A more alien-like economy (that can't fail)

Originally posted by badmedia

he philosophy behind a system is no different than the logic I program into systems I design on a daily basis.

For example. The philosophy of karma. In a programming world, it's as simple as"

If ($user_action == "bad") [
$user_situation--; (subtracts 1)
]
else if ($user_action == "good") [
$user_situation++; (adds 1)
]
else [
do nothing;
]

To understand the philosophy behind things is to understand the logic and the system itself. Without it, you will never have transparency, no matter who's mind your are reading. A lie detector test only tests if the subject believes what is said is true or not, it does not in anyway reveal any actual truth unless the subject is aware they are lieing.

Karma deals about relativity, in a sense that what is good for you might be bad for me or for some other living being. I don't see that in your code. Another common misconception (in the west, which I assume you are from) about karma is that there is some huge abacus somewhere in the universe which keeps track of all those actions, which there is not in the philosophy of karma. It is rather more like when you have a clear river and you as an individual start to interact with it, your actions will influence it, changing the outcome of your future. If you only drink from it, not much will happen. If you decide to piss in it you might make someone else drinking from it sick. Your code only deals with 1 individual's actions and circumstances, karma came to be because more individuals started living together and a model to live together in harmony was needed. In programming language (though I'm no expert) there's a dynamic result that constantly interacts with each previous outcome affecting everyone.

[edit on 21-9-2008 by Dragonfly79]

Originally posted by sty
Well, if so how can you explain that your desktop computer can make about 10000000 calculations a second while your amazing brain needs several seconds for a 5 figure calculation? I guess you over-estimate the biological brain capacity. The nature is more blind that you think! I also recommend you a book called " the selfish gene" by Dawkins.
[edit on 19-9-2008 by sty]

Because there is something called "a persona" or spirit that is hogging up all the resources (the brain). A computer doesn't have that. Think of the body being created to function as a biological supercomputer which the operators (the spirit, "you" and "me") are still trying to grasp. In computer language, we are born into this world each one having a great personal computer that can do lots of things. But we don't know it's commands and how to properly interact with it and because it's so difficult to learn most of us give up and go surfing the web instead.

Once we grasp our own spirit we might go on and discover more of our brains and how to best use it. For now we can only marvel at people like these:
savants

[edit on 21-9-2008 by Dragonfly79]

reply to post by m4edit


I've seen the movie. I actually do like the subject of UFO's and I watch just about everything I find on the subject and I listen to coast to coast so much I have a subscription to make sure I don't miss any episodes.

It's the communist agenda associated with it that I can't stand. Just like we see in this post, these people can only see it as being "for the greater good", but what they can't see is who determines what is good and bad.

If all these "contacts" are true, then I want nothing to do with these aliens.

However, I'd be lying if I said I didn't think some of these people are just looking to push an agenda and don't really have any real contact with ETs, and they are merely pushing the same agenda as those who push the NWO agenda. Communism is the government the "elite" want. Because it gives them complete control over the economy and social issues and anyone who doesn't go along with the community is tossed aside. Exactly what these people are supposed to be up against.

Makes me sick.

reply to post by Dragonfly79


Oh, it would be alot more to code than what I listed. I was just trying to make a general point of how to understand the philosophy of things is the same as understanding the logic in them.

I mean there are layers and layers of things. Where in 1 layer something is "bad", and then on another layer, it is actually "good".

Take GWB for example. I think he does alot of "bad" things. On the other hand, I owe him alot. He was a big reason I finally "woke up" about the things going on. I could never support the guy, or any of the things he stands for. But I have to admit he did alot of good things for me personally in my awakening.

So yeah, I did simplify karma a good bit there. I find keeping it simply helps people understand.

Originally posted by badmedia
reply to post by m4edit

 

I've seen the movie. I actually do like the subject of UFO's and I watch just about everything I find on the subject and I listen to coast to coast so much I have a subscription to make sure I don't miss any episodes.

It's the communist agenda associated with it that I can't stand. Just like we see in this post, these people can only see it as being "for the greater good", but what they can't see is who determines what is good and bad.

If all these "contacts" are true, then I want nothing to do with these aliens.

However, I'd be lying if I said I didn't think some of these people are just looking to push an agenda and don't really have any real contact with ETs, and they are merely pushing the same agenda as those who push the NWO agenda. Communism is the government the "elite" want. Because it gives them complete control over the economy and social issues and anyone who doesn't go along with the community is tossed aside. Exactly what these people are supposed to be up against.

Makes me sick.

Living in a society means there needs to be some sort of control and leadership. Sadly you didnt understand what I was saying. We are not ready for such changes because we dont trust each other, too many people are in for power and greed and you proved my point exactly. Does it really sickens you to follow rules for a greater human and planetary good? Because the system we live in doesnt allow that. If you have better alternatives please share them.

My first thought when I read this treatise was "communism meets aliens." I understand the philosophy of marxism and I understand the real politik of communism. The first is preached and the second is practiced.

Yes this guy is saying the aliens live in a communist space Utopia. It is utter hogwash, and he reveals his marxist intent as he states the assumption that all the "have nots" are downtrodden because of greed and hoarding. In poker we call that a tell. In that one statement he brushed aside all of the lazy, addicted, unmotivated, and falsely entitled people who recieved unjustified loans from banking houses due to racial quota pressure from the Clinton administration. The Author basically stated that poverty is due to the greed of others as a fact, and every one of us know that is not true from our own sublime experience, the culmination of which takes it from anecdote to empiracle.

My wife is a CPA and she called it last spring when Bear Stearns fell. She said the chickens have come home to roost. And now all those minority loan programs that stressed skin color over sound economic factors like credit rating, savings, and work history will wreck the banking system. She was right, and so are all of the other financial people saying the same thing. Loaning 100's of 1000's of dollars to people you personally wouldn't lend 10 dollars to is the problem.

That being said if the Federal Reserve, etc, didn't exist then the likes of Clinton and Bush wouldn't be able to force those banks to make such loans. Instead it would be up to professional accountants who crunch numbers, not the horde of ex Democrat officials that have paraded through the ranks of Freddie Mac and Fannie May. Do your research and you will know the truth.

Find out how many times American central banking schemes have failed and how many depressions we have had because of it. This time it is because of bad loans driven by communist race babble spoon fed to the populace through subtle (commercials, sit-coms) and not so subtle (hate crime law) means. It isn't the first time though. The Civil war reconstruction broke the bank because of corrution at the top. The American Navy buildup broke the banf in the 1890's because of corruption. In 1999 congress allowed the law that forbade investment banks (stock market casinos basically) from owning or having any part of savings and loan banks. That law was put into place in the 1930's because of the crash of '29.

9 years later and here we are. Guess who wanted the law repealed? Investment bankers and hedge funds like Soros, Murdoch, etc.

Aliens do not enter into it. I think we will have enough to worry about soon enough without the much balleyhooed Anurimati showing up to planet Earth. We have hordes of entitlement classes that are used to feeding from your paycheck from your labor, and they know few restraints and little bounds. They are lazy and addicted, and very comfortable with the central theme of the Alien communist message stated by this "author." I taught Poly-Sci for 20 years at the University and I can say the following is a fact:

No communist government has ever come to power without turmoil and civil strife in a nation. Well, we have the turmoil and the second part of the equation exists as well, but it isn't sufficient in quantity and scope to get the Marxist ball rolling yet. That is why the markets are crashing, due to "subprime loans" at precisely the same time as our first minority president is running for office.

The aliens need to read "the Prince" by Machiavelli, or little Earthbound Robber Barons will end up wrecking their planets as well.

Good luck with the Shining Path of Alpha Centauri movement, and have some koolaid.

Originally posted by TheOracle
Living in a society means there needs to be some sort of control and leadership. Sadly you didnt understand what I was saying. We are not ready for such changes because we dont trust each other, too many people are in for power and greed and you proved my point exactly. Does it really sickens you to follow rules for a greater human and planetary good? Because the system we live in doesnt allow that. If you have better alternatives please share them.

There is but 1 universal law I follow, which in itself has other obvious "laws". And that law is that I will never do anything to purposely take away someone's free will, either physically, or mentally. Of course, this takes care of the obvious things such as murder, theft and other basic crimes. Because those crimes infringe on my universal law. Even pollution should be a crime, because you have no right to pollute another beings environment. Regulations as a result of central planning actually only serve to legalize pollution.

As such, the only function of any government should be to insure this universal law is protected. When the function of government goes beyond protecting free will, then it in itself becomes a function which removes free will and freedom. And that is what a communist government does. It removes peoples freedom.

What sickens me is the evil that is wrapped up as being for the greater good and planet. What sickens me is the very thing you state, power and greed are exactly what drives this agenda. Suddenly I am to believe that those who seek power will suddenly start being good people. As if a communist nation is immune to such things. It's ridiculous. Those who gain power are those who seek power.

Why do you even need government to do these things? Because you wish to force the people to obey the agenda. Do you need a government to do all these things for you personally to help the poor? No. It's your own power trip thinking you know whats good for people that makes you want to force it on to other people. You seek power over others, and tell them it's for their own good. Sound familiar? Is this not exactly what people are pointing out that the bad people are doing?

And while you point fingers at me saying I prove your point, you are the one who doesn't trust people to do the right thing on their own. Thus the need for control, and thus the need to force people to do it.

I have no problems with people who want to form organizations and charities to help people and help the greater good. I donate money to charities as well as helping those near to me when possible. I do not need nor want to force what I think is best on other people. Because that is to infringe on someone else's free will.

I've already laid out an alternative in this thread in a previous post. Our troubles exist because we live under economic slavery, and under a government who does not respect free will. Central planning is exactly what got us into this mess, and is nothing more than continuing the status quo under a new image.

[edit on 21-9-2008 by badmedia]

whoa, communism is not just simply a police state.

communism ie, work for the "community" as a whole IS a great idea.

It has just been given a bad rap by the rich, who want to get richer, and want to keep social class levels.

Imo, communism or community-ism, is better than capitol-ism. It's just been given a bad name, and a bad rap, because humans haven't evolved past a classless society.

I am not takeing a shot at aliens saying it sounds as if they are communists.

This is strictly on a economical level I am speaking.

How this utopian classless society decides to "police" themselves is another matter entirely. Humans still need a police system, where I am sure there are alien civs that have matured past acts of violence and crime against thier fellow being, or even themselves.

Any authority worthy of being considered a legitimate one will avoid all infringements on individuality - REAL individuality. That means they themselves won't be a part of any kind of collective pathology/evil. That means no militaries and other monolithic, mindless, corrupt mob mentalities. (That's not saying there will ever be no need for basic, truly fair and rational law enforcement). Who knows what it will or would take for humanity to reach such a plateau? I hope more than words can express that it will be reached; and the sooner the better.

This may seem a bit off topic, but to me it's not: I just finished reading (the Frank Herbert novel) DUNE, and I got about halfway through the Appendix 2 (after the end of the main story, concerning the religions of the "future"), and decided I couldn't finish the piece of s#@t. It's the biggest imperialistic, uncivilized, misogynist, anthropocentric universe model of a sick fantasy ever written! It's what all reasonably thinking and feeling people should most adamantly reject concerning the future of human space travel, exploration, colonization. DUNE is the same barbaric insanity as today and all throughout known history! No such lowly beings are truly worthy of interstellar travel. Rant over. Peace out.

[edit on 21-9-2008 by Lightworth]

Great post GL2. I totally over-looked the inter-dimensional factors. More to add to my continueous but never to be finished space civilization game.

I agree with what some of the members say when they think we as a race simply aren't ready. But we have to look at exactly what spawns selfish behavior and that is fear. We fear things we don't understand. If we let the world in on the wisdom of a greater plan, they might start to turn around. Then hopefully they might learn, and evolve.

When you first start meditating, getting into self-awareness / mind-self diagnostic, you start to see how much fear you really possess. Fear of physical pain, emotional pain, fear of unwanted activity or use of energy, fear of love, fear of communication, fear of perception - that is.. wanting to blind yourself to your environment, to not see what you know is there, and fear of wisdom - for we know that it will bring upon a change perhaps some of us aren't ready for, to take on new responsibility because now we know better, that is... saying "well I didn't know", is no longer an excuse for our errors.

Through my own efforts over the years I have found the cause of many fears and doubts to the point where I can't begin to identify with the thought process I once possessed.

I started to understand - so I no longer feared. I started to care, then i started to get motivated. Now I am ready for more responsibility, and I am more then eager to help.


Therefore in my opinion, one way we can implement the plan GL2 has suggested, is to educate the public, to give them the knowledge, and hopefully help them understand. Then, maybe they'll come to a greater realization, and finally start to care.

I am of the opinion that those who live for personal gain will never find satisfaction, true happiness, fulfillment and understanding, and deep down are constantly fighting a battle in their minds. I mean, once you break a billion dollars, you have everything, why keep going? They just don't understand, they aren't bad people, they just don't understand. That is my opinion and that is one reason that I began to accept everyone as they are.

I think the key thing people strive for, though they may deny or ignore it, is that we all deep down, search for a sense of MEANING.

.........

Let the people know, but make sure they UNDERSTAND. I think their own self-realizations will take over from there. Myself, I have changed drastically, so have my family, and many others that I know. It is possible.

We have to start being honest with each other, and sharing the wisdom we possess.

Originally posted by Lightworth
Any authority worthy of being considered a legitimate one will avoid all infringements on individuality - REAL individuality. That means they themselves won't be a part of any kind of collective pathology/evil. That means no militaries and other monolithic, mindless, corrupt mob mentalities. (That's not saying there will ever be no need for basic, truly fair and rational law enforcement). Who knows what it will or would take for humanity to reach such a plateau? I hope more than words can express that it will be reached; and the sooner the better.

Do you realise that greed and selfishness are related to individuality? For example the 2 children rule, would you feel it is necessary or an infrigement on individuality if you wanted 3 or more children?
I understand where you are coming from, but there is a limit to this, otherwise a global sustainable system for all cannot be achieved.


People need to stop thinking only about them, but think about the consequences to others.

Originally posted by CavemanDD
Great post GL2. I totally over-looked the inter-dimensional factors. More to add to my continueous but never to be finished space civilization game.

I agree with what some of the members say when they think we as a race simply aren't ready. But we have to look at exactly what spawns selfish behavior and that is fear. We fear things we don't understand. If we let the world in on the wisdom of a greater plan, they might start to turn around. Then hopefully they might learn, and evolve.

When you first start meditating, getting into self-awareness / mind-self diagnostic, you start to see how much fear you really possess. Fear of physical pain, emotional pain, fear of unwanted activity or use of energy, fear of love, fear of communication, fear of perception - that is.. wanting to blind yourself to your environment, to not see what you know is there, and fear of wisdom - for we know that it will bring upon a change perhaps some of us aren't ready for, to take on new responsibility because now we know better, that is... saying "well I didn't know", is no longer an excuse for our errors.

Through my own efforts over the years I have found the cause of many fears and doubts to the point where I can't begin to identify with the thought process I once possessed.

I started to understand - so I no longer feared. I started to care, then i started to get motivated. Now I am ready for more responsibility, and I am more then eager to help.


Therefore in my opinion, one way we can implement the plan GL2 has suggested, is to educate the public, to give them the knowledge, and hopefully help them understand. Then, maybe they'll come to a greater realization, and finally start to care.

I am of the opinion that those who live for personal gain will never find satisfaction, true happiness, fulfillment and understanding, and deep down are constantly fighting a battle in their minds. I mean, once you break a billion dollars, you have everything, why keep going? They just don't understand, they aren't bad people, they just don't understand. That is my opinion and that is one reason that I began to accept everyone as they are.

I think the key thing people strive for, though they may deny or ignore it, is that we all deep down, search for a sense of MEANING.

.........

Let the people know, but make sure they UNDERSTAND. I think their own self-realizations will take over from there. Myself, I have changed drastically, so have my family, and many others that I know. It is possible.

We have to start being honest with each other, and sharing the wisdom we possess.

Excellent point you make! Are you by any chance a channeler, astral voyager oor simply well into meditation?

reply to post by TheOracle


I see individuality as freedom of expression, variety, lack of sameness, dullness - not related (or necessarily) to greed and selfishness. I understand there will have to be some kind of (minimally intrusive as possible) central authority that will assume responsibility for ecological regeneration, healing.

Whether the system is truly communism or not depends on if it is some form of fascist or police state, now obviously I'm referring to the communism we know. There is a component to alien culture that we simply do not understand. They are very psi. As one contactee who
found out she had provided 2 beautiful children for a visiting race of humans planet discovered, their infants never cry. The caretaker is constantly meeting their needs and answering their concerns and questions. Leaders intent on lying would be discovered pretty well on. In a society where the standard was telepathy, and remote viewing the present and future was done by all, this system based not only on planetary conservation, but galactic, as well as being humane to live in does not need a militia to enforce. They're way beyond that.
Here, we would need to look at a social democracy protocol, but with extremely advanced environmental practices. We could change our buildings to more recycled and reuse water thoroughly through filters, as in earthship homes. The free energy every one talks about isn't free. It comes at the cost of the life of the energy in the star system, and from the galactic whole. It is used sparingly. Solar and wave energy is abundant, and some wind as well.

reply to post by TheOracle


I am pretty hardcore into pushing the limitations of my reality. Certain events triggered it that changed me forever. When I was younger I had precognitive dreams, many of them, even past-lives, that all came back to me a few years ago. Ever since I've been obsessed with finding the truth, because a few people helped me see that it wasn't impossible. I meditate constantly and I've only recently become aware of dormant abilities. I'm highly sensitive to emotions and energy of others. Beyond that everything else is trickling in slowly. I'm starting to take off on the astral voyages as well. Once I lost the fear, its as if I became free to explore.

But yeah..

I wasn't always like this. I was selfish, and I hated the world because even as a kid, I thought it was ass-backwards. As I got older my interests seemed to go to violent revolutionary change. I kind of fell into a wavelength that was more then anything, problematic. And I sure wasn't any happier.

I like to discuss these things any chance I get because I know what its like to be on the other side. Sure I live like a monk now, but there was a time where I was quite different.

All it took for me was a small step, to start to question the meaning of things. And this is what I'm trying to say in my above post, that wisdom can facilitate such a drastic change that I think people are un-aware of, I sure as hell was.

heya, I am back. Well, i do not know why I keep on arguing what AI (Artificial Intelligence) as I actually supposed to be a talk about a possible ET economy. The point I wanted to make is that actually there is a large possibilities that the ETs passed the pure biological stage of life, and very likely a civilization let say 100 000 000 in front of ours already found a way to re-design their own species and enhance it by artificial means. Now it is a lot to be argued as a lot of people would keep the grasp on "we are the most special creatures in the Universe " theory - similar with what we did since the beginning of our civilization.
But passing this view , I propose to look at our Human Race - we managed to read our genome, we start to understand how it is working, we created machines that make calculations beyond human brain capacity and we are learning little by little on how to connect this to our brains. So what would be next - re-designing the DNA in such a way that death would not occur as a natural cause , then enhance the existing neuronal capacity . If the intelligence is in the spirit but not in the brain, the how do you explain that people that would damage a certain portion of the brain would have a predictable disability? like loosing memory, speech, reading skills, even loosing capacity to have joy and sorrow. The brain does more than we think!

Going back to our subject, when I talk about an Allien economy I definitely think about creatures that learned how to take the "evolution" in their own hands and speed it up way ahead the biological possibility. Then, with this kind of members in the society, what would be the economy like? very hard to say !

regards,
STY

[edit on 21-9-2008 by sty]

badmedia: You land on my use of the word "centralized" as though I meant Stalinist everything. I was talking about a coherent, ecological, computer and resource-based "economy." Without that integrated, cross-checked standard, it can't be sustainable, a commonality.

The truth is, advanced aliens continue to suggest that even on their planets with integrated, essentially equal standards, there are counter-posed sub-regions that can critique, pose alternatives and escape that Stalinist-like centrality that you fear. It's rather obvious---the problems of one lump government are quickly discovered on every planet. Even within a given region, you need alternatives and protective legal checks, agencies and independents to break the hive mold whenever it begins to choke off critique and new ideas.

Here, at the moment, the Federal Reserve Bank is entirely privately-owned, mostly by Rothschild's correspondent banks. That's where Bush wants to lump the entire US economy. Why do we let the most disliked, screw-up president in modern history re-design US finance DURING HIS LAST 6 WEEKS IN OFFICE??!!

He shouldn't be allowed to do anything significant while he waits in a corner for an adult to come to the rescue. Worse yet, rather than create a new currency--say the "eco," a currency based on sustainable resources and completely controlled by an independent, qualified government panel of experts--a government owned/controlled currency to replace the dollar and the Fed, Bush is lumping 30 trillion dollars worth of YOUR mortgages directly into the Fed!!!

Why do we let a failed imp betray us yet further? Do you see the danger in it? Once again, it makes everyone pay for Fed-Bush mafia cronies' mistakes. Again, to quote another, "when banks fail, the money doesn't disappear; it ends up in fewer hands." That's exactly what the Bush plan is: write a blank check for Goldman, Rockefeller, and Rothschild while a few token co's (Lehman, Bear Stearns) go down with a pirate's ship.

Bush is propping up a failed paradigm--by that I don't mean freedom to choose as you prefer, but the Fed Reserve crony mafia. Let's face it: this is a chance for us to plan a better system, to push it all in a better direction. Don't simply re-assign your mortgage to narco-dealing, child sex slave trading sociopaths! Don't be a debt slave to pirates!

Bush's cronies want this to happen so that we're all in the hole with the Fed, the NWO and it's mousy little minions who keep their mouths shut about the worst crimes against humanity in your lifetime. Rather than bow your head and say YES MASTER, fight back!

Make some noise! Maybe we can provoke others to help think up a better alternative.

Originally posted by styGoing back to our subject, when I talk about an Allien economy I definitely think about creatures that learned how to take the "evolution" in their own hands and speed it up way ahead the biological possibility. Then, with this kind of members in the society, what would be the economy like? very hard to say !

regards,
STY

[edit on 21-9-2008 by sty]

To be advanced I would imagine such a race would be masters of both matter and spirit and able to produce anything by transforming matter (either through mental power or using a physical device). Such a civilization would have all the luxuries they can imagine, the only need would be to have enough of those devices to produce items for everyone, skipping the whole manufacturing process would make a very different economy.

[edit on 21-9-2008 by Dragonfly79]

reply to post by gl2


The problem is (i guess) - how to make a system that cannot be abused ! The perfect financial system that cannot be cheated even by the brightest minds - is this possible? also, as long as interest exists, the private banks would manage to increase their slice from the "eco" resources, points or whatever we decided to consider as currency .
This is a video I like: (the last 15 minutes contains a solution for the banking system)

Google Video Link

[edit on 21-9-2008 by sty]

What is the "European-US/Canada-Japan standard"? As far as I can see, the homeless in the US lives slightly different style, than landlord in the UK.