppose it.

People complain of how 'barbaric' the Japanese are when killing them with harpoons. Let's face it, whales are huge and the Japanese are killing them in the easiest and most practical way. Frankly I don't know why they don't put a cover over the back of the ship so that people can't see the whales being hauled up!

Why doesn't anyone mention the practice of Kosher slaughtering by the Jews?

Here is a video of one and let me warn you that it is very graphic and disturbing yet it clearly shows that in comparison to what the Japanese are doing, it is much more barbaric. They slit their throats and let them bleed when they can easily kill them in a second if they wanted to. The Japanese can't do that because of the sheer size of whales.

I applaud the Sea Shepard and their actions in defense of the Whales.
Some one before me commented "We are sentient, they are not" as if that gives us every right to drive them to extinction.

Personally I would prefer to see the Japanese people become extinct than to see the Whales become extinct. I am certain that the Whales will, in the long run, contribute far more to Life on Earth than the Japanese do. Besides, there are LOTS of other human cultures and races, so the loss of one arrogant, selfish race should hardly be a footnote.

reply to post by Webmusher


You're generalizing there which makes you sound like the arrogant one. The same could be said with any other country regarding other issues and it's funny hearing that from an American as I'm sure there are a lot of people in the world that can say the same thing about America. If you truly feel that way about Japan because of whaling you really are ignorant and don't know anything. This is a separate issue and shouldn't be associated with Japan as a whole.

Japan is one of the most civilized and safest countries in the world. Maybe you should go there and then you'll think differently. Actually maybe it's better off if someone like you didn't go there.

reply to post by Webmusher

All I can say is wow.
I could generalize, too. Wasilla, huh? Shouldn't you be out in a helicopter shooting wolves? Of course, unlike you I'm not serious about my comment and don't assume that people in a given area or of a specific race are all the same.
Just curious. How do you feel about the native Alaskans and their right to hunt whale?
Do you know that we (Americans) are a major part of the whales even coming close to extinction? And we didn't eat them. We only wanted the oil.

I couldn't agree more. I've been a bit shocked by the amount of Japanese bashing on this thread and this was not my intention. We cannot collectively blame the Japanese for the actions of these "scientific researchers."

I happen to have a great admiration of the Japanese culture as a whole. But, as with many other cultures, the Japanese are not perfect. This does not give us a reason to condemn an entire people.





[edit on 12/2/2009 by Beelzebubba]

Text Blackreply to post by Kryties
I totally agree with you! In this day and age i can't beleve people are still killing whales!?

Ok, I read this thread, Here is my point of view on this from a very real perspective. While flying patrol I just happened to stumble upon a Japanese whaling ship In U.S. Waters. Tried to contact them 3 times , no response. Fired the 50Cal traces, and then I have a response. This Japanese whaling ship was claiming scientific research in U.S Waters. Hmmm ..called up the U.S Coast guard, They did not buy that story either. The coast guard sent two ships and escorted the Japanese vessel back to port. The U.S tax payers are the new owners of this fishing vessel. Glad I rolled the camera on this incident; pretty incrementing evidence. I hope there still in jail.

So there you have it, Japan still using the scientific research scams to hunt whales in any nations waters. That “snip “ snip ” captain “snip” me off big time. I could not believe they also tried to make a run for it. stupid captain. I should have sunk his ship. This happened a few years ago. when Japan decided to expanded its whale hunting into anyone waters for sperm whales and other endangered whales. After seeing the behavior of these whales at this incident, I have to say they are sentient beings, they do know what is going on around them and they do communcate with each other. I’m all for saving these whales. I no longer fly , but some of my friends do. and i know these whales will be safe with them in the skies.

I also very much doubt the Sea Shepherd Protesters Rammed the Japanese vessel, that's such propaganda from Japan. they tired something like that with that incident I had. until the film was presented though official channels’. Its very hard to debunk evidence film from a military aircraft.

Save The Whales Everyone.




[edit on 12-2-2009 by SJE98]

[edit on 12-2-2009 by SJE98]

reply to post by Leto


Due to things like this that we as a species are still doing, I agree with the elitists that there are to many humans on the planet. And we should start thinning the population beginning with the ones that have not yet learned that we are connected to everything else. If it suffers so shall we!

I recall reading a story within the last couple of years about a great whale that had been killed and when they were cutting it up they removed a vintage harpoon over 100 years old that had obviously broken off in the whale.
That Ancient Peaceful Creature had more of a right to existence than any human!

We are supposed to be stewards of this planet, we have failed!

SAVE THE WHALES! Harpoon Humans!

[edit on 12-2-2009 by PaulKCA]

[edit on 12-2-2009 by PaulKCA]