Pro-CERN or Con-CERN?

"CERN currently has approximately 2600 full-time employees. Some 7931 scientists and engineers (representing 500 universities and 80 nationalities), about half of the world's particle physics community, work on experiments conducted at CERN." -- Link

ngm.nationalgeographic.com...

www.wired.com...

news.bbc.co.uk...


We know they are hunting for the God Particle. However, I doubt all these people are working on that one project. What else are they doing down there that will never be made public?

--- Creating black holes?

--- Studying super-heated plasma dynamics?

--- Time Travel?

--- Dimensional Exploration?

--- Killer Tomato's?

They've been at this for 54 years and all we get is a Radio Frequency Waveguide Vacuum Valve and a few odd trinkets. Where's the rest of it? Almost 8,000 of the top minds in the world and they are just looking for particles? I don't buy it. Where's my flying car? Where's my hoverboard? Where's my gluon gun?

Something else is going on down there. There are probably top secret levels below the public one. What do you think?

CERN. Providing a grand service to humanity or selling us all short?

I've got to weigh in on the Pro-Cern side. If were not growing we're dying.

There is a theory, I forget it's name, that there is no higher life forms out there because every species reaches the point where it destroys itself. One professor pushes the wrong button or one scientist creates the perfect virus or one war has the final weapon....

Life can go only as far as our understanding brings us to our own demise.

Is that pessimistic or what?

I'm getting old and I'm becoming a pessimist. What can I say? The only thing sadder than a young pessimist is an old optimist.

I'm pro-Cern. I want to know if the world is to be destroyed by our own hand.

The big scare is that it would create a microscopic black hole, which would soon gobble up matter around it, growing larger and larger until it consumed the entire Earth, followed by one giant burp.


Good news is that the size of the black hole will be so small that it will evaporate before it even has time to grab up the first atom. The explanation is mathematical and involves quantum physics, but essentially the lifespan of the black hole would be so extremely brief that an atom wouldn't have time to wander into it before it was gone.


Feel better?


I don't. :-)

Pro-CERN. No human endeavor, individual or collective, is without risk. And this risk concerning CERN--the black hole--is probably so exceedingly minute it is like: who cares baby, lets see where the FUTURE leads?!

reply to post by OmniVersal


it would help if you acturatley listed all the discoveries and inventions made at CERN , or which were spin offs from CERN research

you dismiss them as ` a few trinkets ` -which is priceless as one of thier inventions was the world wide web - the one you are using to libel them

also look up the list of CERN nobel laureates - and what they earned thier prizes for - often while working at CERN

YUP - you can put me down as a pro-CERN vote

i am con-cerned however by your ignorance of what CERN has done - did you do ANY research before starting this thread - if so how did you miss the myriad discoveries that CERN staff have made

or did you dishonestly ignore it all and hope that no one else would comment ?

reply to post by OmniVersal


Here's some of their achievements, courtesy of Wikipedia:

Several important achievements in particle physics have been made during experiments at CERN. These include, but are not limited to:

1973: The discovery of neutral currents in the Gargamelle bubble chamber.
1983: The discovery of W and Z bosons in the UA1 and UA2 experiments.
1989: The determination of the number of neutrino families at the Large Electron Positron Collider (LEP) operating on the Z boson peak.
1995: The first creation of antihydrogen atoms in the PS210 experiment.
2001: The discovery of direct CP-violation in the NA48 experiments.
The 1984 Nobel Prize in physics was awarded to Carlo Rubbia and Simon van der Meer for the developments that led to the discoveries of the W and Z bosons.

The 1992 Nobel Prize in physics was awarded to CERN staff researcher Georges Charpak "for his invention and development of particle detectors, in particular the multiwire proportional chamber."

The phrase "odd trinkets" seems awfully disingenuous to me, considering these are the folks that bought us something you, and millions of others, are using right now - the World Wide Web. That's quite a trinket.

The only conspiracy at CERN is great minds working together to further humanity by learning as much as we can about the fundamental aspects of our universe. The reason they haven't given us our flying cars yet is the same reason Krispy Kreme haven't done the same - it's not what they're working towards.

When speaking of recreating the Big Bang the other achievements pale in comparison by a wide margin. Yes, I read their achievements.

My apologies though for the title which is a bit misleading. That's what I get for trying to be clever.

My angle on this thread is, if they are making this level of experiment public what are they hiding? They have to be hiding something. They are funded by governments.

Originally posted by OmniVersal
My angle on this thread is, if they are making this level of experiment public what are they hiding? They have to be hiding something. They are funded by governments.

I've had the honor of working at CERN for an extended period of time in the 90th, and in fact I'm going back for a few meetings in two weeks from now. My thesis work was based on measurements we did at CERN. I can assure you there is nothing to really hide there.

To add to the critique of your "trinkets" statement, besides the many dramatic discoveries in the field of particle physics, CERN is also the birthplace if the World Wide Web, the very tool you are currenlty using to speculate about some evil conspiracies there.

The invention of the internet did not have a 50/50 chance of destroying the planet. I will have to weigh-in Con-CERN

Originally posted by KMFNWO
The invention of the internet did not have a 50/50 chance of destroying the planet.

And from under what rock did you get this 50/50 number?

Invention of internal combustion (already a fact) has probably more potential to destroy the planet through global warming etc.

Actually, DARPA was the birthplace of the internet.

en.wikipedia.org...
en.wikipedia.org...

¤ The first ARPANET link was established on November 21, 1969, between the IMP at UCLA and the IMP at SRI.

¤ TCP/IP emerged in mid-late 1978 in nearly final form

¤ Between 1984 and 1988 CERN began installation and operation of TCP/IP to interconnect its major internal computer systems...CERN TCP/IP intranets remained isolated from the Internet until 1989.

--------

buddhasystem, since you worked there maybe you can answer a question. Are there any clearance levels involved with having access to the facility?

From a radio interview conducted recently on www.infowars.com.

It was said that since they have no idea what will happen, they have a 1 to 100 chance of something catastrophic happening. Using this reasoning you give the experiment a 50% chance of failure or success.

Cut from article on prisonplanet

The world’s physicists have spent 14 years and $8 billion building the Large Hadron Collider, in which the colliding protons will recreate energies and conditions last seen a trillionth of a second after the Big Bang. Researchers will sift the debris from these primordial recreations for clues to the nature of mass and new forces and symmetries of nature.

But Walter L. Wagner and Luis Sancho contend that scientists at the European Center for Nuclear Research, or CERN, have played down the chances that the collider could produce, among other horrors, a tiny black hole, which, they say, could eat the Earth. Or it could spit out something called a “strangelet” that would convert our planet to a shrunken dense dead lump of something called “strange matter.” Their suit also says CERN has failed to provide an environmental impact statement as required under the National Environmental Policy Act.

Pay special attention to the FINAL card - Illuminatti card game

www.cuttingedge.org...

[edit on 7-4-2008 by KMFNWO]

Fairly impotent question considering youre using a Tim Berners Lee/ CERN backed invention (internet) to propose it.

Im 100% PRO-CERN.

Their research justifies the "risks"... not to mention that there arent any risks whatsoever. All this talk of a black hole destroying the world is bunk and doesnt even deserve serious scientific refutation.

Originally posted by OmniVersal
Actually, DARPA was the birthplace of the internet.

Well, the TCP network protocol certainly was, but the Web is certainly a CERN product!

en.wikipedia.org...

buddhasystem, since you worked there maybe you can answer a question. Are there any clearance levels involved with having access to the facility?

It used to be a fairly open facility where anybody could have just walked in (there was a bus stop right next to it). It's a bit more difficult to get access to some locations now, due to security concerns, however, there isn't anything classified there, period. There are tourists and schoolchildren visiting the site, and what not.

"The role model was provided by EBT's (Electronic Book Technology, a spin-off from the Institute for Research in Information and Scholarship at Brown University) Dynatext SGML reader that CERN had licensed. The Dynatext system was considered, however technically advanced, too expensive and with an inappropriate licensing policy for general HEP (High Energy Physics) community use: a fee for each document and each time a document was charged."

The crucial underlying concept of hypertext originated with older projects from the 1960s, such as the Hypertext Editing System (HES) at Brown University...

Berners-Lee's breakthrough was to marry hypertext to the Internet.

On April 30, 1993, CERN announced that the World Wide Web would be free to anyone, with no fees due.

en.wikipedia.org...

Although the underlining technologies weren't new, I must give proper accolades for making their version public and free.

I suppose it's my own fault for not being so easily impressed. We should be creating and manipulating fundamental forces by now. Instead, we're still looking for more particles. It's ultimately a dead-end as far as creating a unified field theory. And we need the UFT to reach the next level.

As far as the black hole creation, I hold no concern there. In fact, I'd be willing to bet someone somewhere is able to create and maintain micro black holes without fear of swallowing up the planet or destroying the universe. I agree that the fear is nonsense. My examples in the OP were a bit tongue-in-cheek which I tried to make obvious by mentioning Killer Tomatoes.

And for the lack of classified projects, I have no choice but to take the word of someone that worked there. I'm sure they won't allow me to search the place with GPR to look for secret levels.

And so it goes. "Move along, nothing to see here," is the order of the day on a conspiracy website. If I hadn't been reading this site for 4.5 years I might find that ironic. And with all that said, it looks like this thread is dead.

I thought the internet came out of computer networking which came out of ARPANET. Which was a USA communications network for missile silos during the coldwar.

What exactly did CERN do that qualified as creating the internet?
If it was HTML they can keep it. It sucks compared to TCPIP as a protocol. Everything needs to be shoehorned and cobbled into it in the most grotesque ways.

I keep hearing that CERN created the internet.

Who Invented the Internet FAQ ?

Oh and I forgot to mention it. The U.N. invented peace.

Please feel free to revise your well trained grasp of revisionist history.

My point was not to downplay CERN achievements. But that was a good way to take the thread off topic. The point was to speculate on the possibility of there being far more achievements that are kept from the public. The US has secret projects, why not the EU? And CERN would be a good cover.

People would rather get their feathers ruffled and defend the status quo of the scientific community. I say the scientists are far smarter than what is allowed. Which means I'm giving them more credit than those here that defend the public projects. The irony of that is not lost on me.

Pro-CERN.

I think until we understand matter truly we will just be monkeys playing with matches.

i belive that CERN might not have ceated internet, just networking for scientists to share their ideas, and people get that mixed up, from what i have read. and i'm Pro-CERN

[edit on 9-4-2008 by spaceweasle7]

[edit on 9-4-2008 by spaceweasle7]