Making cement for shelter?

I remember hearing that concrete makes its own chemical reaction due to the mixtures of different minerals.

I went to wiki and found this...

Concrete is a construction material that consists of cement (commonly Portland cement) as well as other cementitious materials such as fly ash and slag cement, aggregate (generally a coarse aggregate such as gravel limestone or granite, plus a fine aggregate such as sand and water) and chemical admixtures.

Now, would it be possible to find a limestone deposit, mix it with sand and water, and make your own cement?

I ask this because I was talking with my friend about the NWO and Martial Law, he was coming up with ideas to live in the woods away from military view. He was wondering about shelter, I told him about UAV's and satellite technology that can sift out thermal signatures. This wouldn't be good in a survival situation. So I came up with the idea of living underground.....

My friend first mentioned living in a cave, but I was thinking more along the lines of making a underground cement shelter.

Using earth as a mold, you can make any sort of shape or wall thickness you desire. You can even make a domed roof to support the weight of the earth above it. This would make it hard for any thermal tracking devices to trace our whereabouts.

I know its a little extreme, but can it be done?

I believe each mix is different. They are rated in PSI or pounds per square inch. Like other things the stronger it is the more brittle and fragile it is to impact. Get a good book on masonry and all your questions should be answered. If you plan to do it below ground you will need to seal it or what ever requirement to keep water from flowing through.

Originally posted by Illahee
If you plan to do it below ground you will need to seal it or what ever requirement to keep water from flowing through.

Thanks for the advice!

I will have to read up on some masonry techniques...

I was thinking about waterproofing the shelter, but, supplies wouldn't be available on hand. I was thinking about using nature to overcome its own obstacles....

If I dug above the water table, I should be able to dig drainage ditches to divert water from rain.

The main focus is to stay out of view of thermal devices.

Any ideas on making a shelter underground waterproof? Using nature only.

underground home

Slightly modified this could be a very nice retreat. The wife and I are looking into this just because the "green" aspect of it. I am looking into the cost of the materials now.

I would ad and additional room though w/o a skylight as a bunker...it could be easily hidden too with a little work.


kafer

This is the coolest looking door I have ever seen

Anyway, I am looking for a way to make an underground shelter far off into the woods. All the equipment you have available is what you can fill a caravan of offroad vehicles with, after a stop at Home Depot looting and pillaging

So basically I want to use nature to provide the needed materials.

Location is everything.....

reply to post by IMAdamnALIEN



If that is the case buy a couple of old school busses and bury them. I think there is a thread on here where several were buried and linked together and made into a shelter for several people. Should be able to do this fairly cheaply and pretty easy too.

The school bus idea is brilliant!

I do not think concrete will block thermal imaging devices in use currently. I could be wrong but I think it would have to be some awful thick concrete.

Also, if it was just you and a few people huddled under a hand made shelter above ground in the deep woods would "They" really pay attention to a small ragged group? I would bet for sure they would go after the guy building a concrete bunker in the woods or a large organized band of people.

.02 cents

My dad had an underground "guest house" (in the backyard of their home that stretched out to the lake) built into a cliff overlooking lake Erie that had a large floor to ceiling window with a panoramic view of the lake. It was all cement but he ended up taking the builders to court due to cracks and water seepage and even though they assured him that the water table was too far down to present any problems, this turned out not to be true at all where there were also "issues" about the cement itself and so on.. but it turned out to be nightmare as opposed to a "dream come true". lol for my parents and my dad ended up spending thousands of dollars more to prevent those cracks from forming again. Just saying that not only is the composition of the cement very important in underground building, but water tables are important too and knowing just how far they extend is critical to say the least!!




[edit on 3-3-2008 by Palasheea]

reply to post by kaferwerks


Old school buses!

Excellent

Now thats the type of thinking I'm looking for!



A backhoe with chains would be able to pull a line of buses loaded with supplies.

That wouldn't look obvious or anything

I think it would be nearly as effective and a lot more ecologically friendly to build an old-fashioned sod-type house, rather than cement/concrete. Good old dirt is a very efficient insulator, and digging a nice sod house into the side of a hill can be done without a lot of expensive machinery. Since dirt generally stays at about 56 degrees F, you'll stay cool in the summer, warm in the winter. Good camouflage, to boot.





Of course, if you're intending to build a bunker to fight of the ATF, Treasury Dept., FBI, or the National Guard, then maybe you want to go with concrete. Either way, keeping a low profile is not a bad idea.

Also, being discovered hunkered in an underground thingamajig might make it far more difficult to get out and get your boogie on.

(Escape or Flee is what I mean)

[edit on 3-3-2008 by Tinhatman]

reply to post by Nohup


Excellent thinking my friend!

A sod house would work perfectly in this scenario!

I will add it to my list.....

This would cut down on the majority of the back breaking work.

Thanks for the information

Nohup,

Wow! Great information! An excellent way to eradicate heating and air-conditioning bills!
"Almost heaven, west virginia
Blue ridge mountains
Shenandoah river -
Life is old there
Older than the trees
Younger than the mountains
Growin like a breeze

Country roads, take me home
To the place I belong
West virginia, mountain momma
Take me home, country roads"

Um... I'm going to check this out!!



[edit on 3-3-2008 by Palasheea]

An overseas shipping container could also be used as an underground shelter, and would provide plenty of room for people and gear. Check out eBay or craigslist I see them all the time.

reply to post by LLoyd45


Great idea!

I love the thinking outside the box!

Great replies people

Concrete is a construction material that consists of cement (commonly Portland cement) as well as other cementitious materials such as fly ash and slag cement, aggregate (generally a coarse aggregate such as gravel limestone or granite, plus a fine aggregate such as sand and water) and chemical admixtures.

Slag cement is going to be rough to find in the wilderness, as its made from blast furnace slag.
Wiki lists other methods which don’t require the slag: Cement.

The problem with using something like a bus is that the soil is going to rot through the metal and weaken it pretty quickly. The place where they build that large facility out of buses was already having problems with water intrusion the last time I checked their information.

Here is a much better solution:
Monolithic Dome Houses.
Or even better yet:
Silo Homes


[edit on 3/3/2008 by defcon5]

reply to post by IMAdamnALIEN


I can't answer your question about concrete mixtures from nature, but I do have a suggestion to point you in another direction in designing and fabricating shelter that would fulfill your desire for a 'retreat' from thermal imaging devices, the eyes of authority et al.

Great book by a fellow named Mike Oehler titled "The $50 & Up Underground House Book". Excellent resource for the kind of project I think you have in mind, written in a common sense fashion, that I think will expand your plan without seeing you lug tons of materials into the back of beyond to work yourself to death trying to stay dry and healthy. A great read, diagrams, resources, short cuts, and most important, he admits his mistakes and clues the reader so we don't fall down the same holes.

Just Goog** "underground houses". Link should be the first in list.

Good luck. Peace all.

reply to post by Irascible Tractor


Great information, thank you!

I will have to check that book out, sounds like the author has the same worries in mind.

Thanks for the post!

reply to post by Irascible Tractor


I can second that book, and I even own a copy myself.

Another old and simple construction technique (if it fits the bill) is stone slipforming:





It may be a bit back-breaking compared to other materials (depending on how you do it I guess), but stone will last if you build it carefully enough. Has a lot of the same properties as soil/sod in that it's fireproof, insulating, cheap (abundant and free in a lot of areas), and will fit in thermally with everything else.

[edit on 4-3-2008 by bsbray11]

If you have limestone, smash it and smash it and smash it into a fine powder. Mix 1 part of this powder with about 1.5 parts sand, and 2 parts stone. It'll be weak, but will set.

Better: Burn the powder to ash. You'd have to dig a pit with air feeds and get a super hot charcoal burn going, and production would be slow, but burned limestone powder will give you portland cement, which you then mix 1 part partland, 2 parts sand, 3 parts stone, for a very strong concrete.

Easiest method in nature? Collect volcanic ash and rocks, smashing it into a fine powder, and mixing it like portland cement. That's how the romans did it.


Best bet? Skip home depot, and hit a brickyard for a truck of pre-mix on your way to your hideout.

Concrete underground isn't nessessary unless you're expecting bombs on your head. Above ground, concrete will hide heat, and take some hits if it's re-enforced, but to stay hidden below ground is over kill.

You'd also have to do all this well ahead of time. To do it by hand, the nature way, you'd be at it long enough they would already find out before you where hidden. To do it fast? you're talking trucks, and even if you get it done, you've left some big tracks right too you.

If you really wanna hide from the new world order, may I suggest running for office, joining them, and pretending to be on their side until you die of old age?