Manned Mission to Venus Dated - 1967

NASA actually planned a manned mission to Venus way back in 1967. If they really thought they could do that at the time, what is stopping them and how far has the human really gone into space without any of us knowing anything about it?

www.galaxiki.org...

Great find flag and star

I need to link this to the Venus thread....

Here is a little excerpt from Project Lunex a USAF plan to put a base on the Moon... the following statement is from the capabilities of the Apollo program and spaceships...

For example, the Space Launching System which will boost 134,000 pounds to escape velocity will boost approximately 350,000 pounds into a 300 nm orbit, or will launch a manned vehicle on a pass around either Mars or Venus.

LUNAR EXPEDITION PLAN
LUNEX
MAY 1961
HEADQUARTERS
SPACE SYSTEMS DIVISION
AIR FORCE SYSTEMS COMMAND
DOWNGRADED AT 12 YEAR
INTERVALS. NOT AUTOMATICALLY DECLASSIFIED.
DOD DIR 5200.10
WDLAR-S-458

Originally posted by blowfishdl
NASA actually planned a manned mission to Venus way back in 1967. If they really thought they could do that at the time, what is stopping them

Money, to put it simply, is preventing NASA to doing things like this. The Apollo program ended earlier then planned due to funding being cut, so plans like the Venus flyby and other things in the Apollo Applications Program were immediately canned. Except for Skylab.

I think the space program has been in a rut for the last several years due to lack of international competition, although, fortunately, this competition is returning. Manned missions are mainly a publicity stunt for the country that does them, so until recently there was no incentive to keep up with the Jones' because there were no Jones to be kept up with.

I think it's mostly economics that is stopping manned exploration of our solar system. That, and politics, as others mentioned. I firmly believe that we have the technology that we could go to Mars, and maybe Venus, too, if we were willing to cough up the cash. It's hard to justify spending all those billions when we have all sorts of social problems that we need to deal with at home, though. I'd love to see a manned mission to Venus, but I'd rather see the reduction of poverty with that kind of money, and after we take care of that, then we can explore other worlds.

Incidentally, thanks for that link. I had no idea NASA had ever seriously considered a Venus mission, much less that early in their programs. Thanks.

OK now i look at the issue of money and then consider much of the information that is available that has been given to us generously by John and Zorgon and others. (whether you believe it or not that's personal and important to yourself.) Also, considering black projects and that the space shuttle missions could POSSIBLY be the "Hollywood" of NASA, perhaps there are aircraft that don't need to carry as much fuel as the "stuff" we know of today like the shuttle and run on nuclear or other fuel source.

Is it not possible the "sing song" about funding is actually a diversion for everyone to go "oh well, maybe one day" and the real fact is that it is already happening? Time? Ok perhaps, too, Venus Express took 5 months to reach Venus so then there is food and water to consider. BUT, again, with "unknown" technology we could get there in a matter of weeks, days or hours. Perhaps we have already visited all of the planets, not necessarily landed, but flew past in the last 10 years. Possible? Yes, probable? Probably not. Just a thought.

[edit on 3/12/2007 by shearder]

Originally posted by jra

Originally posted by blowfishdl
NASA actually planned a manned mission to Venus way back in 1967. If they really thought they could do that at the time, what is stopping them

Money, to put it simply, is preventing NASA to doing things like this. The Apollo program ended earlier then planned due to funding being cut, so plans like the Venus flyby and other things in the Apollo Applications Program were immediately canned. Except for Skylab.

I got my doubts about that. I feel that funding was cut only where NASA was concerned. These funds were probably diverted to black projects. I can bet my Mexican hat that there is something already going on up there. There could be astronauts already based on the Moon and probably orbiting Venus as of now!

There are more things on heaven and Earth than can be dreamt of in your philosophy! (So said Shakespeare!)

Cheers!

To those who've seen black project technology in action, there's no question. I've seen UFOs, both what I believe to be alien AND military/black ops alike... and they, no doubt, could get to venus and back within a day.

Really, I'm utterly amazed at how they keep it secret! How many people are involved with this stuff? There's gotta be quite a few!!!

I guess maybe the "prestige" and excitement of working on a black ops program such as that would be motivation enough for most to keep quiet. You see how Masons behave when you bug them about their "silly little frat secrets". I think, to most people involved (in the Black Ops AND the Masons to a lesser degree...), maybe it makes them feel special.

I wonder if they went to Venus as a part of Black Ops to visit George Adamski's friends!!!

It should be noted that they had no intention of landing on Venus, only doing a manned flyby. This is because the surface conditions of Venus are too harsh for manned exploration. And sending humans to just do a flyby is a waste of money and is an unnecessary danger to human life when they could have sent unmanned probes way cheaper even way back then.

Wow. I am very disappointed they decided to cut funding to this project! It would have been truly amazing. Not to mention, if we did do this venture (as in, we = human beings) then we would know so much more about how humans would handle being on extremely long space flights, and how our technology would hold up. We had so much to learn from this mission but sadly we missed out.

No doubt the money that would have funded such an extraordinary moment was used to instead create more bombs, toxins and other destructive pieces of equipment, that would be used to destroy humanity, rather than help it.

(Think I best clarify that that wasn't a comment on any nation's lust for war or anything, but rather a comment on how we spend so much money on destruction when it would be so much better spent, as DragonsDemesne mentioned, on things such as poverty, or hunger, or disease on Earth, or bettering our knowledge of the space around us, IMHO)

But, seriously, we all need a little space exploration in our life, right?

[edit on 3-12-2007 by Toy_soldier]

Good find. Starred.

LOLZ at a manned mission to a (presumably) boiling pit of sulphur (?). Who's laughing at John, now?

Wiki says the surface temperature is over 460° C (860° F), making Venus' surface hotter than Mercury's. The melting point of Lead is 621.43 °F.


Edit: ETF on the flyby, agree with both points; why a manned flyby?

I'm still not buying the whole John Lear thing, but this has an element of strangeness.









[edit on 3-12-2007 by Badge01]

Originally posted by Badge01
Good find. Starred.

LOLZ at a manned mission to a (presumably) boiling pit of sulphur (?). Who's laughing at John, now?

I am. They were not going to land on Venus (surface conditions are too harsh) They were only doing a flyby, which at the speed they are passing would only last for a few hours. Not worth the cost of a manned mission for such little need to have a human preform the exploration. Better to spend the money on a future Mars mission, where we can set foot on the planet and check things out. Too bad that will never happen.

[edit on 3-12-2007 by IgnoreTheFacts]

Incidently, (here we go), be sure and dl the .pdf which contains at least a synopsis of the orbital mechanics and the mission specs.

It's fascinating.

Groan. Hesitates. I wish we had a paper like that on Apollo.

In fact, unless I misread, this Venus mission appears to be in support of the Apollo program.

They do mention that the three man crew, no artificial gravity, and that these specs don't imply that this environment will be acceptable.

I doubt it would have, knowing what we do now about long confinement and careful selection of crew. (see the "Mars Rising" doco, last ep Tuesday) for more on that.

I'll be going through the .pdf now and then, but if you find anything interesting, feel free to post it.

They were a little concerned about the high speed return velocity and there were some minor things which I failed to jot down.

Again, flagged and starred - super find, incl the pdf.


[edit on 3-12-2007 by Badge01]

While it doesn't amaze me that people would jump on this assumption train, it does perplex me at how a fly by could be confused with a landing.

It's a good thing ignorethefacts is here, otherwise more people would...er...ignore the facts.

IMO it is and would have been a monumental waste of funding to even fly by Venus with anything but unmanned craft. I too feel Mars is and should be the target.

Originally posted by jra
Money, to put it simply, is preventing NASA to doing things like this.

LOL well not all projects in space are NASA... this is a mistake many assume...

Project Lunex was NOT NASA it was USAF... Clementine was US NAVY and DOD, NASA only ran mission control...

And as to money... well what about the 3.5 TRILLION missing from the treasury? Seems to me you could fund a LOT of missions from a small percentage of that...

What really gets me is that Americans are not storming Washington to demand answers as to where this money went... Have we become so pathetic?

Funny thing... this money missing money was revealed Sept 10th, 2001... anyone want to take a guess at where the records and investigation team was housed at the Pentagon?



Do Black Budget Trillions Support A Secret American Space Program?
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Originally posted by DragonsDemesne
I'd love to see a manned mission to Venus, but I'd rather see the reduction of poverty with that kind of money, and after we take care of that, then we can explore other worlds.

No offense but statements like this really irk me... the few buck (relatively speaking) that is publicly admitted to in NASA budgets has more than paid for itself in offshoot technology and specifically in medical research that has already helped those starving people. Also if you are going to wipe out poverty it means more people on earth adding to the population issues... so we better get our butts moving and find potential places where all these billions can live...

What do you think will happen when we feed and keep people healthier and living longer and Earth's population doubles and triples in the next few generations? More people will die in wars and catastrophies simply due to over crowding...

Now having said that... and in light of the TRILLIONS that your government has LOST that NO ONE seems to care about.... a few billion is a mere drop in the bucket...

Then add the BILLIONS that our "war' in Iraq is costing... and please remind me... which COUNTRY is our 'enemy' in that war?

So get your buddies together and lobby Washington to account for that missing money and take a real hard look at DOD and other agencies wasteful spending and leave the scraps the space program gets alone...


OH and BTW... forget NASA for a moment... anyone have ANY idea how much money goes into the US SPACE COMMAND?

Everyone here who knows me knows I have beefs with NASA, but its not all NASA's fault...


Space Command's Mission Statement

The Space Force Mission is to defend the United States through the control and exploitation of space. Air Force Space Command makes space reliable to the warfighter (i.e. forces personnel) by continuously improving the command's ability to provide and support combat forces — assuring their access to space.

Space Command Build Up

Space Command Units

"The establishment of Space Command is a crucial milestone in
the evolution of military space operations. Space is a place--like
land, sea, and air--a theater of operations. And it was just a matter
of time until space was treated as such."
~ General James V. Hartinger, 1 September 1982

Beginning in the mid-1980s, concurrent with the development of space operations and space engineering curricula at the Naval Postgraduate School, the Navy began “coding” officers as space subspecialists. As space subspecialty codes were then assigned to particular officers’ billets on numbered Fleet staffs and at commands ashore, the service began assigning Navy members with matching codes to those positions. More recently, the Navy has begun efforts to build a cadre of “space smart” officers, enlisted personnel and civilian employees.

The Naval Space Cadre is composed of active-duty and reserve Navy and Marine Corps officers and enlisted personnel, along with Navy civilian employees from a wide range of career fields who meet mandatory education, training and experience standards established for a particular certification level. The Navy Space Cadre is a distinct body of expertise horizontally and vertically integrated within Navy and Marine Corps active duty, reserves and civilian employee communities organized to operationalize space

Initial identification of the cadre began in mid-2001 with the standup of the Naval Space Cadre Working Group and culminated in a naval message (NAVADMIN 201/03 DTG211435Z JUL 03) announcing the first 700 officer members of the cadre. These officers were identified by the subspecialty codes of 6206, Space Systems Operations, and 5500, Space Systems Engineering or by the additional qualification designator of VS1, VS2, VS3 or VS4. Identification of enlisted and civilian cadre members is more challenging, as these groups do not have specif?ic space identifiers like the officers do.

Approximately 265 billets are currently identified as space billets. These jobs are in Navy, joint and National Security Space organizations. Space cadre members are currently assigned throughout the National Security Space arena, including the National Reconnaissance Office, National Security Space Architect, National Security Space Integration, MILSATCOM Joint Program Office, as well as in all Navy organizations that deal with space.

High Frontier
The Journal for Space and Missile Professionals
Summer 2004

NASA is the 'fall guy" The cover story.... the ones who show the people pretty pictures and glorious adventures to keep attention away from whats really going on...

You can call me crazy now, but I will expect your apology when the truth comes out



[edit on 3-12-2007 by zorgon]

Originally posted by shearderPossible? Yes, probable? Probably not. Just a thought.

"We already have the means to travel among the stars, but these technologies are locked up in black projects and it would take an act of God to ever get them out to benefit humanity. Anything you can imagine we already know how to do."

Ben Rich
Former head of Lockheed Skunk Works at his retirement speech...
(he died shortly after he retired)

Originally posted by zorgon
"We already have the means to travel among the stars, but these technologies are locked up in black projects and it would take an act of God to ever get them out to benefit humanity. Anything you can imagine we already know how to do."

Ben Rich
Former head of Lockheed Skunk Works at his retirement speech...
(he died shortly after he retired)

Do you have a link to this quote anywhere? That's quite a claim. I've searched the web with no luck, and I'm not about to buy his auto-bio.

Originally posted by indierockalien
I wonder if they went to Venus as a part of Black Ops to visit George Adamski's friends!!!

No they are making deals with Val Thor, naturally.... Its funny though how people forget... That is one way they keep secrets....

But don't forget the most powerful one... its not ego or 'feeling special' its loyalty and duty...

Imagine for a minute that you are assigned to a duty that would involve clearance required to view ships capable of interplanetary travel... (never mind aliens for a moment, but same applies)

First... before there is any question of you getting clearance you will be screened, your loyalty tested and you will sign documents of non disclosure that make it very clear what can happen if you break that oath (IE getting charged with treason for revealing secrets of National Security) This is why people only talk AFTER they retire and even then some disclosure documents follow you to the grave...

Second... Once you are in that position, your honor loyalty and duty rule the day... America prides itself (its in all our movies) of how hard it is to break our guys even in the event of torture.... you MAY get 'name rank and serial number" out of them...

There is more but really do I need to spell it out? Does anyone seriously think they would place people with the gift of gab in such positions?

A friend of mine was on an exercise... a false flag attack... the buildings were all blacked out and no one inside could see anything... He was told to stand guard outside... He tells of a huge black triangular craft ...

In his words...

During war games at Hill AFB, Utah, I was standing out on the flightline, guarding the perimeter, the entry-access control point. The rest of the base was in black out conditions, with black plastic over the windows of the buildings. All of the sudden, an aircraft or an airship was above me, of unknown origin. It was the biggest aircraft I have ever seen, completely
silent and moved approximately ten miles an hour, almost floating. It was triangular, no visible engines, no markings, gun metal black. It
essentially looked like it could fly in space. And when it accelerated, it leaped frog; that it is to say, it blinked out and reappeared farther away. It basically disappeared when it accelerated.

This was many years ago... he never told anyone... shortly after he received a big promotion in Space Command... (he is retired now)

We are pretty sure this was a test of loyalty.... he passed... ( and even today this is the only story he tells...)


As to Venus...

1962
Tibetan Monk write " My trip to Venus"

1957
Three Venusians: Jill, Donn and Valiant Thor landed in Virginia in 1957. They were apprehended by Police officers and were escorted to Washington D.C. to speak with the Secretary of Defense. Soon police from every conceivable district and agency had joined in, all trying to claim their right to escort them to President Dwight D. Eisenhower. Val Thor was the commander of a spaceship with a crew of about 200. It was believed that his ship eventually ended up in the Lake Mead area before it disappeared below the surface. Nixon allegedly met Val Thor. A man named Frank Stranges claims that he keeps contact with Valiant and Crew.



More 'Visitors"
www.astrosciences.info...

reply to post by Bryan Thornsberry


The only source I was able to find for any sort of speech:

www.wvi.com...

It kinda' looks shady. Not to mention it's not his own retirement but that of the SR-71.


[edit on 3-12-2007 by Donoso]

Originally posted by IgnoreTheFacts[/i when they could have sent unmanned probes way cheaper even way back then.

Oh yes by all means lets send unmanned probes....

Picture this: A spaceship swoops in from the void, plunging toward a cloudy planet about the size of Earth. A laser beam lances out from the ship; it probes the planet's clouds, striving to reach the hidden surface below. Meanwhile, back on the craft's home world, scientists perch on the edge of their seats waiting to see what happens.

Sounds like science fiction? This is real, and it's happening today.

The spacecraft is MESSENGER, and the planet is Venus. On June 5, 2007, MESSENGER will fly past Venus just 338 km above the planet's surface--and it will shoot a laser into the clouds.

If I was Valient Thor I would be REALLY PISSED

I mean they took the trouble to come here and talk peace... and what does NASA spend your tax dollars on?

Flyby Shootings with Laser beams...

Doesn't sound like 'friendly space exploration" to me

Hey don't shoot the "Messenger" I don't make this stuff up...

Venus Flyby 06.05.2007
Science @ NASA