John Lear. Genuine?

I fail to see where this confusion comes from. If you spend the time reading his posts you will find the answer to your question. He is as genuine as he can be. He doesnt claim his info is 100% accurate, only that this is how all the puzzle pieces he has found fit together. As he finds more pieces the puzzle may turn out to be an entirely different image. John definitely has a high level of restraint when dealing with people who wish to attack him personally. I have yet to see him go off the deep end in regards to self control...more than I can say for the rest of us. He has never posted anything to make me believe he is crazy, lying or anything else that would damage his credibility. One thing is for certain, he gives some wise advice that anyone here researching ANY conspiracy would benefit from! Listen to the man with an open mind, research the material he gives you and form your own opinion. If you have an issue with any part of it ask him. He is always glad to answer anything he can & does so with respect to the person asking...even when he isnt shown that same respect in return. That fact speaks volumes about a man's character

Originally posted by metalmessiah
I fail to see where this confusion comes from. If you spend the time reading his posts you will find the answer to your question. He is as genuine as he can be. He doesnt claim his info is 100% accurate, only that this is how all the puzzle pieces he has found fit together. As he finds more pieces the puzzle may turn out to be an entirely different image. John definitely has a high level of restraint when dealing with people who wish to attack him personally. I have yet to see him go off the deep end in regards to self control...more than I can say for the rest of us. He has never posted anything to make me believe he is crazy, lying or anything else that would damage his credibility. One thing is for certain, he gives some wise advice that anyone here researching ANY conspiracy would benefit from! Listen to the man with an open mind, research the material he gives you and form your own opinion. If you have an issue with any part of it ask him. He is always glad to answer anything he can & does so with respect to the person asking...even when he isnt shown that same respect in return. That fact speaks volumes about a man's character

No one here has attacked him at all, in fact we've all been very civil about the issue.

And as for researching his material, where is the info that gives us the facts on life in all the planets as he puts it in our solar system?
He gets defended to the hilt just cos he moved in high social circles, so people argue that he is only telling us what he got told, but they fail to see that he could simply just be lying and no one has told him anything in the first place.

Edit: Insult removed.

[edit on 24-8-2006 by intrepid]

Originally posted by thesneakiod
And as for researching his material, where is the info that gives us the facts on life in all the planets as he puts it in our solar system?

It has been stated MANY times, he does not have facts. He tells people here what he knows/has been told and people can do what they want with it, its not a difficult concept.

He gets defended to the hilt just cos he moved in high social circles,

He gets defended as much as any good, contributing member would IMO

so people argue that he is only telling us what he got told, but they fail to see that he could simply just be lying and no one has told him anything in the first place.

If that is true, then what is the harm? All he gives is his views, and if its all lies, the only thing damaged would be his credibility.

Sneakoid, I would respectfully disagree with the following assertion:
It comes down to what people believe.

I think it doesnt. I think this is a trap humankind has been in from the beginning of our existance.

I think it really comes down to what people believe they can know.

OUr civilizations have, and continue to, assume that we can know far more than we can ever really know.

You can't know about mars except for what you observe yourself, and only thensome. Most everything else is based on an assumption of faith.

Whenever civlizations stagnate, I believe they develop increasingly compelx stratas required to directly know anything. Those become the safeguards of a collective reality. Some are useful (like science books and bibles and holy books) for keeping us all on the same page. But they have a down side. They encourage faith-based thinking that further increases stratafication and stagnation.

We are slaves to our need to know things. To feel secure in a world view. While enslaved to such a need, some of us will latch on to different things.

We just have to let go and free-fall. And get used to it. Because we can never really know much at all. Otherwise, we are just being insane and falling for the trap that we have always fallen for.

In fact, our slavery imposed by a need to have a world view is part of what has allowed civlizations to fill with stratas and layers of specialization. And now it has been turned around and is being directly used to engineer those stratas through official doctrines of faith, secrecy, etc.

We just need to let go of the assumption that we know so much. Not just me (cause I'm about as pompous as you can get), but all of us.

That's my opinion.
When juries start shrugging more often and saying "I don't know" and when scientists stop pontificating and stick to their data and its direct interpretaion, and always preface their desires and hypotheses carefully, when world leaders look at each others' character, or religeons, etc, and they all shrug and realize how little they know. THEN we will be getting somewhere. But not before.

How can we know if what Lear says is true of not? The very act of finding ways to verify or debunk his beliefs would be a toolset that could rip apart statafied bariers like civilization hasn't seen since the Age of Reason.

The world will only reach enlightenment when it realizes how little it can know compared to what, in this age, we believe we 'know'.

Hopefully the internet will help with that

My two cents.

[edit on 24-8-2006 by Ectoterrestrial]

[edit on 24-8-2006 by Ectoterrestrial]

[edit on 24-8-2006 by Ectoterrestrial]

Originally posted by johnlear

This is the kind of distortion that is in the affidavit. Had Lars bothered to ask me I would have told him it was only one bullet and it was his just his initials not his whole name. And I didn't 'carve' them I put them on with a black marker pen.

I knew carving initials didn't sound right...
John Lear... much more efficient with a pen... and do you really need more than one bullet?

and i have seen freindships that have ended just as bad or worse...
with both individuals being decent people... (they were wrong though)
so I understand, that this friendship may have been the same thing, with some of the accusations being true, but out of context...

Also, I had already asked John about his connections that Lars insinuated as "secret knowledge about John Lear"

and john was upfront, and almost braggish about it (the Cutolo, and Laos information)... so i doubt it is something that lars can claim as HIS disclosure...

You cant "charge for peeks" when you have your fly down Lars...

I do wonder why he hasn't been seen for awhile though...




[edit on 24-8-2006 by LazarusTheLong]

Seems this is a one sided argument, its strange how not one single person has posted
to say they don't believe in him.

Just cos he is a nice person on a ufo forum talking about things he obviously has
a vested interest in, noone seems to doubt what he says? Noone appears to think
he could be making this all up? People believe him wholeheartedly yet they dont really
know him at all. I find it very weird.

Probably time to close the thread mods.

"Mods" could you please kill this tread, just starting it was a personal attack on him.

Originally posted by thesneakiod
its strange how not one single person has posted
to say they don't believe in him.

As most people who don't have a problem with Mr. Lear have clearly stated throughout this thread, the man does not have proof of what he speaks of. He only has past experience and information from people, and he is kind enough to share it with ATS.

.. noone seems to doubt what he says?

I highly doubt anyone believe every word that he says, however his ideas are interesting.

People believe him wholeheartedly yet they dont really know him at all. I find that weird

You are assuming he is making up everything he states and you do not know him at all either, I find that weird

Originally posted by HUNTER1967
"Mods" could you please kill this tread, just starting it was a personal attack on him.

Can you show me ONE post where an attack was made?
Obviously you dont question anything then.
Wish i was like you.

Point is, questioning the validity of a claim on ATS is fair game. It is in my opinion something that should be expected to be done. Why make a post questioning the validity of a member though. I have never seen John once declare himself as the ultimate bearer of truth. He makes his points, and he says what he believes to be correct.

im with my main dude nightboy on this one.

i think you said it all there mate.

ARgh,, ok, fine, our rationalo minds have magic powers to determine what is true or not true based on your faith and common sense. Congratulations. We can know if he is wrong or right. NOw lets fight about which it is for all eternity....

Common sense does not tell me he is right. Common sense does not tell me he is wrong. Commmon sense tells me that I don't currently have the tools to decide without relying on the faith of my peers. I would rather look through a powerful university telescope with a home grown etelon-based spectrometer for a doppler shifted atmosphere. Some other people would rather call up friends in astronomy or NASA to ask them. To each their own.

Incidentally, does anyone know if John has said if the composition of the "moon's atmosphere" is any different than earths?

Sneakoid, I think you have some good points and a strong mind. Just keep plugging away, but take it easy. I'm going to take a chill pill myself right now. mmmm... chillpills.....

[edit on 24-8-2006 by Ectoterrestrial]

[edit on 24-8-2006 by Ectoterrestrial]

Anybody Here Seen My Old Friend John?

Lest we forget, the topic is not each other or what we assume other members believe.

The original post to this thread spells out the topic well enough.

Is John Lear genuine? Is he telling the truth?

Opinions regarding those and similar questions are on-topic. Opinions regarding members other than John Lear are off-topic.

Let's please stay on-topic.




[edit on 8/24/2006 by Majic]

Yeah, and before you take my comment the wrong way, sneakoid, I think your points are an important part of this thread. I just want you to stay calm and understand that your view is appreciated, so that this doesn't turn into a fight.

I agree that there are not many people here suggesting that Lear is not credible. But I suppose that since this is the UFO forum on ATS, that is not too suprising.

I've already stated that I don't trust the credibility of those who claim to be able to determine the credibiltiy of John. Nor do I assume anything about John's credibility (I agree with you the celeb reason is bad.)

So what can we do? Is he for real? Well, I **think** he is a real person. Do people make crazy stuff up for fun? Yes, they do. Is their official disinformation out there? Yes, CNN just aired official CIA disinformaiton on their Bin Laden documentary, unless some people I DO know and trust lied to me. And I am thinking it is effectively a psi-op against the american people and may even be a prosecutable crime.

So is this a weird world where you can't trust much? It sure seems that way to me right now. I honestly think that to really answer this question, we should point out what people who's reputation depends on some level of credibility say.

Does George Knapp rely on his credibility? I donno. Maybe the original poster would like to know what George said on these forums....

[edit on 24-8-2006 by Ectoterrestrial]

I've read the first post ONLY....


I guess "some" people have a lot of time on their hands

Aliens and stuff he claims.. make's fall around the floor with laughter. Did I Insult him no... I just don't agree with what this guy does, There is nothing extraordinary about him, I would like to get that message accross, he's just another human with limbs like the rest of us.. The advantage he has over other's I'm a "celebrity" People believe it quicker.


Is he genuine?, no.. They way he presents himself is classics to people I've come accross before.... The thing how long can you play the same song?
He couldn't have a challenge with me, when I asked him a few questions, I was satisfied, to observe his reactions though. I've made up my mind Not saying I'm a challenge I'm probably a plank..
Ends.....


I'm saying this for the greater good..

[edit on 24-8-2006 by mind is the universe]

I guess some of us care what one another think, too.

You never know what tidbits of reality you might have found in this thread. Maybe even something down to earth....

For all those who expressed concern about this thread, one way or the other, or have a problem with information being posted derogatory or otherwise, or want the mods to close the thread, or think I am spreading disinformation, I would like to make it clear that I would sincerely appreciate it if everyone could make an effort to spell my name correctly. It is: John Lear. thanks.

While i admit i may have started getting a bit miffed, i also feel i have every right to.
He claims wonderful things, things i would give my right arm to find out for myself. Things that are so fantastic its hard sometimes to get your head round all that he says.

I want to find out HOW he found out, i want to find out WHO told him, and i feel that
for john to make these extraordinary claims (wether someone told him or not) we have every right to demand a little bit of proof from him regardless of his stature.

I also feel we all have a right to question something that we doubt, considering at some
point in his life he must have asked questions like we do here, he must know how
frustrated we feel not really knowing.

I also find it hard to grasp with all that he knows he hasnt even got one tidbit for us,
because if thats the case he simply believed all that he was told wether it was true or not.

Originally posted by johnlear
For all those who expressed concern about this thread, one way or the other, or have a problem with information being posted derogatory or otherwise, or want the mods to close the thread, or think I am spreading disinformation, I would like to make it clear that I would sincerely appreciate it if everyone could make an effort to spell my name correctly. It is: John Lear. thanks.

Originally posted by thesneakiod

He claims wonderful things, things i would give my right arm to find out for myself. Things that are so fantastic its hard sometimes to get your head round all that he says.

I want to find out HOW he found out, i want to find out WHO told him, and i feel that
for john to make these extraordinary claims (wether someone told him or not) we have every right to demand a little bit of proof from him regardless of his stature.

I also feel we all have a right to question something that we doubt, considering at some
point in his life he must have asked questions like we do here, he must know how
frustrated we feel not really knowing.

I also find it hard to grasp with all that he knows he hasnt even got one tidbit for us,
because if thats the case he simply believed all that he was told wether it was true or not.

Why don't you ask him the questions you want answered, there are many threads for it... instead of attacking his character? From what I have seen/read he has answered almost every question anybody has asked, no matter how riduclous or insulting the question is.

Search the net as well. He gives some of the info you are looking for in a C2C interview he did a while back, there are also many pages with lots of information out there.

[edit on 8/24/2006 by pstiffy]