Ban the Teaching Of the Koran In

BAN THE TEACHING OF THE KORAN IN ARABIC.

You may be shocked and horrified to learn that in many muslin countries which do not use Arabic as their native language the koran is taught in Arabic...

this is the case in IRAN,IRAK,PAKISTAN,INDIA,EGYPT,SYRIA and all the rest of the muslin countries.
none of these countries use arabic as a commonplace native language.
a few thousand scholers understand it.

85% of the population is illitrate in their OWN language let alone understand arabic!

The kids are forced to mouth mumbo jumbo in arabic by the local clergy without understanding anything about islam.

which is really,really stupid.

The Koran is then interpreted by any Tom,Dick and Harry or bearded power mad religious nutter of the street and distorted and used to brainwash local kids into terrorism and also to control them and turn them into terrorism.

i mean just about anyone with a beard is allowed to wonder of the street and start "teaching" in muslin countries.

anyone

every power mad mullah is using it to subvert young/old minds by deliberate distortion,lies,half truths...

only TRANSLATIONS IN THE NATIVE LANGUAGES should be used.

it's shocking to see people recite mumbo jumbo over and over without understanding what they are parroting in Arabic ...a foreign language.

LEARNING THE KORAN IN ARABIC IS VERY VERY STUPID.

i really do wish muslims would start being smart instead of being always stupid for all their history.

it like christians in the u.k reciting the bible in hebrew without understanding hebrew.

i mean 90% of the population is illiterate IN ARABIC and uneducated.

yet they are subjected to lies by the mad mullahs and theirr eternal lust for power and sexual depravity.

i understand the mullahs and molbees and clerics and priests also rape small boys in their care...

yet homosexuality is wrong in islam yet they are allowed to bugger helpless kids...

they are pedophiles.

why do muslims allow these pedophiles to rape their childen...
tell me.

can someone explain this?

after the lal masjid affair in pakistan all madrassas and hate inciters should be banned...

a national syllabus of normal koran started...

the koran can be condensed into a single page.


"be a decent human being...and .blah...and.blah .and.....end of page...

Originally posted by esecallum
LEARNING THE KORAN IN ARABIC IS VERY VERY STUPID.

Well, their thought on the issue is that the Koran was written in Arabic, so that represents its purest form...a not altogether stupid concept.

What you put forward seems quite enthusiastic but based on what others have told you. If this really is a big deal for you, you might want to try reading an English translation to get a feel for the subject.

Before you absorb the opinions of others, remember...an empty can makes the most noise.

Can you back up the claims of paedophilia because I am the sure the Police would like to hear of it. So... let me get it straight - these mullahs are all in paedophile rings who manipulate the public to politically polarise them in order to rape their children?

I think you need to calm down first then reiterate your ideas in a logical fashion. There is a kernel of a good point here. If the majority of the muslims are taught the Koran in a language they don't understand. This means, according to your figures that 90% of muslims don't understand the Koran, right! That is serious and dangerous for all of us in the West.

#1 What do you care?
#2 Learn to spell if you are posting something about education.

Islam isn't the only religion with problems of leaders molesting children.
And any religion can be condensed into a basic one page guideline.
Every religion has nut jobs that distort the text, and most children don't fully grasp the concept of religion so basically all children recite 'mumbo jumbo' until they are old enough to start studying and understanding the text.

It wasn't that long ago that Latin was used in Catholic churches for mass.

Speaking Mass, in English, was considered a sin until the Pope gave the okay in an attempt to have the church bring in more members.

Didn't hear much about this outside the church.

Originally posted by Heronumber0
Can you back up the claims of paedophilia

A recent survey of Palestinian society indicated child sexual abuse to involve 50 percent of boys and 31 percent of girls aged six to twelve.
source

I think it's just an abusive power-trip in general that's practiced by Islamic men in Islamic run societies. They probably are focusing on the control factor more than the sexual aspect but it's still evil.

The OP has a good point. See how Christianity was used for evil and control at times in the past. Funny how we haven't seen any more Crusades since revolutionist like Martin Luther, John Wycliffe, and Johann Gutenberg made it simple for people to get the Bible in their own language.

[edit on 30-7-2007 by dbates]

it like christians in the u.k reciting the bible in hebrew without understanding hebrew.

i mean 90% of the population is illiterate IN ARABIC and uneducated.

yet they are subjected to lies by the mad mullahs...

There's lots of people here, in America, that are functionally illiterate. That doesn't mean that they don't speak or understand English, it just means that they cannot read it. I don't even know how many are uneducated, or what standards you'd hold up to measure such a thing...

But these people, too, must rely on their priests for a reading of the bible -- and this practice is straight from the Dark Ages.

Functionally illiterate, and yet they are still able to understand the 'word of god'...

How do you reconcile this with your OP?

Whilst I am most sympathetic to a lot of the views exposed by the OP I would liken this to Christian teachings / services etc upto the middle ages and the reformation which were in Latin, a language only understood by the controlling classes.

A lot of the practices / beliefs etc tolerated or even actively encouraged by some followers of Islam can only be deemed barbaric and some of their vindications for the advancement or prominence of their religion can seem quite "backwards" to most non-muslims.

uk.youtube.com...

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uk.youtube.com...

I in no way wish to preach racial hatred or intolerance but merely wish to highlight some of the extremes preached by some followers of Islam.

Whilst Christianity, and most organised religions throughout history, have committed acts of pure barbarism Islam is the only current one (to my knowledge), which actively allows this.
Followers of Islam must actively seek the imposition of Sharia Law wherever they live and it is considered a great sin to interfere in the activities of anyone involved in these activities, (Jihadists).
Muslims subsequently make little or no effort to integrate and thus become isolated in their own areas within population centres and are then naturally treat with suspicion by others (or kaffirs as they themselves call us).

The teaching and subsequent interpratation of The Koran by a select few may indeed be helping to maintain current beliefs and practices.

Islam, imo, seems to be at a stage not too disimilair to Christianity was 500-600 years ago.

A step in the right direction may indeed be teaching etc in local languages, but there seems to be little hope of concilliation between Muslims and Non-Muslims at present and I fear a major confrontation is inevitable.

Organised religion of any kind is the bane of mankind and may literally be the death of us all.

Originally posted by Freeborn.
A lot of the practices / beliefs etc tolerated or even actively encouraged by some followers of Islam can only be deemed barbaric and some of their vindications for the advancement or prominence of their religion can seem quite "backwards" to most non-muslims.

Sure makes it tough to rationalise circumcision, the taking of communion, patrimony of the priesthood, celebacy, not cutting your hair, not eating meat on Fridays, not eating pork, worshipping a dead guy on a stick...

Just as you can cherry pick the best parts of any religion, you can also dwell upon the shortcomings, and it's more reasonable to make judgements based upon deeds, not just words. Evil is as evil does, no matter how it's cloaked.

Arabic is the primary language of Egypt, Syria, Iraq and many, many other countries of the Middle East. You need to do some more research.

multilingualbooks.com...

JohnnyC,
"Sure makes it tough to rationalise circumcision, the taking of communion, patrimony of the priesthood, celebacy, not cutting your hair, not eating meat on Fridays, not eating pork, worshipping a dead guy on a stick..."

Hardly compares to honour killings, wife beating and female mutilation and humiliation but yes, I agree, the doctrines of Christianity can also seem baffling.

I merely wished to point out that;
a) Some of the teachings of the Islamic faith seem quite barbaric by current "western" standards.
b) Islamic faith seems to be at a point of development similar to Christianity was about 500 - 600 years ago.
c) Islamic preaching of imposing Sharia Law and Muslim isolationism fosters mistrust.
d) We appear to be heading headlong towards a major confrontation between Muslims and Non-Muslims.
e) Organised religion, of any kind, is detrimental to the continued development of mankind.

I respect, and will support, any persons right to believe what they want to believe but I will actively fight against ANY attempt to impose their beliefs upon me.

Freeborn, how many Muslims have you met? They're quite nice actually...... Christianity also demands spreading the word, but most just don't bother, same with Muslims. Integration not humiliation is the key, like us, most of them like to be left to get on with it, but in my country (UK), there is terrible young male Muslim unemployment, and stuff like that does not help. As long as they feel that they can get on with it, like us, they will do just that. They are not at all barbarous, they saved the knowledge of maths from the rampaging early Roman Christians. There are extremists, but as I see it, the No.1 extremist in the world is currently the President of a very powerful country........... less than 18 months to go.........

Originally posted by Freeborn
Followers of Islam must actively seek the imposition of Sharia Law wherever they live and it is considered a great sin to interfere in the activities of anyone involved in these activities, (Jihadists).
Muslims subsequently make little or no effort to integrate and thus become isolated in their own areas within population centres and are then naturally treat with suspicion by others (or kaffirs as they themselves call us).

By doing some research outside of standardized history books and news reports, you'd realize that your blanket statements are only about the fundamentalist Muslims.

Not every follower of Islam actively works to bring the Sharia Law to every place on earth. Again, those are the fundamentalists. One example that comes to mind is The Moderate Martyr -- which is quite insightful with regards to the Islamic faith, and how there are those within the religion who not only disagree, but are actively working TO CHANGE the doctrines.

There are Muslims all over the world. But we don't hear about them, because they're not starting crap. The *fundamentalists* are, and it's *those* people who are of major concern -- not every Muslim.


Be careful with blanket statements -- they tend to smother the truth.

Redled, I live in a town in North East England; I know numerous Muslims and yes, not all of them are barbaric.
I have NEVER stated that, just that SOME of the teachings are barbaric when judged by current western standards.
I am also aware that when Christianity was at it's most repressive Muslims were considered quite enlightened for their times. However, their beliefs seem to have been twisted and turned into the most unsympathetic and uncomprimising religion. Islam seems to have regressed to a level not too dissimilar to Christianity 500 - 600 years ago.
Christianity does not state that a believer MUST actively work towards converting the world to Christianity or imposing legal and education systems based solely on extreme interpretations of some Christain teachings.

Yes, integration is the key, but the brand of Islam now being preached states that only minimal contact with "kaffirs" is allowed.
As a result of this, and the PC brigades softly softly approach, has allowed no go areas for white or non-muslims to crop up all over north western England. Imagine the uproar if a no go area for Asians was imposed anywhere in the UK, there would be uproar.

I know it's a cliche but it's true; Not all Muslims are terrorists but all terrorists, (currently in the UK), are Muslims. That is an undeniable fact.

I left school in 1982 and, as stated before, living in a North Eastern English town I lived through the worst of the Thatcher years and experienced the worst of her policies. I never once used unemployment as an excuse to murder innocent people so that excuse just does not wash at all.
I have never used my religion, (I was christened and brought up in the Roman Catholic faith, the largest religous minority in Britain and the only one banned outright by law to hold certain political offices and royal titles!), to murder innocent people so that excuse does not wash either.

As I have stated before, I believe organised religion, of ANY kind, (including Roman Catholicism), to truly be the bane of mankind and it, and the people who control it, are leading us headlong into a confrontation that could have devastating effects on the whole of mankind.

Diseria,
I would never tar all Muslims with the same brush however, it is a fact that the brand of Islam that is gaining more and more support and exposure (for several reasons), are "fundamentals".

Most of the links I provided are from Saudi TV shows, supposedly our allies, others are easily viewable on youtube and come from Egypt, Lebanon, etc.

I have an intense dislike of ALL organised religions but the worst acts of discrimination against any religion is that that is occurring at present in a lot of Muslim countries. Excuse me for not providing links, I will if necessary.

I have read The Koran to try to give me a better understanding of Islam and the followers of Islam's cares and concerns and, to get back to the OP's initial statement, a lot of it is down to interpretation and understanding of a work of literature, (Muslims believe it to be the actual words of Mohammed), which is wriitten in a language they don't understand.
Exactly the same as The Bible was used to manipulate and control people when only written in Latin, a language only very few understood at the time.

Please do not try to label me as a religous bigot or zealot because nothing could be further from the truth.
However, I can not tolerate acts that treat people as little better than animals.

I will read the link you have kindly provided and I hope that it will give me an even greater understanding of the situation.

Freeborn, another lapsed Catholic, I share the affliction. Actually the UKCG (that is Universal Kingdom of the Church of God) have been doing exorcisms with mass congregations. I'll leave it to your imagination, but child services were called in to deal with it. There is ugliness in the extreme of everything, and picking on one religious group of people is not the answer. I do agree that it would be a massive improvement no one took religion too seriously...... and the elders preached that.

Red, not so much a lapsed catholic more a never was catholic from the age I could think for myself.

If there is a God his name is John Smith's and he does a mean pint of Magnet and his Extra Cold isn't bad either

Respect.

...a lot of it is down to interpretation and understanding of a work of literature, (Muslims believe it to be the actual words of Mohammad), which is wriitten in a language they don't understand.

Is the language the same today as it was in Mohammed's time? (Meaning, is the Arabic of the Qur'an the same as modern day Arabic?) I don't know...

I do not care about people translating works into other languages, so long as there is a consensus on what is said in the original language. Within one copy of the Qur'an were 3 separate translations from Arabic into English... which leads me to think that a) Arabic is a complex language in and of itself, b) the words' meanings are context sensitive, and c) people who speak Arabic probably don't absolutely know what the Qur'an says.

If someone who's fluent in the language can't decide, then we shouldn't even begin translating -- not if we cared about the literature itself, and its preservation.

Please do not try to label me as a religous bigot or zealot because nothing could be further from the truth.
However, I can not tolerate acts that treat people as little better than animals.

I apologize if my posts have offended you. I have no intent to paint you as a zealot, or anything of the like, and I offer my deepest apologies if that is how it came across.

While I'm not sure about the true 'separation' of humans and animals, I think our sentiments are in alignment. I can not tolerate acts that do not allow people to actualize themselves as human beings. To dominate or dictate morals and behaviors is simply wrong... the individual's full potential for virtue is never realized.

Diseria, no probs, you have caused me absolutely no offence whatsoever.

I am just very conscious that some people will only take selected parts of my posts and try to portray me as a bigot rather than attempting to understand the whole.

As for the language, i'm not sure this link may explain
en.wikipedia.org...

"While I'm not sure about the true 'separation' of humans and animals, I think our sentiments are in alignment. I can not tolerate acts that do not allow people to actualize themselves as human beings. To dominate or dictate morals and behaviors is simply wrong... the individual's full potential for virtue is never realized"

Exactly, hence my dislike and mistrust of all organised religions.

As I stated before; I will respect and support any persons right to believe what they want to believe but I will actively fight against ANY attempt to impose their beliefs upon me.

Originally posted by dbates

Originally posted by Heronumber0
Can you back up the claims of paedophilia

A recent survey of Palestinian society indicated child sexual abuse to involve 50 percent of boys and 31 percent of girls aged six to twelve.
source

I think it's just an abusive power-trip in general that's practiced by Islamic men in Islamic run societies. They probably are focusing on the control factor more than the sexual aspect but it's still evil.

The OP has a good point. See how Christianity was used for evil and control at times in the past. Funny how we haven't seen any more Crusades since revolutionist like Martin Luther, John Wycliffe, and Johann Gutenberg made it simple for people to get the Bible in their own language.

[edit on 30-7-2007 by dbates]

their own newspapers admit that sexual abuse is taking place on vast scale against kids.
also that it is BEING UNDER REPORTED.

rape,sodomy,buggery,beatings,violence against kids young as 5. by the mullahs who run these places.

the police are bribed to look the othe way.

the police are corrupt anyway.

america should get these madrassas banned.

MAD-RASSAS places teach HATE AND TURN KIDS INTO TERRORISTS.


ONLY ARABIA SPEAKS ARABIC....IRAN SPEAKS PERSIAN....other countries speak native languages.


learning mumbo jumbo in a forin language is wrong...this mumbo jumbo is being "interpreted" by fanatics to teach hate against america.

america should stipulate that all these anti-american TERRORIST TRAINING teaching places should be shut down.


WE MUST DEMAND IT.

all forin aid sgould be stopped and sanctions put in place until our demands are met.

a couple of cruise missiles should be launched against hate schools in the night to drive the point home.

these arabs are a menace to western civilisation.

all day their tv stations preach hate against america.

if you arabs want to go back to the caves...I SAY YOU GO GO GO NOW...YOU GO but we DONT WANT TO...OK?..you go back to the caves.

we americans can only go upwards and forwards.

NEVER BACKWARDS.

we are an advanced race and we will achieve near god hood in an estimated 1000 years or even sooner as technological progress in america is advancing at an exponnential rate.

already last month america has managed last week to teleport atoms through fibre optical cables.

in a thousand years we will be so advanced that americans will almost certainly achieve godhood.

once we achieve godhood we will make arabs worship us form their caves as punishment for their terrorist crimes.



[edit on 1-8-2007 by esecallum]

[edit on 1-8-2007 by esecallum]