Stealth Ability Neutralized!

Actually, since Russia sells everything they have we pretty much face their stuff everytime we go to war.

We usually take these oppurtunities to steal their stuff, find out how it works, and change our software to counter it. Russia is constantly having to upgrade their software because we intercept it so often.

Edit: quoted wrong guy


? ??????? ?? ??? ????

[Edited on 12/4/2003 by Maverick]

haha and it seems my comment moved the paranoid-o-meter down a little bit! Never done that before, just moved it up!

Originally posted by Laxpla
Exactomundo, I mean, the US govt is even alowing people to know how the stealth was made,

thank pyotr ufimtsov

[Edited on 4-12-2003 by SectorGaza]

Originally posted by SectorGaza
I CAN SEE YOU F22!



radar detection has been always developing faster

Antey-2500


The Antey-2500 is designed to combat aircraft and tactical missiles, including ballistic missiles with a launch range of up to 2,500 kilometers. The Antey-2500 mobile complex, developed on the basis of the well-known S-300V [SA-12] air defense complex, is a new-generation system, capable of autonomous combat action. It can simultaneously engage 24 aerodynamic targets, including stealth targets, or 16 ballistic targets with a RCS of up to 0.02 meters, flying at speeds of up to 4,500 m/s. Improved characteristics of the radar information facilities and optimization of radar signal processing technics make it possible to combat high-speed ballistic targets with a small radar cross section. Antey-2500 can effectively protect an area of up to 2,500 sq. km and engage targets at altitudes of 25 to 40,000 m.

Can you post your source(s) please?

global security and Federation of American Scientists

Good topic and find Sector.
Here's my contention to what you speak of:
Does that system work on a plane? In other words, is the system on a plane or is it utilized by a plane?
The 'Raptor' is not a strike fighter like an F-15C-E.
The 'Raptor' is a air superiority fighter...air dominance fighter, meant to fight other aircraft, not to specifically enter a 'hostile' area, per se', to bomb a ground target, etc.

Comments?

regards
seekerof

Originally posted by Seekerof
Good topic and find Sector.

Here's my contention to what you speak of:
Does that system work on a plane? In other words, is the system on a plane or is it utilized by a plane?
The 'Raptor' is not a strike fighter like an F-15C-E.
The 'Raptor' is a air superiority fighter...air dominance fighter, meant to fight other aircraft, not to specifically enter a 'hostile' area, per se', to bomb a ground target, etc.

Comments?

regards
seekerof

this system's missile was also developed for a plane, i also know that Zaslon can detect targets as small as 0.3 sq. m radar cross-section (RCS) to a maximum range of 65 km and the mig-31s are being upgraded, and think about what the new sokol radar can do!

[Edited on 5-12-2003 by SectorGaza]

Thats cool.....
BTW...the new 120-AMRAAM, latest version has a range greater than 70 KM.....
And in such,the "Raptor" will remain unseen, undetected.
Also.....this "ability" to "detect" targets 'as small as 0.3 sq. m radar cross-section (RCS)'.......means that your radar technician will be having to discern between friend and foe, fly and bird, etc....doesn't it? Just cause you can "detect" in no way dictates that you "know" what your are indeed "detecting"......does it?


regards
seekerof

[Edited on 5-12-2003 by Seekerof]

Originally posted by Seekerof
Thats cool.....
BTW...the new 120-AMRAAM, latest version has a range greater than 70 KM.....
And in such,the "Raptor" will remain unseen, undetected.
Also.....this "ability" to "detect" targets 'as small as 0.3 sq. m radar cross-section (RCS)'.......means that your radar technician will be having to discern between friend and foe, fly and bird (a mach 2 bird?

), etc....doesn't it? Just cause you can "detect" in no way dictates that you "know" what your are indeed "detecting"......does it?

regards
seekerof

[Edited on 5-12-2003 by Seekerof]

doesnt the 120-AMRAAM got 20+ miles (17.38+ nautical miles) ? anyway this new AA missiles range is more then 400km away

[Edited on 5-12-2003 by SectorGaza]

Well...nobody ever claimed stealth was invincible...just effective...and it still is, even with this system.

In addition to just radar stealth, there are far more stealth systems integrated as well into modern generation stealth planes...and numerous countermeasures to boot.

Sure, the system may just be successful in actually picking out one or more actual fighters on radar, and even get off a missile, but I doubt that missile will be hitting it's target...

Keep in mind though, we too can detect stealth...

And yes, the Russians have stealth too...(at least some radar and electronic stealth)...they're much better at the spy game than we are...

I'm more worried about China than Russia though....

The russian KS-172 AAM (yes AAM!) has a range of 400km as well.

Provide the link bisonn.


Sector:
Again, your avoided answering my previous questions, only to assert your own conclusions of more 'evidences' of superiority.....
Going to respond and answer those questions or does the guy at .ru have the answers yet?

Your use of FAS is quite nice but the problem with them folks is that they don't maintain there databases with up-to-date information....in such....again, the disclosed/declassified range of the latest version, as I mentioned, of the 120 AMRAAM is 70+ km.....
Link:
"Raytheon (Hughes) AIM-120 AMRAAM"
www.designation-systems.net...

Also found this interesting chart:
"Air-to-air missile non-comparison table"
Link:
www.canit.se...

And then we are not even talking the ERAAM that is coming in mid-to late 2004.



regards
seekerof

[Edited on 5-12-2003 by Seekerof]

well it says that it can engage them so yup.

about the mig-31 im not sure.



The Antey-2500 system can simultaneously engage 24 aerodynamic targets, including "stealth" targets, or 16 ballistic missiles with an echo area of up to 0.02 m2, flying at a speed of up to 4,500 m/s. The Antey-2500 is unrivalled in the world since it can kill warheads of ballistic missiles that can be launched from points of 2,500 km away. The system is also very cost-effective.


btw what is eraam?

[Edited on 5-12-2003 by SectorGaza]

ERAAM (Extended Range Air-to-Air Missile)

As to your system named: Antey-2500.....
I think you need to be real and clarify just exactly "why" and for "what purpose" the system was built for.
Virtually everything I have heard and am currently reading is establishing this system as being solely designed or intended for "anti-tactical ballistic missile system".

I have yet to find just "who" is going or 'is' producing this unit. Who is producing it?
I have found the various missle producer but not one on who is producing the unit in Russia.
Link:
www.astronautix.com...

Perhaps I missed it?.....I found it: The Antey Concern.

Another thing of note is this breakdown chart from the same source you obtained your "I can see you/stealth" bit:.....range is dictated as 200km.... and gives a comparison between three systems:
Link: (at bottom of page)
www.globalsecurity.org...

WHat I do find interesting is how a source or sources can assert a claim that 'something' can detect "stealth", yet have not shown field test data up to prove the assertion correct.....
Looks to me like its a "hypothetical"...maybe....might can but not sure.....hell, we'll fire it and pray it can....type of assertions. I am reading the .mil site now and they are not even providing anything to back up the assertion......
Link:
www.milparade.com...
I guess this is like the guy in Bosnia or Kosovo that shot down a "stealth" F-117 with a rifle/musket?!?

Yes, testing show it "supposedly" has a hit-to-kill ratio better than the Patriot, but I have seen no other international sources that even confirm this other than Russian sources. ((0.36 to 0.96)
Link:
www.milparade.ru...


Other than that.....I really don't see how a system can claim such without being 'proven' to be such...it amounts to nothing but a manufacturers assertions and claims....

regards
seekerof

Originally posted by Seekerof

Other than that.....I really don't see how a system can claim such without being 'proven' to be such...it amounts to nothing but a manufacturers assertions and claims....

regards
seekerof

Man,

You and your double standards..



When US manufacturer claims something you claim that to be 100% fact..

But when Russian manufacturer does the same you just brush it off as BS!

to bad we'll hit it before anything we have gets in range.

Originally posted by KrazyIvan
to bad we'll hit it before anything we have gets in range.

This system has range from 250-400+ km (Missiles..)

Out performs your HARMs by quite good margin, doesnt it?



*Edit*

Well,

At least that i was told..

Gazas 2500km seems a bit too far..

But then again..

What do i know..



[Edited on 5-12-2003 by FULCRUM]

.....Obviously not much.....

Please provide links to your "double standards" in that the system has a range of 250-400 km....seems that the links I have provided and that are Russian and not Finnish in origin state obviously to the contrary...........


*edit*
Prime example:
Global Security and Milparade:
S-300V
Target engagement range, km:
aerodynamic 100
ballistic up to 40

Antey-2500
Target engagement range, km:
aerodynamic 200
ballistic up to 40


Also,
"When US manufacturer claims something you claim that to be 100% fact..

But when Russian manufacturer does the same you just brush it off as BS!"

Pretty much there buddy....you see the difference is I provide the data, per se', to back those "claims and assertion"...do you? If you do, how about provide the data showing that this system can indeed "detect/see" stealth objects....
Thats the difference.....but as par with you and your abilites to interpret, its branded as "double standards"....

Back your assertions up with real, factual data and you won't have to worry about "double standards"
Talk is cheap, back it up with real, true, facts, be they tests data or whatever...



regards
seekerof

[Edited on 5-12-2003 by Seekerof]

arms.host.sk...

Here it says that the range is 200km against BALLISTIC TARGETS..

But i have read from a magazine that it wan engage awacs type of targets up to 450km away.

Also the this '2500' refers to the range of the BM that is its target..
(Trajectory..)

System itself has range 200-450km..