Scientists reveal why glass is glass

Scientists reveal why glass is glass

www.msnbc.msn.com

What they found was that the gel these particles formed also "wants" to be a crystal, but it fails to become one due to the formation of icosahedra-like structures — exactly as Frank had predicted.

"It is the formation of these structures that underlie jammed materials and explains why a glass is a glass and not a liquid — or a solid," Royall said.

(visit the link for the full news article)

This is a discovery that could change the way everything is built. Structers could be using crystallized building materials. The article even talks about a glass air plane. Using crystals for manufacturing has been only for science fiction writers up until now.

www.msnbc.msn.com
(visit the link for the full news article)

this reminds me of an old thread i posted years ago

www.abovetopsecret.com...

about metallic glasses.

reply to post by Long Lance


Long
that is a pretty good reference. Thanks for posting it.

This is great... Next time someone tries to convince me that glass is solid, now I know better!

Originally posted by Quazga
This is great... Next time someone tries to convince me that glass is solid, now I know better!

*wipes tears from eyes*

i was having a crap day until i read this response. No offense intended towards the OP - but i was thinking the same thing whne i scrolled down and read this reply omg i cant stop laughing about it


on topic:


doesnt the pure definition of a solid material such that its atoms are blocked? Dead serious question. If my thoughts on this are correct, then these scientists have just discovered the the moon isnt made of cheese...

its not a liquid because its a solid
its a solid because its atoms are blocking one another




am i the only one confused (it happens a lot)

reply to post by Andrew E. Wiggin


Actually, if you were to take footage of glass over time, and speed it up, you will notice glass behaves like a liquid, just extremely slowly. It's like asking whether a tough gel is a liquid or a solid. It can be broken if you hit it, but it can be left to volumetrically fill a container slowly.

Glass isn't a solid. It looks like one, because of our lack of ability to perceive it over the course of time, but it's not a solid...

These guys say otherwise and actually do a very good job of backing it up....

i think what the OP is talking about is a variation of glass perhaps? Because i have seen very old coke bottles that never warped or moved....

reply to post by RedGolem


Actually, the whole point of the article is how they have found what can PREVENT crystallization in materials, in order to form a vitreous matrix. The formation of crystals is often a problem in materials science. though both glasses and crystals tend to be hard and brittle, glasses are much springier than crystals, which tend to just crack along the line of crystallization.

The formation of crystals in metals is one of the biggest problems in welding.

I think we should just consider glass it's own state of matter to settle the argument once and for all

Thanks to everyone who posted.
To respond to several points that were made. Glass is not a solid or a liquid. It is a crystalan. Metals form more of a lattice. The ability to grow metals that have a crystalline structer could be something very important.

Just to make a point..

We had iron, and it changed the world. We changed that into steel, which did even bigger revolution. After that came stainless steel and again things were revolutionized. Now came this, which solves problems that previous three couldn't.

i was having a crap day until i read this response. No offense intended towards the OP - but i was thinking the same thing whne i scrolled down and read this reply

omg i cant stop laughing about it


on topic:


doesnt the pure definition of a solid material such that its atoms are blocked? Dead serious question. If my thoughts on this are correct, then these scientists have just discovered the the moon isnt made of cheese...

its not a liquid because its a solid
its a solid because its atoms are blocking one another

am i the only one confused (it happens a lot)

Glass is not solid because its atoms are not prevented
from moving, it isn't a crystal because its atomic arrangement is not set in a pattern like sapphire for instance:

Sapphire grows in hexagonal crystal structures and the specific gravity is what keeps the atoms bound to their respective structure. Even if you shatter a sapphire the pieces will still be arranged in such a way. If you break glass the structure all over the glass material will change due to releases in specific gravity, that also explains why it isn't a liquid either. Glass really is just glass.

I should add specific gravity has everything to do with how light is handled. But this gives clues to the structure and cohesiveness of that structure.


[edit on 25-6-2008 by projectvxn]

[edit on 26-6-2008 by projectvxn]

"Using crystals for manufacturing has been only for science fiction writers up until now"

Except for golf clubs of course. At least that's what was said in the article.

reply to post by Andrew E. Wiggin


"am i the only one confused"

Not at all. The scientists don't know what's going on either. That's why they're still working on it.

That's why I don't really pay too much attention to people when they tell me, "Well, the scientists say...".

Some people know more about things than others, but nobody on this earth knows everything about anything.

reply to post by RedGolem


You have it backwards

Glass isn't a crystal. That's the whole point. If it were a crystal, chemically, it'd be slightly impure quartz. They're both silicon dioxide, more or less. Glass is notable for not having any crystalline lattice structure. It is a solid with a random arrangement of atoms, which is why it is so easily compared to a liquid.

(I've heard that it's been shown that glass does not flow; that very old panes of glass are thicker at the bottom simply because panes couldn't be made perfectly flat hundreds of years ago, and it seemed like a good idea to put the thicker part facing down, but I'm not entirely sure on that.)

Most metals, like steel and aluminum DO have a crystalline structure. The whole metal, of course, isn't one crystal, but rather a series of crystals, of differing alignment. This has its advantages and disadvantages, and can be altered by heat treatment. Metal with a smaller crystal grain size is softer but more flexible. Metal with a larger crystal grain size is harder and more brittle. Oftentimes, the crystalline structure of metal is a BAD THING.

The idea behind the article is to make a metal with no crystalline structure whatsoever. That will make it far stronger, more corrosion resistant, more elastic, and somewhat more brittle. There are all kinds of uses for a noncrystalline metal.

reply to post by Anonymous ATS


Thanks for the information.
You did make a good and informative contribution. You really ought to become a member.