Martial Law: Getting Away

Sorry, this OP doesn't offer you any expert or specific tips on how to get away during a martial law, economic collapse, war, massive disease situation. Mainly because thats my question to all of you.

I know many people have planned for worst case scenario and have the gear, the bug-out routes and made all the preparations. Many people here have stated that they plan to "walk out" of cities, or hump their backpack into the woods and go north. Some have said they will bunker up their homes or cabins and defend what they have. They have seeds and should do just fine. This is all good, and definately better than nothing. but after lots of thought on the subject, I have to be honest and post the question...

What are the chances of getting out if the government doesn't want you to?

There are 300 million Americans. I can probably state with some accuracy that most 3/4 of people will stay put and do what their told during a martial law situation. Some will flee. They might have elderly or children with them and have no supply, plan, or self defense. Some people that flee will be highly trained and have a great plan. But lets look at the facts.

The government will have FEMA, 18,000 police agencies, more than a million full time police officers, thousands of national guard and army troops, full air support, control of all roads, rail, food, infrastructure....

How does one REALLY get away from this? They didn't have infrared equipped blackhawks when Lincoln declared martial law in the 1860's. So unless the people as a whole throw a major monkey-wrench into the mix and resist, I just don't see the lone cowboy running off into the woods and making it. Am I wrong in this assumption?

[...]There are 300 million Americans. I can probably state with some accuracy that most 3/4 of people will stay put and do what their told during a martial law situation. Some will flee.[...]

[...]The government will have FEMA, 18,000 police agencies, more than a million full time police officers, thousands of national guard and army troops, full air support, control of all roads, rail, food, infrastructure....[...]

I also am not an expert on this subject, but my feeling is that: depending on WHY marshal law will be declared the apparent "control" will vanish overnight.

Dont forget that most of the personel (FEMA, police agencies, etc) still add up to the 3/4...

I also realize the tech supremacy of the US, but 300mi people is a lot to be fully herded in a marshal law situation.

Remember, it took 5 days for FEMA to bring WATER to New Orleans. Dig it?

Oh, and the "lone cowboy" will not bring attention to him, as long as he's just surviving out there in the wild.

Peace

[edit on 9-1-2008 by Sator]

If a person really wanted to make sure that they would survive martial law, I would advise them to leave the city ASAP. Sure, you may make a little less money and not have some of the luxuries out of the developed areas but at least you will stand a better chance at surviving Situation X.

If you decide to stay in the city you must realize a few things:

-The food supply in most larger cities will only last a few days at the very most. Once people start to starve they will listen to anything the government has to say. If people decide to find their own food and supplies guess who may be standing betwen them and what they want?

-There are not a lot of places to hide in the cities. Sure, you could underground, but eventually food and water will run out and you will be forced to surface.

-A lot of the major cities have heavy restrictions on firearms...meaning even if you try and make a stand you will be at a definite disadvantage.

If you are planning on moving out of the city do not put it off any longer. Things are looking worse every day and there are a lot of things that you should learn to do before it all happens.

One thing that people overlook is that just because the Army/National Guard has X amount of people, it does not mean that X amount are going to fight against their own people. Of course some would but soldiers are not robots that do the government's every bidding.

Best of luck to you!

I can't remember the guys name but a year or two ago there was a fugive back east, I'm thinking it was West virginia, or North carolina or some where equaly populated with minimal widerness. In any event this lone fugitive took to the woods to escape capture. This " survivalist type" according to the news services, managed to elude capture for many months, against the combined resources of several state, county, and federal law enforcement agencies.
The " lone cowboy" does indeed stand a very good chance IF ( and thats a huge qualifier) he or she knows what he/she is doing.

Why would we just assume that martial law is a bad thing? Who gave us this idea and what was their agenda? Can there be any reason that martial law can and should be imposed, and we would welcome it?

Now I thought about this for a couple of days so I didn't just make up my position and try to defend it. There was a need to step back and see things as an observer from both sides. Here are a couple of scenarios where it should be followed and welcomed.

Broken Arrow:
A nuke or other device is in close proximity to a large population. It is likely to be recovered, but any choice of the populace to flee would disrupt that chance and move a larger number of potential victims closer to ground zero. I'm good with this one and if they want me to walk away in the opposite direction i'm good with that too.

Unknown Viral Outbreak:
A virus has started to spread killing its victims in just a couple of hours. It has been isolated but all traffic has to be stopped for a short while to determine it has been contained. I'm good here too. I will be taping plastic over the windows and doors and listening close to the news till its under control.

Terrorist oil tanker:
A two part chemical weapon has been found on a tanker that has just docked in a port city. They intend to open the valves and let the chemicals mix Creating a toxic cloud to kill the port city. Same here. duct tape making its classic noise.

The point is there are numerous reasons we could be asked to stay home, that are for our own benefit. More importantly there may be a good reason in that the media could reach everyone and keep them informed, should they need to begin moving in one direction or another. Also depending on the situation there could be a need for a large number of civilian volunteers to assist with the crisis, and the media could relay this.

In sitX? They are not going to be there to impose martial law. People in Katrina slept on thier roofs for days and we had the entire country to draw services from. In sit X no one is coming to help. In fact they may not even announce that they have all left and your on your own.

Just a differing point of view but one that should be mentioned.

and please do not forget all major cities w/in each state has a by-pass or perimeter and the city can easily be cut off and the cctv surveillance cameras going into and out of each city is absolutely necessary to control.

reply to post by Illahee


I have said this before and will say it again....the NWO and martial law wouldnt be so bad if the people in charge actually had good inentions in mind and werent only looking after their cash and assets. There is a difference from instilling martial law to protect the interests of the elites than calling upon it to protect the citizens of this country from disasters.
Those situations will never come to pass and that is largely due to the fact that we spend so much money on spie like operations and have an entire government agency which has been setting up connections all over the world since its inception. YOu know.....the CIA
The specific job of NOC agents is to go out into the field and establish your own assets and contacts. These can come from anywhere and its this practice i feel, that allows us to gain knowledge about certain devious plans from the beginning or at least in the early stages.
Who knows if it actually works....we should have prevented 911 if it works and in fact there was plenty of evidence i think to suggest that there was knowledge of this even before it took place and that the current administration was warned by the CIA/

Originally posted by Illahee
Why would we just assume that martial law is a bad thing?

When we say a country is "under martial law," we mean to say that the military is in control of the area, that it acts as the police, as the courts, as the legislature. You have no rights during martial law. That is a bad thing.

We know exactly how soldiers act when they are forced into law enforcement mode; and set loose against "disorderly" citizenry.

I will never buy that martial law is a power to preserve the Constitution when constitutional methods prove inadequate to that end. What good are my constitutional rights if they can taken away? No good.

For any of those who think the government will always have our best interests at heart, and that the military will not fire on thier own people, I would refer you to history. Google Kent State university.
To quote Crosby,Still, Nash, and Young " Four dead in Ohio "
If thats not good enough, review what happened at Ruby Ridge, or the Branch Dividian compound in Texas.
Now, I'm not saying all the government is evil, but can you honestly state that you feel the government has been, or is now, responcive to the needs of the public?
It could be argued that Kent State , Ruby Ridge, and the Branch Dividian compound were mistakes, and I could agree with that, But I for one am unwilling to have my epitath read " another mistake".
As for counting on goverment agencies for inteligence I'm willing to bet my life on, I may reconsider if and when they find those WMD in Iraq.
I may go to my grave or hell one day, but if and when I do it will be because of my actions and desicions, not some one elses.
As long as I'm paying for this ride, I'll be the one who chooses how it's riden.

My brother and I were talking about this earlier today. He mentioned the National Gaurd and local police. Well, what about them. They are regular guys too. How long and how bad would it have to get before they just decided to stay home too. Protect their own families.

I am kind of a doomsday guy myself but I think we might be coming to the end of civilization, or at least a hiatus. I am prepared to hunker for a month or two at home (food water etc). if it gets really bad. Then it's time to run. Will the cops and or Army really support Martial law for an extended period of time. All those Army kids grew up watching Red Dawn just like us you know.

When armed conflict arises I do not think it will be with Authority, Mercenaries maybe; Blackwater etc. I am completely convinced that if the S really hit the F it will be roving bands of thugs and robbers who we fight against, as Authority will disband. If martial law is declared in the US and it outlasts 1 or 2 monthes of supplied hunkering and the Machine does not spontaneously collapse, I think the people as a whole might just stand up and shrug it off. Sorry Mr. Government Guns, we have had enough. It would be Rebellion.

So, I think getting away is kind of a last resort in most cases. Remain armed enough to protect your stash and run when it's time. All depends on the Sit X though. There are many situations when I would immediately go straight to Bug Out Plan A and boogey.

The best advice I ever heard was from a Frenchmen in a nursing home in Ohio who survived WW2 at home with his parents during the Nazi invasion and then AGAIN during the Allied invasion.

"Never EVER become a refugee, they will treat you like an animal and care just as much if you don't make it,"

[edit on 15-1-2008 by Tinhatman]

reply to post by 1ShotDeal


Yes, but if it's the same guy I'm thinking of he had 'help' from the locals, in terms of food and stuff.

So it wouldn't be the same thing since there'd be no 'help' available.

reply to post by Badge01


It took a little digging around but I found the name. He was Eric Rudolph

He escaped capture and survived in the wilds of North Carolina for 5 years. All the while eluding dozens of law enforcment agencies as well as helecopter searchs and thermal imaging.
There were suspicions he may have had help but nothing was ever verified.
While his crimes are obviously dispicable, as a study in escape and evasion his is an interesting story.
I found the information at CrimeLibrary.com which has a search feature, but i would imagine any Google search would turn up the information.
As I said " yes a lone cowboy can indeed get away and survive"
Oh by the way, he finaly got caught by being stupid and getting too close to civilization.

[edit on 15-1-2008 by 1ShotDeal]

There are two things in this thread that I think are common misperceptions. One is that FEMA bungled the Katrina disaster. They bungled it on purpose to create a precedent of chaos. They wanted that foreshadowing of Blackwater private mercenaries on the streets of N.O. We are being programed to accept that level of control. They could not have done it in California when the wild fires threatened peoples homes but in N.O. it was fine because the faces on the news were black.

Also there are hours of good discussion on this site about foreign troops waiting in Canada, Mexico and inside the country for the moment when they are needed.

I bet you,ll have to get past Costa Rica to be out of the loop. I like to think that the French will refuse to go along with the martial law thing but that may be wishful thinking.....

search; foreign troops, invasion

The Katrina event was a circus of missteps on everyones part but aside from the well covered inability of Emer.Resp. groups, the UNDER REPORTED sheriff decree for civilian gun confiscation and the lengths regular LE personnel went to collect the only thing people had to protect themselves with was without a doubt a 3rd world, Somalia-level cluster-F.
When (insert natural disaster here) occurs and society as we know it goes "Mad Max," you protect yourselves and your families FIRST. You are the ranking LE officer on site and ther will be no 911 response if called.
The fact that the NRA hasn't fought this one more strongly up till now is a mystery.

It is not difficult to evade heat seeking FLIR if your in the mountians or hilly territory with caverns and caves.

Any mud nearby, simply coat yourself with the cool mud, or bury yourself in it and allow a little room for breathing.

I love the northwest, lots and lots of open wide space with huge mountians and tons of caverns and caves nearby.




Cheers!!!!

Originally posted by Illahee
Unknown Viral Outbreak:
A virus has started to spread killing its victims in just a couple of hours. It has been isolated but all traffic has to be stopped for a short while to determine it has been contained. I'm good here too. I will be taping plastic over the windows and doors and listening close to the news till its under control.

Terrorist oil tanker:
A two part chemical weapon has been found on a tanker that has just docked in a port city. They intend to open the valves and let the chemicals mix Creating a toxic cloud to kill the port city. Same here. duct tape making its classic noise.

Lol, duct tape isnt going to do you any good in these situations

You may think you are sealing yourself in, bu I assure you it wont do you any good

Thought I should let you know

reply to post by OzWeatherman


actually, sealing one's home following chemical/biological/nuclear
attack is not such a bad idea. of course, the sealing will need to
be complete or very close to that.

No trust me duct tape will not help. This is a small control measure we use to help calm the population X.

I was going to post this information in a dedicated thread but I never got around to it.

I tried this exercise and now I feel I have covered all the bases for my bug out route. I suggest you take a look and try your own exercise.

It involves imagining an evacuation in your town and preparing all the routes to a secure area. It is designed to get you to think about potential hazards along any bug out route.

www.rogueturtle.com...