Desmond T Doss~A humble Hero

(Even though he's passed away as of last year. This topic does cover faith. Please leave it here.)

Lastnight I watched the last part of the documentery of Desmond T Doss-
A medic who refused to touch a gun while in battle. Even after he was made fun of and officers tried to remove him from the military- Later on of those officers was saved by the man who he tried to remove.

During a attack Corporal Doss dodged bullets while selflessly and single handedly saved his wounded comrades. Everytime a japanese soldier had him in his sights his gun jammed.

I was proud of him and was wanting to pass a message to him- hopped on the net and found out Desmond passed away last year. Even though I never met him I was saddened to hear that he passed away.

Remember him and other brave US service men and women who served and gave the ultimate sacrifice for this country, this July 4th.

Read his story here. It will touch your heart

www.desmonddoss.com...

i've heard about him, though i've heard that the whole "gun jamming" thing is most likely a military myth. he probably just got really lucky... or the japanese would be aiming at the people that actually have guns... or they had bad aim

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
i've heard about him, though i've heard that the whole "gun jamming" thing is most likely a military myth. he probably just got really lucky... or the japanese would be aiming at the people that actually have guns... or they had bad aim

Or there is the option you've not mentioned, which would involve God. You know, as long as we're throwing out ideas as to how he survived.

During the war, medics were not spared, especially by the Japanese. Think about it -- the indication was a red cross on the helmet. If you're in a fight against a horde of guys who all look the same except for small designations on their helmets, would you take the time to make sure the human-shaped thing you were shooting at was actually trying to kill you or your buddies instead of trying to save the life of one of those guys trying to kill you or your buddies.

I will give you, though, that there is really no way to know if the Japanese who targeted him did have jammed guns. There may have been a couple in close quarters where their guns jammed and thus he gained this stigma about him, but it's impossible to know if every soldier who shot at him had their gun jam.

EDIT TO ADD: Although it's also impossible to say they didn't.

[edit on 7/2/07/02 by junglejake]

Why would the gun jamming be a military myth? I believe it was more then just mere luck. And no it wasn't bad aim either. Over half of the American plattoon was wounded and was under heavy fire.

(But don't do it madness, don't believe in miracles now they don't exsist. :shk: )



[edit on 7/2/2007 by Leyla]

junglejake, the japanese didn't spare most medics because they saw a thompson or an m1 strapped to them, but if you don't see a gun you don't really bother, do you?

Originally posted by Leyla
Why would the gun jamming be a military myth?

EVERY gun jamming would be a myth. soldiers tend to make things gradiose after the fact of a battle (i know this from talking to several soldiers about battles)

I believe it was more then just mere luck.

and that is why you fail in your argument. you believe it, but you can't prove it.

Over half of the American plattoon was wounded and was under heavy fire.

again, that doesn't mean anything.

(But don't do it madness, don't believe in miracles now they don't exsist. )

prove they exist and i'll believe in them.

Originally posted by Leyla
And no it wasn't bad aim either.

the japanese are known for one massive mistake in preparing soldiers for ww2. they gave the soldiers training using... bow and arrows.... to train them in using guns....

bad aim was quite the problem. most soldiers had a habit of aiming too high or adjusting to the side for wind problems.

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
junglejake, the japanese didn't spare most medics because they saw a thompson or an m1 strapped to them, but if you don't see a gun you don't really bother, do you?

You know those light gun shooting games at the arcade? The ones where...Well, I'll let this explain it:



Now, think of one of those games where there is only one individual through the entire game that's a "civilian" and shouldn't be shot. I'm thinking you're not going to be looking too hard for that one person, especially if you don't know they're there. You're going to shoot at any body moving. Now place yourself into a life and death situation where you think those you're killing are little better than animals (the Japanese saw us as such), albeit dangerous animals. Are you going to take the time to figure out which dog among 500 isn't going to bite you as they all rush you, or are you just going to shoot?

prove they exist and i'll believe in them.

Are you sure?

Originally posted by Leyla
And no it wasn't bad aim either.

the japanese are known for one massive mistake in preparing soldiers for ww2. they gave the soldiers training using... bow and arrows.... to train them in using guns....

bad aim was quite the problem. most soldiers had a habit of aiming too high or adjusting to the side for wind problems.

Excuse me I posted this to honor Desmond Doss not to get into a debate with you madness.

Originally posted by Leyla
Excuse me I posted this to honor Desmond Doss not to get into a debate with you madness.

then you shouldn't have posted it here, you should have posted it somewhere more appropriate. the man was a great person, i won't deny that. but i'll deny any spiritual attachments you'll put on

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
Then you shouldn't have posted it here, you should have posted it somewhere more appropriate. the man was a great person, I won't deny that. But i'll deny any spiritual attachments you'll put on.

Why? I have a respect for your beliefs and I won't say nothing against that. But why do that? What will you get out of it? Having a debate with you madness this is the wrong thread to do that. Thats not the reason why I created it. Then I watch you hijack it with your debate debatical and debunking. So please respect my beliefs.

And I posted this thread here because Desmond believed in God. If you don't like it then I'm sorry.

there is respect and then there is an unfair treatment. you have beliefs, i don't, so it's fairly one sided if you ask me to "respect" your beliefs. you don't respect, you just don't want me to question them.

So it was ok for you to come along your happy way and you expect me to sit back as you smear this thread. It in honor of a man who served in WW2.

Thats all I asked was just for you to have respect for Desmond and other war veterns this July 4th. But thats too much to ask for you is it?

Its not may fault you don't believe in God. Forget it madness I'm not gonna be drawn into a debate with you. I don't wish to discuss this any further. Perhaps one day very soon I hope, the madness will flee from your soul and you will find peace.

You have a nice July 4th Madness.

Originally posted by Leyla
So it was ok for you to come along your happy way and you expect me to sit back as you smear this thread. It in honor of a man who served in WW2.

no, it's here to push your opinion on why the man survived.

Thats all I asked was just for you to have respect for Desmond and other war veterns this July 4th. But thats too much to ask for you is it?

i do respect him.
but you posted it in FST. you posted it with an agenda. there are other places where you can honor a veteran. and we have a holiday for veterans, it's called veteran's day.

Its not may fault you don't believe in God.

and it's not my fault that you do

Forget it madness I'm not gonna be drawn into a debate with you.

then you shouldn't have posted this in FST.

I don't wish to discuss this any further. Perhaps one day very soon I hope, the madness will flee from your soul and you will find peace.

i don't have a soul, same as you. it's a metaphor.

You have a nice July 4th Madness.

meh, i tend not to celebrate it. there's no point to it anymore, it's a sad display of either jingoism or capitalism.

You want to have a debate on souless bodies go right ahead stop derailing this thread.

I have been patient with you til now-Since I just got back a short while ago I have been unable to respond. Congradulations you made my ignore list. clicks

Haha, so everyone is supposed to say how heroic that american was and how cool god was to jam the enemies guns and if not you add us to the ignore list?

Why would god spare 1 medic and let thousands of soldiers on both sides die? That's retarded.

too bad you won't read this, because you so idiotically put me on your ignore list.

you didn't want to debate, you shouldn't have posted this on a forum. i was pointing out that you were exploiting the metaphor i was using and twisting it, you thought i was trying to derail the thread (i didn't expect you to even reply to that comment)

i guess darkside would have to take over for me because you've decided to be childish about this

"i don't want someone to question my ideas, i'll ignore them"
is pretty much what you sound like to me.

If I get a warning for this thats fine. Darkside if your have your doubts watch the documentery. I'm mad because peeps keeps mouthing off about something they don't know about- and derailing this thread.

Watch the documentry.

If you all don't believe in God I'm sorry for you. And me being called souless isn't very pleasing either. And since I'm already annoyed enough as it is. And its a good idea not to annoy me any longer.

And madness don't call me childish. All I did was post a thread and asking to remember the veterns. I think its childish to have someone else fight your own battles. And if you have the last two days like I did you would be annoyed too! So back off!

I didn't ask anyone to question this thread- but thats your m-o to question everything. You know it won't kill you to read something now and then and not question it.

And if you can't say anything nice keep it to yourself please because I don't want to hear it.

Mods- please close this thread since the purpose was defeated anyway. :shk:

[edit on 7/8/2007 by Leyla]

Originally posted by Leyla
All I did was post a thread and asking to remember the veterns.

all you did was post a threat asking to remember veterans for your own reasons in a spiritual manner in THIS forum. there are other places you could remember them in the general ATS community, you didn't have to pick this.

I think its childish to have someone else fight your own battles.

it's also fairly childish to ignore someone for calling you out on your choice of thread placement and your decision to turn someone cool into some sort of "god's miracle man"

And if you have the last two days like I did you would be annoyed too! So back off!

alright... your personal life should not have any bearing on your posts on this forum. if you're frustrated in life, don't post because you might needlessly take out that frustration on members of the community.

I didn't ask anyone to question this thread- but thats your m-o to question everything. You know it won't kill you to read something now and then and not question it.

yes, it actually would. i would die if i didn't question everything because that is who i am. i don't accept things just because they are told, it's intellectually dishonest to do so

And if you can't say anything nice keep it to yourself please because I don't want to hear it.

that's not what you mean. you want me to keep everything to myself unless it agrees with you, not if it's nice. i think everything i've said about doss has been nice.

Mods- please close this thread since the purpose was defeated anyway.

the purpose was flawed from the beginning, you weren't here to honor someone, you were here to honor what you thought was behind someone.

You didn't answer my question yet,

Why did god let 60 million people die and save that medic?

How come you consider him to be a hero, while according to the story, it's god that saved him?

Your the one who turned this around madness- Now you got darkside involved. I posted this way before I got annoyed fyi. Not every thread on here dosen't have to be a debate.

lol debates is your nature I guess- it like air if you can't debate oh no ATS run for cover.

Why debate a true story? Thats denying truth. Watch the documentry and see for yourself. Part of it is about faith. Later on in another fight he was wounded and he lost his bible while he was trying to treat the wounded.

Darkside let me tell you this the 60 million who died is a terrible loss of life. War is of the devils work. Even if people lives by one rule "Thou shall not kill." I know this world would be a better place. If there was no war then no one would die from battles and war.

I think there are more serious issues to be debated here. Next time you see a shoe drive for the homeless veterns then you will know why I started this thread. Don't worry where I posted this thread. Apparently its in the right place since the mods didn't move it yet. So don't worry about it.

Verterns deserve more credit instead of being treated like a piece of dirt. Getting their benefits cut, loosing their kids etc. Think about it.

Originally posted by Leyla
Why debate a true story? Thats denying truth.

I don't dispute the fact that he was a heroic medic during those battles, but I don't believe god was there jamming the japanese guns. How the hell would the people that made the documentary know exactly how the battle happened down to the detail of each gun jamming and where exactly the gun was pointing when it jammed, nosense !!

Darkside let me tell you this the 60 million who died is a terrible loss of life. War is of the devils work.

No it isn't. Humans fight over limited resources just like ant colonies do.

Verterns deserve more credit instead of being treated like a piece of dirt. Getting their benefits cut, loosing their kids etc. Think about it.

Agreed.