Americans learning Islam, in Madrasses

In case you didn't know, there are Americans who are learning Islam in Madrassas in Pakistan!

Who are intending to share that love of islam with all who will listen to them when they come back home to the usa!

karachikids.com...



This does not give me a warm fuzzy feeling!

Anyone else see something wrong with this picture?



Then there is this,

creating no mind zombies here;

www.jihadwatch.org...

Which has me wondering, if the latter is not the impetus, for the former?

no interest at all?

how about a thread on paris hilton?

Americans will not fall for Islam because they barely fall for Catholicism or Christianity, etc..

Religion is a joke played on fools...believe believe believe , give me your money.

People go to places to learn religions and teach at their home countries all the time.

Islam is not evil, and it does not kill more than Christianity does.

[edit on 19-7-2008 by '___'eed]

It doesn't bother me. Lots of Americans felt alienated from the faith of their fathers back in the 20th Century and before. They were attracted to Eastern religions and other ideas because of the novelty. I think the same thing is happening with Islam in the West today.

Do you believe in God?

Not to be politically incorrect, but I would wager the majority of Americans looking into Islam are female. Yup, the concept appeals to women. Most western converts ARE women, and they are not ignorant women that took up with the idea because they had a Muslim boyfriend. I looked into it myself, did some research, even decided to be a Quranist if I went down that path (those that only follow the Quran, much fewer rules that way).

After reflecting I just don't feel the call to that path, being a panthiest at heart. But hey if situation X ever happened I could only hope to be surrounded by Muslims. They are for the most part good and honest people. The ones I have met are truly concerned with doing the right thing, they may be a bit fanatical with their verses, but most honestly have a good heart and follow their religion in order to please god and not control others.

[edit on 19-7-2008 by Sonya610]

Oh...after actually reading the ops post. Yeah, that is messed up. I live close to Norcross where two boys recently returned. Apparently Pakistan does not like to let those that go to that "school" leave the country, due to the ugly ideas and all. Pakistan doesn't want reality to leave its borders, they prefer to remain an ally and receive funding.

It was disturbing. The boys' parents are truly ignorant, we do not need that type of immigrant and it is the fault of the US government for encouraging the immigration of the least educated. I expect the boys will re-assimilate after a bit in the U.S.

But hey the US gov will spend an estimated $200,000 to bring in a refugee from a camp in Africa. Wise use of money, I am sure that 200k would hardly make a dent if it were spent on an African village. No agenda. None at all.



[edit on 19-7-2008 by Sonya610]

reply to post by Sonya610


What if, and this is just pie-in-the-sky, but what if money weren't the important thing?

I know what madrassas are about, and it doesn't bother me. Bobbing schools exist. So do those kids. And so do we. Kill them, convert them, or let the mash-up of ideas benefit us all, but disabuse yourself of the idea that we can just ignore them.

Originally posted by applebiter
reply to post by Sonya610

 

What if, and this is just pie-in-the-sky, but what if money weren't the important thing?

Money was not the important thing? Regarding what? Bringing in African refugees? Well if "higher goals and saving lives" is what mattered one might think that 200k would be FAR better spent over there. Save a lot more babies, buy a lot more food, vaccines, all that important stuff that comes along with saving humans.

Originally posted by Sonya610

Originally posted by applebiter
reply to post by Sonya610

 

What if, and this is just pie-in-the-sky, but what if money weren't the important thing?

Money was not the important thing? Regarding what? Bringing in African refugees? Well if "higher goals and saving lives" is what mattered one might think that 200k would be FAR better spent over there. Save a lot more babies, buy a lot more food, vaccines, all that important stuff that comes along with saving humans.

Saving humans is the idea. Where to invest, how much to invest, and when to invest are questions that some of the best and brightest minds are working to solve. America donates more money to Africa than any other nation in the world. American private interests alone have donated $2.3 trillion in the past 50 years.

What Africa is suffering from is a cultural problem. Yeah, that's un-PC of me, but it's true. Populist ideas are appealing only if you're interested in making yourself feel better. "Well, I gave all I could. It's not my fault they couldn't figure out how to use it."

Originally posted by applebiterWhat Africa is suffering from is a cultural problem. Yeah, that's un-PC of me, but it's true.

A cultural problem? What do you mean? Ancient Black Africans built the pyramids, they taught the Greeks everything about math and science, they even invented space travel.

I am not sure if you are being sarcastic, or if you were failing to recognize that I was. Regardless, I am sure if Africa was free of evil white influence (such as those evil white farmers in Zimbabwe that were growing all that food) they would be much better off. We need to leave them alone so they can rediscover their lost ancient culture. They will be so so much better off without western influence.

reply to post by Sonya610


I think maybe this frame of "Western" versus (name your noble people here) is unhelpful

The planet is interlinked. Economies are interlinked. Natural resources are finite. We have to work together to solve the coming problems, and before we can even begin that, we are going to have to be able to count on one another.

Do you suppose that we can buy political stability in Africa?

Originally posted by Sonya610
Not to be politically incorrect, but I would wager the majority of Americans looking into Islam are female. Yup, the concept appeals to women. Most western converts ARE women, and they are not ignorant women that took up with the idea because they had a Muslim boyfriend. I looked into it myself, did some research, even decided to be a Quranist if I went down that path (those that only follow the Quran, much fewer rules that way).

After reflecting I just don't feel the call to that path, being a panthiest at heart. But hey if situation X ever happened I could only hope to be surrounded by Muslims. They are for the most part good and honest people. The ones I have met are truly concerned with doing the right thing, they may be a bit fanatical with their verses, but most honestly have a good heart and follow their religion in order to please god and not control others.

[edit on 19-7-2008 by Sonya610]

Good post, and yes quran only is the way to go. Unless you want to follow 200 years of chinese whispers written into a book 200 years after mohammeds death(hadiths). Which is highly illogical if you study the quran and what it says, part of the muslim worlds problem comes from these hadiths.



[edit on 19-7-2008 by _Phoenix_]

Originally posted by applebiter
Do you suppose that we can buy political stability in Africa?

No amount of money can buy stability, that would require a take-over (more evil colonialism). I think we should let nature take its course. Or let the Chinese have at it.

Egypt is doing okay. I do feel very bad for the Afrikaners, they are losing everything. they will ultimately be completely slaughtered in certain countries, they need to be offered visas and welcomed to Europe or to America.

Phoenix, you know a thing or two about Islam. I will watch those videos and report back. : )

[edit on 19-7-2008 by Sonya610]

reply to post by toasted
The same Madrasses which are regarded as eevil by our press introduced Europeans to the concept of zero and Algebra. The Madrasses hold many great secrets they do not share with westerners because they do not consider westerners to be ready for all types of learning. I once believed that no good came from the middle east then I read some history on the middle east. I still wish women over in the middle east were treated better ,but it is a good thing some of their teachers are working with some of our people.

reply to post by eradown


They hold secrets they do not use to make life better for their people, then.

3 of 4 PhDs in Saudi Arabia are in Islamic Studies.

And how prepared is the average Saudi to join the global workforce?

I’m not a Muslim, in fact I dislike the belief, but I don’t see what’s wrong with “Americans …learning Islam in Madrassas in Pakistan” Is there something wrong with converting to a Muslim faith? I don’t believe in it, but I don’t see what’s wrong the converting through their own choice.

toasted are you a Christian? That might explain why your so alarmed that some American are converting to the Muslim faith – Converging with the enemy, traitors!!!!

Originally posted by andre18
I’m not a Muslim, in fact I dislike the belief, but I don’t see what’s wrong with “Americans …learning Islam in Madrassas in Pakistan”

The problem arose because Pakistan does not want foreigners in those schools, it embarrasses them for the rest of the world to see what is taught there. They Pakistani government tried to keep the boys from returning to the U.S. and that is why it made the news.

Here is a news video that explains the issue better:

www.myfoxatlanta.com...

[edit on 20-7-2008 by Sonya610]

Originally posted by applebiter
reply to post by eradown

 

They hold secrets they do not use to make life better for their people, then.

3 of 4 PhDs in Saudi Arabia are in Islamic Studies.

And how prepared is the average Saudi to join the global workforce?

We in the west make the mistake of judging people by their material wealth. We forget that the concept of zero as a place holder existed in India long before it made its into our hands where we used the concept of zero to accomplish many great things in the material world. I suspect there are many great secrets Islamic scholars hold which if westerners would stop looking down their noses at the Middle easterners they might share with us.

As far as the global economy goes, until the would be rulers of the global economy stop coming up with such gems as Codex Alimentarius it is wise of the middle eastern countries to not be a part of the global economy. That our leaders would even concieve of such an idea proves that we lack wisdom in the west.

[edit on 20-7-2008 by eradown]

eradown did you see WHY the parents sent their boys over there? Because apparently the parents believe that if their sons memorize the Quran the whole family gains entry into heaven.

Yes...brilliant folks those parents. Sheesh.

reply to post by Sonya610
It is a totally different culture of learning over there than over here. Students are warned strongly against bragging about what is taught or who is teaching. When the parents say their children are just memorizing the Koran they are showing humility either that or the teachers at the Madrassa decided that the best thing for their charge was that he memorize the Koran. There are much worse things people could be doing than memorizing the Koran.



[edit on 20-7-2008 by eradown]