Israel apologizes to U.S. over sale of technology to china

Israel publicly apologized to the United States on June 19 over arms exports to China that have drawn criticism from Washington and strained U.S.-Israeli security ties.

“It is impossible to hide the crisis between Israel and the United States with regard to the security industries. We are doing everything possible to put it behind us,” Israeli Foreign Minister Silvan Shalom said on Israel Radio.

read full article .....

well i hope this is the shape of things to come and Israel terminates defence ties with China.

Israeli proliferation to china :

> Sale of technologies and designs of its LAVI fighter to china for its J-10
> Sale of radar technology to China
> Sale of Harpy attack UAV
> Sale of American-Israeli tech on High energy lasers to China
> Sale of technology of US tech derrived Python-3 and Python-4 air to air missiles to China
> Sale of C4I technologies to China
> Help in Chinese anti-ballistic missile tech from the US patriot missiles it has

and many more.....

Originally posted by Stealth Spy

Israel publicly apologized to the United States on June 19 over arms exports to China that have drawn criticism from Washington and strained U.S.-Israeli security ties.

“It is impossible to hide the crisis between Israel and the United States with regard to the security industries. We are doing everything possible to put it behind us,” Israeli Foreign Minister Silvan Shalom said on Israel Radio.

> Sale of technologies and designs of its LAVI fighter to china for its J-10

never been proven. offical israeli denial

> Sale of radar technology to China

yeah and france britian germany russia also

> Sale of Harpy attack UAV

israel sales them to anyone that needs them LIKE INDIA

> Sale of American-Israeli tech on High energy lasers to China

Never been proven...again Offical israeli denial

> Sale of technology of US tech derrived Python-3 and Python-4 air to air missiles to China

Approved with US support pre-tiannemen square deal in 1982 transfer of tech in 1983 when china was a allie in the fight againest soviet union

> Sale of C4I technologies to China

To help with civil phone communication network ....can also be used for military purposes

> Help in Chinese anti-ballistic missile tech from the US patriot missiles it has

China hasn't setup a anti-missile system our best system is the russian s-300 which i doubt could be used with american technology

and many more.....

go name them

Israel will sell anything to anyone, thats proven itself over the years.
US stupid thinking Israel is the best ally in middle east.
Wouldnt waste my time with them.

what was israel's rationale for selling to china.........??????


angie

Not sure. Maybe to pay the yanks for the F15's F16's Apache's etc
Israel have bought a lot of equipment.

many countries sell china dual-use technology.

germany . engines

france . sonars communicatioins nuke tech?

britain . communications

america . planes.?

russia . everything under the sun

Israel cannot be trusted, we should terminate their involvement in the F-35, Laser program and missile technology.
They have sold our tech to county's we do not approve of way to many times.

Originally posted by Jezza
Not sure. Maybe to pay the yanks for the F15's F16's Apache's etc
Israel have bought a lot of equipment.

they get 2billion in military aid from the US every year so they practicaly get these for free as its payed for by the people of the US out of their wages

the aid is actually colse to 3 billion $ and is only for developmental israeli projects that america is interested in (like THEL, Arrow, Phalcon awacs, etc)

and moreover israel must share patents with american companies for funded projects and the some of it will be produced in american production lines, and will generate jobs in the american defence industry

chinawhite

the topic here is Israel apologizes to U.S. over sale of technology to china

and Israel is selling US tech to china, stop denying

Originally posted by ulshadow
chinawhite

the topic here is Israel apologizes to U.S. over sale of technology to china

and Israel is selling US tech to china, stop denying

So, us always sells everything to the enemies of israel all the time and doesnt apologise, this is bull whining is cause us afraid to lose contracts with other nations tha tisrael is dealing with..

*Edited Profanity*

[edit on 23-6-2005 by dbates]

So, us always sells everything to the enemies of israel all the time and doesnt apologise, this is whining is cause us afraid to lose contracts with other nations tha tisrael is dealing with..

What do we sell to the enemies of Israel? We're the reason nations like Egypt haven't overrun Israel. We're the reason they still aren't trying to invade.

Originally posted by ulshadow
chinawhite

the topic here is Israel apologizes to U.S. over sale of technology to china

and Israel is selling US tech to china, stop denying

israel has appologized for other things not the things i pointed out.

Originally posted by bisonn
So, us always sells everything to the enemies of israel all the time and doesnt apologise, this is bull# whining is cause us afraid to lose contracts with other nations tha tisrael is dealing with..

They are selling the tech that americans pay with their tax dollars... it's like we pay for the stuff and they take the stuff for free and sell it and they earn money...

and chinawhite... you pointed out that you deny any sell of US-irseal stuff to china... go read your last few posts...



[edit on 23-6-2005 by ulshadow]

[edit on 23-6-2005 by ulshadow]

We help Israel, we give them military aid and give them some of our latest weapons and they then take what we give them vitally free and sell it to our enemies?
Don't bite the hand that feed’s you.

As this my first post on here i think this is an ideal subject to do so on! without the sounding to anti semetic (which im not)! israel as a country seems to me to do what ever they want whether it be selling arms to hostile countrys or occupiying another country for yrs !

Without the U.s, Israel wouldnt even be there as every other country there doesnt like them very much, so its quite ironic that they r allegedly doin this and the U.s still sells them stuff.

And whats more think that they can get away with, personally i wouldnt sell um nowt!

The Defense Intelligence Agency says Israel shared with China restricted U.S. weapons technology obtained during a joint U.S.-Israeli effort to build a battlefield laser gun,".

US employees have twice "spotted Chinese technicians working secretly with one of the Israeli companies involved in the laser weapon program." A Chinese official in Israel exhibited hard knowledge of the super-secret program to build lasers to shoot down the Katyusha rockets used by Hezbollah on Israeli towns.

Some THEL details :

The Tactical High Energy Laser (THEL) is a joint project of the United States and Israel designed to destroy short-range ballistic missiles, cruisemissiles, ground- and air-launched rockets, unmanned aerial vehicles, mortar shells, and artillery projectiles. It consists of an advanced radar that detects and tracks incoming rockets, and a high-energy laser beam that destroys them
Read more details.... link

Israel has been charged before with betraying vital U.S. secrets. In 1992, The Washington Times reported Israel had given Beijing the secret technology of the U.S. Patriot missile. A U.S. investigation found that, while Beijing had acquired the secrets of the Patriot, it could not say for sure who gave them up.

China's next fighter aircraft -- the J-10 -- airborne radar systems, tank programs and a variety of missiles have lots of Israeli involvemnt. Over vigorous Pentagon objections, Israel has apparently transferred to China the most lethal air-to-air missile in the world: the Python 4. This system employs an advanced helmet-mounted sight, developed together by American and Israeli firms."


China's J-10 is based on the Israeli Lavi, an Israeli plane subsidized with $1.4 billion in U.S. tax dollars. As ominous, writes Clarke, is "Israel's transfer to China of its STAR-1 cruise missile technology (that) ... incorporates U.S. stealth technology and is ... 'a growth version' of Israel's Delilah-2 missile, which contains U.S. parts and technology."

Link

Analysts said that in addition to reaping profits and lowering defense production costs, Israel believes arms sales to China raises its influence with Beijing and gains it vital intelligence about its enemies, with whom China does business.

Israel ranks second only to Russia as a weapons system provider to China and as a conduit for sophisticated military technology" according to a recent report by the U.S.-China Security Review Commission, a panel established by Congress to examine security and economic relations between the two countries.

"Recent upgrades in target acquisition and fire control, provided by Israeli weapons specialists, have enhanced the capabilities of the older guided missile destroyers and frigates" in the Chinese navy's inventory, it said.

The commission, cited Israel as a supplier to Beijing of radar systems, optical and telecommunications equipment, drones and flight simulators.

Israel has established itself as an important exporter of high-technology niche weapons containing more sophisticated technology than what is provided by Russia.
Read much more .........

....China is the major target of Israeli business in next decades. Israel has wide variety of interests in the Chinese market. Its key interests are high-tech, biotech, homeland security, telecommunication, information technology, environmental protection, agriculture and infrastructure. He hopes to expand cooperation with China in these fields. Israel hopes to make "a little contribution" to China's preparation .....

Israel-china conf

Israel, China Celebrate 10 Years of Ties


[edit on 23-6-2005 by Stealth Spy]

Israel-China UAV Deal Provokes Pentagon
The Pentagon’s undersecretary of defence for policy Doug Feith accused top Israeli defence ministry official on an unmanned aerial vehicle (UAV) deal between Israel and the People’s Republic of China (PRC), and claimed that this has caused a confidence crisis between the Pentagon and the Israeli MoD.

China has acquired some unknown number of the Israeli Aerospace Industry (IAI)’s Harpy Attack UAV in 1994. In summer 2004 some of these UAVs were sent back to Israel to be upgraded for better performance. The Pentagon has already demanded that Israel not to deliver these UAVs to China, even though they are properties of the PRC.

link

David Lari, director general of Israel's Ministry of Defense, acknowledged in an Associated Press interview that "some technology on aircraft" had been sold to China and that some Israeli companies may not have "clean hands".

Israel provided, it was reported that the Jian-10's radar and fire-control system is the Israeli-made ELM-2021 system, which can simultaneously track six air targets and lock on to the four most threatening targets for destruction.

the US Office of Naval Intelligence in its unclassified "Worldwide Challenges to Naval Strike Warfare" restated more strongly than it had the previous year its belief that US-derived technology from the canceled Israeli Lavi fighter was being used on China's new F-10 fighter. It said, "The design has been undertaken with substantial direct external assistance, primarily from Israel and Russia, with indirect assistance through access to US technologies." In fact, according to the annual intelligence report, "the J-10 is a single-seat, light multi-role fighter based heavily on the canceled Israeli Lavi program".

Until it was canceled in 1987, much of Lavi technological development was paid for by the United States. Ironically, the potential capability of J-10 fighters was cited by both the US Navy and Air Force as one of the future threats justifying the expenditure of billions on new tactical aircraft, such as the F-22, F/A-18F, and Joint Strike Fighter. The fact that possibly US-derived technology provided by an ally might be contributing to that potential threat is a delicate subject.

link

China's J-10 is fully based on the Israeli Lavi, an Israeli plane subsidized with $1.4 billion in U.S. tax dollars.

link

The J-10 is based on the Israel Aircraft Industries (IAI)’s Lavi fighter. After the Lavi programme was cancelled in 1987, its design was taken over by CAC, and IAI carried on with the development of avionic equipment.

link

Apparently, Chinese engineers are trying to develop the J-10 from a single F-16 provided by Pakistan, and with assistance from Israeli engineers associated with Israel’s US-financed Lavi fighter program, which was cancelled in 1987.

It is reported that the Jian-10's radar and fire-control system is the Israeli-made ELM-2021 system, which can simultaneously track six air targets and lock onto the four most-threatening targets for destruction. Some experts believe that the Israeli contribution will focus on avionics and radar, with Russia supplying the engines. In December 1991, US intelligence officials announced that Israel was planning to open a government coordinated and sponsored "arms office" in the PRC. In light of what the Israelis have to offer, and what the Chinese need, it was most likely that a transfer of avionics and other technologies developed in the Lavi program would ensue, since there is a void in the Chinese avionics and fire control system capability due to the 1989 termination of a US/Chinese program in response to Tienanmen square.

China and Israel started collaboration in the early 1980's and full-scale cooperation was underway officially by 1984. After the 1987 cancellation of the Lavi, it was taken over by CAIC and the IAI carried on with the development of avionic equipment.

Since neither China nor Israel is capable of developing the propulsion system required by the J-10, in 1991 China acquired the AI31F turbofan engine from Russia for incorporation into the J-10 fighter.

link

Six years ago, U.S. government reports accused Israel of illegally transferring U.S. technology from the largely U.S.-funded Lavi fighter plane program to China. China's new J-10 fighter jet is nearly identical to the Lavi.

source

In the late 1980s, at least 20 engineers from Israel Aircraft Industries (IAI) were part of the fighter's design team at Chengdu."

"IAI also helped with windtunnel testing in the early design stage. The Israeli presence has been scaled down in the last three years"

"The Israeli design and development input in the programme is valued at more than $500 million. Overall programme costs are said to top $5 billion"

source

The PL-8 infrared homing short-range air-to-air missile is a Chinese licensed production version of the Israeli Python-3.

China and Israel agreed on the deal of Python-3 technology and its licensed production in 1982, and the transfer began in September 1983.

The J-10 (based on the Israeli LAVI) carrying the missile (chinese version of the Israeli Phtyon-3)

link

Apart from its control surfaces the PL-9 is almost identical to the Israeli Python-3, which was developed from the AIM-9L. The one major difference, according to information in Jane's All the World's Aircraft, is that the PL-9 has only about one-third the range of the Python 3.

China has improved upon the PL-9 by marrying it to an apparent copy of the Arsenel helmet sight from the R-73.

link

The PL-4 is a Chinese copy of the U.S. AIM-7B Sparrow.

link
and guess where it got that from.

During the series of airborne confrontations, a Chinese jet crashed after colliding with a U.S. spy plane, killing the Chinese pilot and disabling the U.S. plane. The incident sparked a bitter diplomatic row as China detained the American crew for 11 days.

Had Chinese fighter pilots been given the order to fire, they could have brought down the U.S. planes with Israeli Python III derrived missiles.

U.S. technology given to the Israelis in the form of the Sidewinder missile was used in the development of the Python, said Larry Wortzel, former U.S. Army attache in Beijing and now a military analyst at the Heritage Foundation.

U.S. defense chiefs say Israel sold China the missiles without informing the United States.
“Generally speaking, we’re not in favor of such capable weapons systems being proliferated to a variety of nations around the world,” Rear Adm. Craig Quigley said in a Pentagon briefing last year. “That’s a good missile, and its capabilities are considerable.”

link

Also : Israel also tried to sell the Phalcon AWACS (compareable to the latest E-3 and its radar has numerous patented american technologies) to China, but America came to know of it and promptly blocked the deal.


[edit on 23-6-2005 by Stealth Spy]

Originally posted by chinawhite
many countries sell china dual-use technology.

germany . engines

france . sonars communicatioins nuke tech?

britain . communications

america . planes.?

russia . everything under the sun

Yes but we or France don't require billions of dollars donations a year from you to keep our corrupt, uneconomic idealogical outpost in existance on someone else's land. We don't have a constitutional clause obliging you to come to OUR defence.

Israel spies on you, plots against you and sells the tech you've funded to your 'enemies'.

You think they're your friends, they dump on you! We think you're our friends; you dump on us.

most of your articles are about israel giving china air to air missile tech which america allowed