The "We Support the Troops, but not the War" Truth

Originally posted by Kacen
I think we should just promise all communists their own land, that they can make their own communist country with, load them all up into trains, and ship them all to that land...but that land is actually a concentration camp.

hummmm.... seems like I heard about something like this before.
Yeah, it was in Germany only it was the Jews that were loaded into trains and put in camps and exterminated by the Nazi's.

I think I know how you stand with folks that differ from your narrow view of the world.
No descent, no difference of opinion, Myopic ideology, worship of authority,
hidden racism....to the camps.

If this is the thinking of todays youth, God Help us!!

[edit on 22-3-2007 by whaaa]

[edit on 22-3-2007 by whaaa]

Another pathetic attempt to mark people against the war as unpatriotic or against America.

LISTEN UP PEOPLE!! I live right here in good ol' Portland, OR. I was at that protest and the pictures posted on that BS site in the OP weren't even of my city - at least the ones burning the flag and such. There were FIFTEEN THOUSAND PEOPLE at the protest. There was a stage, and music, and dozens of speakers including misisters, lawyers, doctors, military personelle, etc. There were a grand total of 15 arrests for people scuffling with law enforcement and even those people weren't part of the planning of the protest. IT WAS PEACEFUL. Those pics showing (...) the troops, and the man draging the flag, and a burning flag weren't here in Portland, and they sure as hell dont represent those of us who are against the war. The OP should be ashamed of himself for posting such a blatently biased piece of crap as this thread is.

I take this persoanlly because Portland is my home! Sure there are always a few idiots that ruin it for everyone else, but you are talking about .001% of the population for christ sake! Do you honestly think they represent the rest of us?

``````````````````````
(...) edited censor circumvention.

Civility, remember?

[edit on 22/3/07 by masqua]

Originally posted by whaaa

Originally posted by Kacen
I think we should just promise all communists their own land, that they can make their own communist country with, load them all up into trains, and ship them all to that land...but that land is actually a concentration camp.

hummmm.... seems like I heard about something like this before.
Yeah, it was in Germany only it was the Jews that were loaded into trains and put in camps and exterminated by the Nazi's.

I think I know how you stand with folks that differ from your narrow view of the world.
No descent, no difference of opinion, Myopic ideology, worship of authority,
hidden racism....to the camps.

If this is the thinking of todays youth, God Help us!!

[edit on 22-3-2007 by whaaa]

[edit on 22-3-2007 by whaaa]

I'm not racist I'm just extremely anti-communist...and I'm also a former communist believe it or not; so I know the real deal. I know just how much trouble they are and how much of a danger they are to society.

And just so you know Hitler killed communists too. I don't approve of Hitler's genocide of Jews and other racial groups (I have Jewish friends) but he did a good job of halting communist advances. Mussolini too, to an extent.

But I'm getting way off topic.

Originally posted by Kacen

And just so you know Hitler killed communists too. I don't approve of Hitler's genocide of Jews and other racial groups (I have Jewish friends) but he did a good job of halting communist advances. Mussolini too, to an extent.

But I'm getting way off topic.

Communism hasn't hurt the world so far, so why would you think that it is such a danger to the world that you would be okay with killing millions of people just because of their political affiliations?
As a former communist, you should know that of the handful of communist countries around the world, past and present, none of them have actually been very communist at all...

So, I'm waiting for a good justification of your statement.

By the way, neither Hitler nor Mussolini did a good job halting communist advances. They DID stop their countries from becoming run by communists (in Italy's case, anyway), but they did that by being fascist and making all other political parties illegal.

So, either you were a communist who never really bothered to learn all that much about what you proclaimed to be, or you support fascism? I think its a mix of both, but I would really like you to clarify.

EDIT TO ADD:

So, I just looked at your profile, and you have a picture of Mussolini in your comments section, nevermind the fact that you describe yourself as a resident fascist.

Kid, you're 17 years old. I don't think you have any idea of what actual socialism entails, let alone fascism. Let me ask you something, at such a young age, how could you have already been a communist, seen the inner workings of the party, and then decided that it was the worst thing possible for the world?




[edit on 22-3-2007 by Mezzanine]

Originally posted by Mezzanine
Communism hasn't hurt the world so far....

You can't have been around very long. Communism is responsible...well, here read it for yourself.

Communism did kill, Courtois and his fellow historians demonstrate, with ruthless efficiency: 25 million in Russia during the Bolshevik and Stalinist eras, perhaps 65 million in China under the eyes of Mao Zedong, 2 million in Cambodia, millions more Africa, Eastern Europe, and Latin America--an astonishingly high toll of victims. This freely expressed penchant for homicide, Courtois maintains, was no accident, but an integral trait of a philosophy, and a practical politics, that promised to erase class distinctions by erasing classes and the living humans that populated them.

--From a review by Gregory McNamee of The Black Book of Communism: Crimes, Terror, Repression

what does burning a soldier in effigy have to do with my own sentiment that i support our servicepeople but not our war?

ohhhh
i see what you're doing, it's called a smear

Philosphies don't kill people. People kill people.

There is yet to be found - a system of government which suppresses that pesky, murder motivating human state of greed.

Let's look at capitalism..

slaves

Bananas

Diamonds

Gold

etc...

Originally posted by GradyPhilpott

Originally posted by Mezzanine
Communism hasn't hurt the world so far....

You can't have been around very long. Communism is responsible...well, here read it for yourself.

Communism did kill, Courtois and his fellow historians demonstrate, with ruthless efficiency: 25 million in Russia during the Bolshevik and Stalinist eras, perhaps 65 million in China under the eyes of Mao Zedong, 2 million in Cambodia, millions more Africa, Eastern Europe, and Latin America--an astonishingly high toll of victims. This freely expressed penchant for homicide, Courtois maintains, was no accident, but an integral trait of a philosophy, and a practical politics, that promised to erase class distinctions by erasing classes and the living humans that populated them.

--From a review by Gregory McNamee of The Black Book of Communism: Crimes, Terror, Repression

I understand you can look at my profile and see I'm a younger person, but I think that it is YOU that doesn't understand.

Yes, people died under communist rule. But guess who was responsible for this? Stalin, in the case of mid 50's Russia, Mao in China... the list goes on and on. But you forget that Capitalism kills people too. Along with Fascism and on and on and on.

Like NextGuyInLine said, it's not the process or the style of Government that kills people, its the leaders who are responsible. The same argument can be made for any governing system.

PS, I know its nitpicking, but according to the research my professor and I did at the University of Wisconsin, we figured the number of people killed under Stalin's Regime to be closer to 17-19 million.

I'm not putting that out there though to say, "Hey! Look, Stalin wasn't so bad!" because that is not how I feel at all. I just wanted to share that information.

Originally posted by madnessinmysoul
i see what you're doing, it's called a smear

If you feel smeared, don't blame me.

Originally posted by Mezzanine
I understand you can look at my profile and see I'm a younger person, but I think that it is YOU that doesn't understand.

I didn't look at your profile.

First, you say that communism has done nothing to harm the world, then by your own admission, Stalin killed 17-19 million.

Oh, but that was just a bad leader. Where is your good communist leader.

Castro?

Kim?

Chavez?

Actually, I understand very well what communism hath wreaked.

But, I digress.

Grady,

do you not support the protesters AT ALL,
Or just the ones going over the top ?

Originally posted by GradyPhilpott

Originally posted by Mezzanine
I understand you can look at my profile and see I'm a younger person, but I think that it is YOU that doesn't understand.

I didn't look at your profile.

First, you say that communism has done nothing to harm the world, then by your own admission, Stalin killed 17-19 million.

Oh, but that was just a bad leader. Where is your good communist leader.

Castro?

Kim?

Chavez?

Actually, I understand very well what communism hath wreaked.

But, I digress.

You missed the point. Communism has effected people. I am not arguing that at all. What I am saying is that on a world wide scale, communism has not done a whole lot to endanger world safety... a fact that was addressed to that kid who said that Communism was the most dangerous thing in the world (nevermind the fact that I don't think that he understands communism all that well, but I digress).

As far as where is my communist leader, well, that is a good question, because there isn't one. Unfortunately there has never been a true communist leader (with the possible exception of Lenin, but he strayed quite a bit from socialism towards the end of his life), we've just had tyrants using the promises of Socialism to gain power and further their own means.

EDIT:

Now, I feel that I have done a good job addressing all of the issues that you have brought up. Now, could you please go back to the first post that I directed at you and address all of my concerns?

It's not as fun when we're not both playing by the same rules.

[edit on 23-3-2007 by Mezzanine]

Apparently a global thermonuclear war is not a threat to the world. The Soviets were just minding their own business building the most powerful nuclear weapons ever built, building twice as many as NATO, and then trying to put them in Cuba. They were just trying spread world peace by inciting and funding armed revolutions and terrorists around the world.

From the Bolshevik Revolution to the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan they were just trying to help out. Never mind in that time the USSR was responsible for more death and destruction than Nazi Germany.

The USSR was the single greatest threat to the planet since Nazi Germany. That is a fact. It wasn't just Stalin it was in the entire nations history.

If you compare to how NATO reacted to them we were restrained. Yes NATO supported revolutions and police states from Iran, pre 1979 to a number of Latin American nations. Yet as bad as some of these states were they never were anything like Cambodia, North Korea, Vietnam, etc. The worst offender was the Iranian shah and you can't even begin to compare him to Pol Pot.

Oh but what about the Chinese, the People's Republic was spreading peace and good will? No, after the Chinese civil war that pushed China's democratic government to Taiwan, the PRC decided it needed Tibet more than the Tibetans did. They even sent hundreds of thousands of Chinese troops to greet us in Korea with bayonets and rifles.

They also followed up with war with India, but that came to a stalemate.
They developed a rival with their Communist friends the USSR and even decided to have a few border wars with them. They and the USSR began to play a game of whose the better communist. The USSR backed India and North Vietnam, which eventually overan South Vietnam after we pulled out. The PRC supported Pakistan and later Cambodia under Pol Pot.

After Vietnam consolidated they decided to remove Pol Pot from power in a regime change. They invaded Cambodia and occupied it till 1990. Then China turned around and attempted to invade Vietnam in 1979 that did not work out so well, they lost thousands of troops within a month and hadn't even gone to far past the border.

More fun filled facts the USSR supported Egypt and Syria in all the Arab Israeli wars. They tried to turn Egypt into a puppet state but Egypt thankfully kicked them out and made peace with Israel.

The Soviets threatened to intevene in the 1956 Suez War when the UK, France, and Israel took on Egypt. They also threatened to intervene in the 1973 Yom Kippur war after Israel was about ready to capture both Damascus and Cairo.

On top of all that they supported the PLO and Palestinian Terrorism against Israel.

Plus tons of crap in Africa and Latin America, one of the worst was the murder of the Emperor of Ethiopia and the marxist revolution there.

There's more but I'll finish with Afghanistan. They invaded with 400,000 troops and slaughtered the Afghanis. They used chemical weapons, gassing Afghanis. They poisoned wells. What they did in Afghanistan makes what is going in Iraq and Afghanistan today pale in comparison. They would go into towns, kill everyone and raze it.

Compared to them we are by far more restrained than the USSR. Heck we are far more restrained than the British Empire ever was.




[edit on 23/3/07 by MikeboydUS]

Originally posted by MikeboydUS
Compared to them we are by far more restrained than the USSR. Heck we are far more restrained than the British Empire ever was.
[edit on 23/3/07 by MikeboydUS]

They had the luxury though of controlling the people.
Russia that is.. you speak out of line.. your gone.
They also had the luxury of no media....

Ask yourself, If we didnt have ANY MEDIA What so ever reporting from Iraq..

Would we be so restrained?

We didn't have the media in the Philippine Insurrection after the Spanish American War and some dirty things went on but nothing comparable to the USSR or Nazi Germany.

What happend there was comparable to some of the bad things the police states in Latin America did in the 1970s.

The closest the United States has ever came to acting like the USSR or even Nazi Germany was the War against the CSA, and the War against the Native Americans following it. Even then though the US still used restraint.

Scumbags supporting the troops. Enough to gag a maggot. From the peace at any price crowd.

a few things to point out...
True communism is closer to Christianity the what The USSR or China Ever had

"do unto other as you would have them do unto you"

"Have faith in the lord, he will provide"

as far as the Protesters go, let them rant as they like, as I said in another thread, if an invasion happens they will be the boot licking sycophants of the invaders, then they can be shot for treason after we expel the invaders

I have no fear of protest, I fear the 5th columnists, the ones that would/will actively help enemies of the United States Of America

I somehow think bush & Co fit into this category. they seem to do more damage then good since 9/11

two other things

"No good deed goes unpunished" and "the road to hell is paved with good intentions"

Oh and "everything looks good on paper"

Originally posted by GradyPhilpott
If you feel smeared, don't blame me.

you mislabeled your thread with the intent to attack people that hold my position, that's a smear

and you're the one to blame

and rdang, thanks for furthering the smear. because it's obvious that i deserve to be lumped into a group of people that burn soldiers in effigy

[edit on 3/24/07 by madnessinmysoul]

Originally posted by Mikey'sWar against the CSA, and the War against the Native Americans following it. Even then though the US still used restraint.

"restraint"

With this one word, you have lost all credibility with me.


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