Taking the Mask Off of Christianity

Regarding the statement" no religion before christianity", Look at where the term christianity comes from,

Christian
The word "Christian" comes from the Greek word christianos which is derived from the word christos, or Christ, which means "anointed one." A Christian, then, is someone who is a follower of Christ. The first use of the word "Christian" in the Bible is found in Acts 11:26, "And the disciples were called Christians first in Antioch." It is found only twice more in Acts 26:28 and 1 Pet. 4:16. However, it is important to note that it is the true Christ that makes someone a Christian, not the Mormon one (brother of the devil), or the JW one (Michael the Archangel), the New Age Jesus (a man in tune with the divine Christ Consciousness), etc. The true Christ is God in flesh (John 1:1,14; 20:28; Col. 2:9; Phil. 2:5-8; Heb. 1:8): Jesus.

Source-www.carm.org...

Now Bible believing christian accept that christ was physically involved in the creation & had a relationship with the first humans on earth which he made. It now comes down to were adam & eve annointed by the relationship they had with the Trinitarian God? I for one would have to say yes, simply because of the direct relationship that God & man enjoyed in paradise, form the fall of man, sin has caused man to seek a position above God himself, & by doing this he creates religion to fill the void which was left in mankind as that anointed relationship with God was lost at the fall in the garden of eden.

I am sure many will disagree, but I think one needs to look at the meening of words before convulsing about pagon religions preceeding christianity.

Originally posted by Sun Matrix

Originally posted by Osbert
Really people like Curiosity do more harm than good to their faith.

The vestiges of pagan religion in Christian symbology are undeniable. Egyptian sun disks became the halos of Catholic saints. Pictograms of Isis nursing her miraculously conceived son Horus became the blueprint for our modern images of the Virgin Mary nursing Baby Jesus. And virtually all the elements of the Catholic ritual - the miter, the altar, the doxology, and communion, the act of "God-eating" - were taken directly from earlier pagan mystery religions."
"Nothing in Christianity is original. The pre-Christian God Mithras - called the Son of God and the Light of the World - was born on December 25, died was buried in a rock tomb, and then resurrected in three days. By the way, December 25 is also the birthday or Osiris, Adonis, and Dionysus. The newborn Krishna was presented with gold, frankincense, and myrrh. Even Christianity's weekly holy day was stolen from the pagans."

And then you come along and say hey look................look at all the sun gods that are born on Dec 25th.


Plain and simple you are being decieved by the deceiver.

That is not the only thing I said...

I may be deceived by the deceiver(God bless his busy soul) but you are doing worst because you are deceiving yourself.

Originally posted by MorninG StaR 21
The following information provides proof that everything in the Christian religion and in the bible has been STOLEN from other religions that predated it from all around the world. Christianity is a tool for removing spiritual knowledge from the populace so this power can be kept in the hands of a few to manipulate and enslave the masses.

and again

Many early religions had a common thread. Aborigionies in Austrailia still recite the begining of the world almost verbatum to the Jewish/Christian Genesis. All early cultures have some sort of a flood myth. The overwhelming number of correlations point to an origional story...and it's most likely the truth. It's hard for all cultures to be wrong.
There is no issue with Christianity being a continuation of religion before it, because it was supposed to be a continuation. It would be a lot more easy to debunk if it was not so tied in to other faiths.
It's not even supposed to be strictly just Judiasm. That's ignoring the Bible as a historical document of the Jewish nation, and archaeologists use it to find dead cities, and find it accurate. Science does use the Bible, period.
There were three ages: Patriarchs, Jews, Christians...as far as Bible setup. Patriarchal is Abraham. He lived during the same time as the laws that Sumaria used. His name is on walls, documents, etc. He lived. The bible said he sent his sons from his second wife into Asia (other than Isaac (whom inherited, and Ishmael, whom Sarah had kicked out). I am not suprised that much of Asian culture found it's way into the bible...as they had influence on each other. This more affirms the book as a historical document. Not as stealing ideas.

These so-called "religions" are built upon murder, torture, and lies and the only way any lie of this magnitude can survive is to create more and more lies and destroy the peoples who know the truth. Christianity is nothing more than a program. There is nothing religious or spiritual about it. Millions of people suffer depression, hopelessness, and confusion about life. The soul needs light and very few know this or actively practice the power meditation that will literally "save" their own souls. Because of a lack of knowledge and ignorance Humanity has been placed under a powerful spell using occult power and indoctrinated not to question, concerning these so-called "religions." This has been reinforced by centuries of Christians being duped into supplying their psychic energy and souls to be channeled into perpetuating this lie, which in the end, will only benefit a select few.

Murder happens, and unlike other religions, Jewish historical documents did not hide their early cruelty, or cruelty perpetrated towards them, or even glorify it, even if it was God's will. They just stated the facts and moved on. And the Bible teaches Meditation. It's not foregion to the christian concept...or to the Jews.
It's more accurate to state that religion is the tool of man than man the tool of religion. People bend the boundaries to suit their needs.

Originally posted by MorninG StaR 21

The Judeo/Christian Bible has always used extreme fear as a tool to keep people away from the workings of the mind. be a good sheep, and just "believe."

Biblically, blind faith is asinine. It was never a tennant of the faith. The New Testament was written in such a short period of time that the people who read the letters were alive and saw Jesus die, and many of him saw him after his death, alive...and they saw him in large groups, too. Not just the Apostles. Some of the wonders surrounding his death are found in historical documents...like the sun going dark for as long as it did....across the whole Roman Empire...at least. You can find another document trying to explain it away as an eclipse....multiple hours, recorded as at least spanning parts of 3 continents. Almost all of what Paul put down as Rules you can find Christ's sayings on it in the first 4 books. Paul wrote opinions, and when he did, he wrote down that he was writing opinion. Much of his books were more about thinking things out than actual rules, anyway. Other writers wrote the same things, some of which were directly arguing agianst Paul about some little thing, but they were all in unison about the rules...

The Gentile people have been force fed Christianity in order to strip us of all knowledge and power. Those at the top play both sides against the middle. What this means is the enemy works from within both sides- each side bashing the other while they both move ahead. This is analogous to a cop who is heavily involved in an open and public anti-drug crusade and secretly sells and pushes drugs unbeknownst to his family and community.

Early on, they were not. Christians died in the early years for just confessing that they believed. Paul confessed that he used to kill Christians for the ruling Jews because he was a ruling Jew, and a zealous one at that.
And what power do you speack of the power to speak to the dead? That's not safe, even when you aren't inhibited by a christian upbring. Yes, many Christians were illiterate. Most of them were peseants. That wasn't about religion, but what control the ruling class wanted to have over them. And the peseants beleieved both Christianity and Pagan bleiefs. The ruling class teneded to lean only toards Christianity. The often had the learning to read it.

Following the Roman sacking of the Temple of Solomon 70 CE, Christianity was invented by the Jews the best known is (Paul aka "Saul of Tarsus) so they could control the world using the ancient known powers of the mind and the soul. The Jews themselves know the Nazarene is a fictitious character based upon some 20 crucified heroes from Pagan pantheons.

The book of Matthew fragments were found before 70 CE...they were dated at at least 50 CE. And Matthew, (the historian/doctor...historians can follow his methodology and sytematic research and consider him to be an excellent his along with the other 4 gospels was supposedly written off an earlier document. That's the latest it could have been written. That leaves less than a 20 year gap between Christ's death and the time of the book of Matthew, and even less for the origional transcript.

[wuote[In the case of Christianity, all of the former Pagan (Gentile) Gods were bound and replaced with fictitious Jewish deities. The Hebrew Virgin Mary replaced Astaroth, the Hebrew Moses legend was stolen from Sargon (both were born in secrecy, left in a reed basket to float down the river and adopted by royalty), Hebrew Abraham was stolen from Hindu Brahma. "Brahma in Sanskrit means "many." The endless list goes on and on. There isn't anything in the Christian religion that hasn't been stolen from Pagan religions pre-dating it from hundreds to thousands of years. The Pagan Gods, being a powerful racial memory in the minds of Gentiles were replaced with Hebrew characters to be slavishly obeyed and worshipped. This set the stage for immense power and control.

Moses had a foregion wife. Whose to say that Moses and Sargon aren't the same? Diffrent languages. Jus tmroe likely to mean that there was an origional out there. So the name of Abraham was "stolen." You want you child to be named Many, you go through your English and find some synonyms for many and name them many. That's not theft. Anyway, Abraham means "father of many", and his origional name Abram means "father of none." Why so many dictionaries leave off the "father of" part is confusing, and almost none of them have any of the original language which to base their definition on, so I'm not likely to beleive them, anyway. Depending on which sect you go to, Mary isn't all that holy, and isn't a virgin anymore.

And I don't doubt that Catholicism pulls much in from Paganism. After all, every time I go to one of their masses, I feel like I'm going into a Wiccain holiday. Not all Christianity is like that. Religion is expressed as individually as people are individual.

With Christianity, it is hit and mostly misses.

According to you. I look at some of the things you wrote on this one thread, and I see some hits, and what I'd say are mostly misses. You're just quoting 2 Opinions 3:24.

The few and far in-between hits keep the deluded believing, unknowing this is not any "miracle" but only the power of the mind. The end objective is atheism. The atheist believes in nothing and disregards anything "supernatural" or of the occult. He/she is a sitting duck just waiting to be manipulated by those who possess occult knowledge and power.

Atheism can't prove Atheism without being God itself....and thus defeats the purpose. If you are God, the supreme ruler, then there is a God. And there are true Athiests who turn to Christianity after careful study and medityation. I can get a lot fo their books, so you can see why they tured their lives over to the one thing they said didn't exist. There's enough of this happening on both sides of the equation to tell me that many of the ideas you have are just as wrong as many of mine. And for me to believe the way I do, I have to believe that you are more wrong than me.
Simple game:
Look back at what you believed only 10 years ago.
Do you believe exactly the same then as you do now?
No, you can't...because you aren't static; you are a dynamic human being.
Based on this past, look forwad 10 years. What beliefs are you going to change? Can you predict that now?
Guess what. Some of the ideals you held to 10 years ago that you gave up are the right ideas, and you replace dthem with some wrong thinking. In some instances, you got some right ideas. And in probably the majority, neither one of them was right.
That's called being human. You are fallible.
Hell, this game can be played witin only the space of a few minutes, with almost every human on the face of this planet. We're that dynamic.

"According to the Internal Revenue Service, church donations total over 19 BILLION dollars a year. "This does not include profits from businesses, stock holdings, bond holdings, retirement centers or lease back arrangements."

Lumps all Christian groups together, no?
This doesn't show where the money goes, and is therefore grossly insulting. Some of it is wasted. Preacher has to live (some places, the preacher barely lives, and he's not got a 401K). Building has to be paid for. The poor fed. The injured healed. The blind made to see, etc.
Our congregation helps out a church orphanage in Oklahoma, and I know an Athiest who grew up in that same orphanage...happens to be distantly related to me, and to General Rober E. Lee

. We also sent money to congregations that were destroyed in Katrina. Some of us went down the Bayou and gutted the houses of old folks/women who were left on their own--that isn't reported as money earned. Genralization without details.

Originally posted by MorninG StaR 21The Bible warns us that "Judgment begins with the Household of God", with the Churches, and The Falsehood they teach such as "Once Saved, Always, Saved", and The "Name It, Claim It" Prosperity Doctrines that permeate Christian Television, Radio and Books.

My Christian faith...erm, religion teaches against the dogmatic "once saved always saved". Grace is so misunderstood. Grace covers sins you are unaware of, and sins you slip up and do, mostly when you do your best not to do that sin again...NOT sins you have to continually do. And sin is sin. There is no distinction between Rape and a white lie. You go to hell for both, under the right circumstances. My Christian uncle died, and is likely going to be in hell because he was an incestuous pedophile. Doubt he got himself right with God. (And don't blame that on his religion, as his father-in-law did the same thing and was an Athiest. It knows no religious boundaries. Man is evil by nature, just as he is good by nautre. Jsut so happens that there were times in history where more people wore the banner of Christian.) There will be Christains in hell. htere will be jews in heaven. And there's going to be at least one pagan theif that died on the cross up there. This is scriptural. God makes that decision, based upon the decisions that the individual makes. Judgement does begin in the household of God...and it will be harder on them than on those that couldn't understand.

For all Believers who love and follow these Lies, and The Lukewarm and The Hypocrites shall be part of the Multitude.

I agree with this sentiment. Whereas you meant me, I meant you .

In all seriousness: You are way to general in your opinions. Back it up with facts and not sentiments. And, like in the case of the name Abraham, be more thorough in your documentation of opinion based upon scanty fact.

Example: Spanish Inquisition: Which person, how they thought they were Christian....and were they scripturally a Christian? What sect was he? Was each and every move for the church or for the making of Spain's empire...and can you be sure who the move was made for? What groups opposed this particular move? I expect about 3 pages of material withturough detal before I even think of taking you seriously. I'm not joking. You only come across as anotewr complainer without any real evidence to support your theories. Atrocities happend in the names of gods. Atrocities happened in the name of Athiesm. Very rarely was anything about what it was in the name of.

I would expect a discussion (Troll) like this over at GLP but here its useless.

Religion cannot be argued successfully in any forum because it gets back to ones spiritual world view...the Atheist will stay atheist and those who believe will not change either....

Circular arguments will exercise your fingers but the premise of this post will just serve to show that the poster has issues with faith and IMHO, Reality.

You can't prove your arguments either for or against...why?

Because its a matter of FAITH...and those who have no faith....will post these kinds of bandwidth wasters.

I for one Believe in Jesus and the illuminati/NWO....the set up for the Anti-Christ.....

So sue me.

LOL

JFree is right. It is a matter of faith. Threads of such topics go round and round and probably no one has changed in what they believe. Though us Christians cannot prove with solid evidence that God exists, it cannot be proved with solid evidence that God does not exist.

Originally posted by LancerJ1
JFree is right. It is a matter of faith. Threads of such topics go round and round and probably no one has changed in what they believe. Though us Christians cannot prove with solid evidence that God exists, it cannot be proved with solid evidence that God does not exist.

Which God would that be ?

The one called Yahwe or one of the several 100 that came before him?

You know the God i speak of. The Christian God.

Originally posted by jlc163

In all seriousness: You are way to general in your opinions. Back it up with facts and not sentiments. And, like in the case of the name Abraham, be more thorough in your documentation of opinion based upon scanty fact.

Are you sure of your facts?

Writers have regarded the life of Abraham in various ways. He has been viewed as a chieftain of the Amorites, as the head of a great Semitic migration from Mesopotamia; or, since Ur and Haran were seats of Moon-worship, he has been identified with a moon-god. From the character of the literary evidence and the locale of the stories it has been held that Abraham was originally associated with Hebron. The double name Abram/Abraham has even suggested that two personages have been combined in the Biblical narrative; although this does not explain the change from Sarai to Sarah.

The interesting discovery of the name Abi-ramu (Abram?) on Babylonian contracts of about 2000 BC/BCE does not prove the Abraham of the Old Testament to be an historical person, even as the fact that there were Amorites in Babylonia at the same period does not make it certain that the 'patriarch' was one of their number (if he existed altogether).

Several scholars claim, on the basis of archaeological and philological evidence, that many stories in the Old Testament, including the accounts about Abraham, Moses, and others, were actually made up by scribes under King Josiah (7th century BC/BCE) in order to provide a historical framework for the monotheistic belief in Yahweh. Such scholars claim that the archives of neighbouring countries that kept written records, such as Egypt, Assyria, etc., show no trace of the stories of the Bible or its main characters before 650 BC/BCE. Such claims are detailed in "Who Were the Early Israelites?" by William G. Dever, (William B. Eerdmans Publishing Co., Grand Rapids, MI, 2003). Another similar book by Neil A. Silberman and Israel Finkelstein is "The Bible Unearthed," (Simon and Schuster, New York, 2001).

Osbert

If you want to witness real pride go to the Vatican in Rome and spend a few minutes observing the Cardinals..

No dobt................But you seem to be confusing Christianity with Mystery Babylon as found in Revelations. The one dressed in purple and scarlet as Bishops and Cardinals do.

You seem to be confused by all the things that you say are in Christianity. These things are the things that Pontiff Maximus and Roman Emperor Constantine the worshiper of the sun, installed in the Catholic Church.

We can track these things to Babylon, and they have nothing to do with Christianity.

When the Deceiver could not stop the spreading of the truth by killing the Christians he simply took charge of the Bishops of Rome. He is the one that changed the day of worship from the Sabbath as commanded to SUNday.

YOU NEED TO DO SOME REAL RESEARCH AND FIND THE TRUTH. You have been fed a crock by those who seek to keep you in blindness.

Originally posted by Sun Matrix

We can track these things to Babylon, and they have nothing to do with Christianity.

You say "we" do you mean to tell me there is more than one of you?l

Originally posted by JFree
I would expect a discussion (Troll) like this over at GLP but here its useless.

Religion cannot be argued successfully in any forum because it gets back to ones spiritual world view...the Atheist will stay atheist and those who believe will not change either....

Circular arguments will exercise your fingers but the premise of this post will just serve to show that the poster has issues with faith and IMHO, Reality.

You can't prove your arguments either for or against...why?

Because its a matter of FAITH...and those who have no faith....will post these kinds of bandwidth wasters.

I for one Believe in Jesus and the illuminati/NWO....the set up for the Anti-Christ.....

So sue me.

LOL

Though I am using your post to quote, JFree, this is more a general response than a particular one:

Yet: How is it different to argue about religon as opposed to, say, whether or not aliens exist? Or whether there is an Illuminati, and all other supposed conspiracies? The difference is that there is no difference.

If you have faith, and I don't, perhaps we will not change because of each other's arguments, but why is it that only about faith is it supposed to be pc to "keep it to yourself"? Used to be the pc atttitude in public was "don't talk about politics or religion". Politics certainly get talked about and argued endlessly. Why not religion?

There is only one answer to why people who have no faith, supposedly, continue to rant on religion, and that is because they are afraid they are wrong, or afraid they are right in their unbelief.

Why come to a forum that holds no interest for you on subjects you don't like to think about much less argue over? Either you are emotionally involved in hating or loving the subject, or you are provoked by others hating or loving it.

Any questions brought up by a non-believer are motivated by the poster's inner cognition. For that reason, believers feel obligated to repond to their posts: the believer holds dear the faith. Though maintaining faith in God has perhaps cost him or her a great deal in terms of loss of friends, family, and belongings, and in some cases, will cost them even their own lives, it is nevertheless so precious to them they cannot bear to see its loveliness stomped into the mud by contaminated ideology.

Since the angels do not post on this forum, so we think anyway, the believers are the only ones on earth who are capable of making posts in behalf of the lost and mistaken unbelievers.

As His representatives we are "constrained", as Paul put it, to defend the faith with the sureness of both the existence and desireablity of Father God and His dear Son, Jesus Christ.

edited to add:
You have voted solidgear for the Way Above Top Secret award. You have one more vote left for this month.

[edit on 13-8-2006 by curiousity]

Originally posted by curiousity
There are no religions predating God and even you must see that He is before all things, by definition. And He spoke Light into the world, Who was with Him and is Him, the Beginning and the End, at the very beginning of the universe's creation.

From what source? A bunch of books thrown together makes you think there is a God?
Show me your God...let him speak...he is mute.
let him listen to me...he is deaf...

As far as Im concerned the Christian God is a hoax.
Something all powerful, yet as divorced as He is from his loyal followers, and also contradicting?

God, whatever it is, is not how Christians percieve it.

God cannot be known...

peace

dalen

Well, check out the big brain on Brad!

he is mute.

The Lord speaks volumes without saying a word. Look all around you, everything you see is proof of the existence of the Creator.

Something all powerful, yet as divorced as He is from his loyal followers, and also contradicting?

Who are you to speak about the plans of the Lord? Did you cause mountains to rise or the birds to fly?

You, who thinks he can use the mind of man to counter the plan of his creator, the Alpha and the Omega, the Almighty, tell us how we were created! Tell me how the universe was created! You, an infant, can find fault with the Lord, an adult? What do you know of anything?

What a great mind you must have to find fault with the ultimate being!




[edit on 13-8-2006 by cavscout]

Please people, Unless you have the sealing of the Holy Spirit in your life, The God found in the bible is a mystery to you. Don't even try to tell us we are wrong. God confirms His Truth in us via his Holy Spirit & if you have never come to know The One True God of this universe in a living relationship then, you will never understand where we stand with regards to religion, as ours is rather a daily relationship.

You don't believe in the creation as set out in the bible, then you will believe in hocus pocus ideas & beliefs, that is your choice?

Those of us who are redeemed by the eternal free plan of Gods Salvation, encompassing the "Father, Son & Holy Spirit" work & covenant of grace need not defend in any better way than asking you to read the bible for yourself & ask God to show you his truth in a loving & gracious fashion.

Peace to you all.

Originally posted by Osbert

Originally posted by Sun Matrix

We can track these things to Babylon, and they have nothing to do with Christianity.

You say "we" do you mean to tell me there is more than one of you?l

If you know the truth about history you would know this.

I think my favorite must be the followers of David Icke. He has traced these ancient reptilian bloodlines back to Babylon. And he's right. He even traces these reptilians to Nimrod and Semiramis.

He tells a lot of truth to get the blind to believe him. Then he says LOOK.......LOOK at these things that we can trace from Babylon to Egypt. And look at the mother child cult of Isis and Horus. Where have we seen this before............oh.........Mary and Jesus. You see this is where Christianity comes from.

They trace these ancient reptilian blood lines back to Babylon. They just leave out the part that these reptilian bloodlines come from the Serpent and Deceiver.

I'm watching an Icke movie and I'm thinking, this guy is incredible, how does he keep from laughting when he tells his story? Just then he almost looses it and starts laughing. He regathers himself and they just keep rolling tape and he continues on with his crock.

YOU NEED TO DO SOME REAL RESEARCH and not the crock that is handed to you by these bookwriters.

Originally posted by cavscout
What a great mind you must have to find fault with the ultimate being.

[edit on 13-8-2006 by cavscout]

Thank you, I do have quite a mind indeed.

You act as if you know this ultimate being.
To know is more than intellectual knowledge and fluffy feelings.

To know someone is to spend time with someone.
Herein lies the problem, when as anyone (with proof) saw this ultimate being, heard the ultimate being.
No, no, not "I see him in the clouds", "the Bible tells me so"...Evangelicals speak of that which they do not know as they do know.

Bring the ultimate being home to dinner and I will believe. But as of now, the evangelical God has nothing for me.

Dig a little bit deeper into your roots (Judaism) and you will see God cannot be known.
Not cause he doesnt want to...but it cannot be known.

How are we here? The h*** if I know.
But to blindly make my self pacified by making up that which has not proved itself.
Again, an almighty supreme being cannot pop its voice out or show itself?

Lets just say this...theres more to this than what you may think.

Again, I beg every Christian to dive into their belief as much as they can.
Go into it until they walk out to the other side. When they walk out of the river they immersed themselves into, what will they find? Could be the same thing, but one thing is for sure...if you dont persist, you will stay in that state you are now, perhaps not seeing past that which you already know. This may take 32 years or more...but this is nto for the faint hearted, its only for those who truly want to find.

Peace

Dalen

Originally posted by Sun Matrix

I'm watching an Icke movie and I'm thinking, this guy is incredible, how does he keep from laughting when he tells his story? Just then he almost looses it and starts laughing. He regathers himself and they just keep rolling tape and he continues on with his crock.

YOU NEED TO DO SOME REAL RESEARCH and not the crock that is handed to you by these bookwriters.

I don't know who Icke is, not much about reptilians either, sorry.
I know about Constantine and the Sol Invictus (also Mithras); I cannot fathom what you are getting at...
You speak like a guy I know in London, are you a Rastaferian?

Originally posted by Osbert

Originally posted by Sun Matrix

I'm watching an Icke movie and I'm thinking, this guy is incredible, how does he keep from laughting when he tells his story? Just then he almost looses it and starts laughing. He regathers himself and they just keep rolling tape and he continues on with his crock.

YOU NEED TO DO SOME REAL RESEARCH and not the crock that is handed to you by these bookwriters.

I don't know who Icke is, not much about reptilians either, sorry.
I know about Constantine and the Sol Invictus (also Mithras); I cannot fathom what you are getting at...
You speak like a guy I know in London, are you a Rastaferian?

No, not Rastaferian. No religion. Religion is from the Deceiver, I only believe in the truth that Jesus is the prophesied Messiah.

Don't get sidetracked on Icke by the way, he seeks to lead people astray by giving them a little truth and then feeding the lie.

So many people see the sun god and trace it to the church of Rome and say see, it's paganism. That' right, it is by Constantine backing the Bishops of Rome and installing the worship of Baal within the church of Rome. This is Mystery Babylon.

All in the Bible, by the way, the word of God. You need to check out Nimrod, Semiramis and Tammez. You will find, a timeline problem if you research enough. It is there to keep you from finding the truth.