How is it possible Amber

a reply to: Ravenwatcher

Instant cataclysmic event. The poles melted instantly and within a matter of hours, the water rushed out and flooded everything, gouging out the earth and creating all of the major rivers and canyons in a flash. We have whale bones high up in the Rocky Mt deserts, etc. And down south - imagine entire pine forests boiling over instantly with heat and extruding copious amounts of resin. Resin exploding out in bucket loads.

Further north, due to the instant lack of an atmosphere and miles thick of vaporized ice water in the air, we have giant woolly mammoths trapped in a frozen perma-freeze that hits everything so quickly and flash freezes them as they stand there chewing on some grass.

Oh yeah. That praying mantis was just another creature that was somehow instantly encapsulated and caught off guard by the greatest of the greatest resets to ever happen.

And it's going to happen again real soon. That's why the 'Owners' of this planet are pulling all the strings to raise as much money through fake scam global taxes. It will cost a lot to survive the upcoming actual great reset, and they are hell bent on keeping their genetics in place for the new world. Not ours, unfortunately.

originally posted by: EmmanuelGoldstein
a reply to: Ravenwatcher

Instant cataclysmic event. The poles melted instantly and within a matter of hours, the water rushed out and flooded everything, gouging out the earth and creating all of the major rivers and canyons in a flash. We have whale bones high up in the Rocky Mt deserts, etc. And down south - imagine entire pine forests boiling over instantly with heat and extruding copious amounts of resin. Resin exploding out in bucket loads.

Further north, due to the instant lack of an atmosphere and miles thick of vaporized ice water in the air, we have giant woolly mammoths trapped in a frozen perma-freeze that hits everything so quickly and flash freezes them as they stand there chewing on some grass.

Oh yeah. That praying mantis was just another creature that was somehow instantly encapsulated and caught off guard by the greatest of the greatest resets to ever happen.

And it's going to happen again real soon. That's why the 'Owners' of this planet are pulling all the strings to raise as much money through fake scam global taxes. It will cost a lot to survive the upcoming actual great reset, and they are hell bent on keeping their genetics in place for the new world. Not ours, unfortunately.

I did hear/read somewhere they found Woolly Mammoths frozen still with food in their mouths so something was instant .

Prehistory? Likely a wounded tree and it got stuck as it was still flowing out and coated it all round.

'Amber' is just tree sap after all meaning most likely poured on an asphyxiated specimen the same way acrylic epoxy is.

Edit to add:

All the videos I looked at for amber insects: The 'amber' is just food coloring added to epoxy resins to dye it an amber color.

Lighting striking a tree is said to sometimes leave a small spark of fire in it as a plasmatic ball lighting that very slowly but surely burns the tree from the inside out over many years.

a reply to: bobs_uruncle

Sap and resin are entirely different, and amber comes from resin. I'm not sure about other resins, but when high temperature is applied to pine resin, the turpentine evaporates from the resin, leaving only rosin. I assume most other resins are similar, because all resin-producing trees belong to the same family. So, at least in theory, if a process such as you hypothesize occurred, the amber samples would lack turpentine. I'm inclined to believe that temperatures high enough to flash boil resin would incinerate insects instantly.

Who says it wasn’t? What exactly was the density of the sap while being excreted?

What’s more likely? The tree had runny sap? Or a small air burst from an asteroid caused extreme temperature/pressure/atmospheric changes in a small localized area resulting in the sap behaving like it’s been liquidated from heat. Except it wasn’t heated enough to boil water because we don’t see any trapped internal bubbles within the able from the liquid in the insect. All while keeping the little insect totally 100% intact it didn’t even curl his antenna. It would require the sap to be heated but not the insect.

I am going with this tree had runny sap and it produced lots of it. Voila.

a reply to: Ravenwatcher

a reply to: Athetos

Bubbles ............ And Pollen large Pollen spores

a reply to: Athetos

You could accuse me of playing semantics but it's worthy of distinction that amber is formed from resin, not sap. Delicious syrups are made from sap.

a reply to: QRST4D

Also see the O2 bubbles or co2 bubbles from said insect from my specimen .

originally posted by: QRST4D
a reply to: bobs_uruncle

Sap and resin are entirely different, and amber comes from resin. I'm not sure about other resins, but when high temperature is applied to pine resin, the turpentine evaporates from the resin, leaving only rosin. I assume most other resins are similar, because all resin-producing trees belong to the same family. So, at least in theory, if a process such as you hypothesize occurred, the amber samples would lack turpentine. I'm inclined to believe that temperatures high enough to flash boil resin would incinerate insects instantly.

I don't think it would flash boil, but somehow the viscosity would have to be reduced, so maybe an increase of 20-30 degrees over normal temps. Maybe the sap/resin had a different composition a few hundred million years ago? How does the Amber compare to existing sap/resins and can an existing sap/resin be used to recreate Amber? Maybe it was a fashion thing and proto-humans deliberately encased insects in sap/resin and made Amber so we would find them later, a kind of message in a bottle?

Cheers - Dave

a reply to: Ravenwatcher

That's neat. Air bubbles trapped in amber do not appear to be uncommon, but they have blessed scientists with the ability to measure oxygen levels at different times in Earth's history. For instance, it has been shown that the dinosaurs breathed air that was 35% oxygen, compared to 21% in the modern atmosphere.

geology.com...#:~:text=Analyses%20of%20the%20gases%20in,amber%20from%2016%20world%20sites.

a reply to: bobs_uruncle

I follow the logic that amber comes from resin, and resin is produced by a tree in response to injury. So many questions flow from there, but foremost in my mind is what happened such that a very fast insect with remarkable eyesight such as a praying mantis could be overcome by resin in an instant and preserved in such a life-like state. I can easily imagine an insect flying or accidentally jumping onto a resin flow and getting stuck, but I'd imagine a bigger critter opportunistically scavenging the poor buggy in short time. It is a fascinating mystery, that much is for sure. I guess my final answer is "I don't know".

I seem to recall a science-y type explaining this phenomena in a documentary..in that it was the huge size of trees in past epochs that was responsible, like- varieties that are not common or are non-existent now, were likely copious producers of resin to explain the quantities found and volumes etc

I'm thinking of all the art representing huge conifers in particular...and lumbering critters or violent weather damaging the trees, that kind of thing.

Maybe, it was just like the room of monkeys and typewriters eventually writing a masterpiece posit. Maybe it was just that over the vast gulfs of time that have passed the perfect sloppy resin and bug calamity had to happen now and again, and we would find the proof here and there...lot o trees in days of olde before we came along.

Sets my imagination a percolating it does....

a reply to: Ravenwatcher


The Process of Any Organism being Encased in Amber is very Intriguing to me . I have found out that..........



" How amber becomes a death trap "


" For their study, the researchers observed how resin traps aquatic organisms at a forest swamp just east of Gainesville in Florida.

Using a handsaw, they cut bark from five pine trees to create resin flows into the water.

Once the resin made its way to the swamp, they collected it and analysed the contents under high magnification.

Florida swamp forest

Tree resin collected from swamps like this one in Florida preserves life as varied as water beetles, tiny plants, bacteria and fungi (Image: Alexander Schmidt)
The collected resin preserved practically the entire swamp ecosystem, or at least its smallest inhabitants.

Water beetles, mites, small crustaceans called ostracods, parts of aquatic plants, hairy single-celled creatures called ciliates and even bacteria and fungi were identified in the goo.

Bacteria and fungi need water, so they kept growing in the resin until it dried out and solidified.

If left in the swamp, the resin might have turned to amber if the water level fell and allowed the resin to dry.

Given enough protection by layers of sediment, the amber could survive intact for millions of years. "


www.abc.net.au...


" Scientists find how amber becomes death trap for watery creatures "

“It’s been one of the strange things mentioned by biologists and entomologists for decades – how do you account for aquatic insects and organisms in what seemed to be an ancient terrestrial environment,” Kritsky said. “Dilcher examined this contradiction by creating the conditions that would cause sap deposits to flow into water to see what would happen. The results demonstrated that aquatic insects can be trapped in resin without leaving their aquatic world. Thus, the presence of aquatic organisms in amber is the result of a simple natural process.”



www.eurekalert.org...

a reply to: Ravenwatcher

It is the most probable scenario for how it got trapped in that position.
now the question is only how long did it take to cover the whole insect before it decays.

I'm not assuming heat to play a mayor role nore that the resin was unusually fluid by nature.

The only thing that could be is that trees were huge too and so was their resin production. But then this mantis must be incredibly small

But I think we don't even need that to explain this.
Mantis can kill every insect and the biggies even small birds and none of the animals that walk trees are especially fond of resin on their food.
Her being upside down means she could stay alive for quite some time, while the resin covers her slowly but surely.
She would also act as a surface tension breaker and make all the resin flow down along her...
I'm thinking that beast was able to hunt and eat until her head got covered with resin. It could be weeks, but she only died when 90% of her body was already covered with resin and protected from the bacterial and fungal decay once an organism dies....

But honestly it's so clear and perfectly transparent, it must be worth a fortune, like museum worthy, which makes me still contemplate the option of it being fake. A little like it's easy to spot fake diamonds they are absolutely perfect without impurities.

Occams razor might apply.

My apologies I was referring to the mantis, not a blanket statement about all pieces of amber. Yes that piece has bubbles indeed. Now are they a result of trapped detritus decomposition or simple air? Or are they cavities created by collapsing steam?

Logic says not the last one.

a reply to: Ravenwatcher

Guilty,

Death sentence.

a reply to: QRST4D

originally posted by: Terpene
a reply to: Ravenwatcher

There is always the possibility of it being fake...

Yes, the Chinese are VERY good at faking fossil and mineral specemins.

a reply to: nerbot

I'm sure Switzerland could do it better if we wanted to, but we # the world over more elegantly. We make them think it's their own free market...

I have seen some things in amber, but do not own anything like that. I can't understand how they were formed, how was the sap that liquid that they show up like they do. I think of pine pitch, have seen it a lot on the trees when they are wounded, but from what I see, it is hard to believe an insect could get preserved in such a clear crystal. It always gets murky, but I suppose if the tree was huge, it would have big sap leaks. Now, if it was like maple leaf sap, I could see it happening, but maple sap deteriorates pretty easily, I cannot see it causing a permanent crystal like that.

The cedars and redwoods which produced the amber you see in these fossils produced so much sap because they were absolutely gigantic. The giant trees have been lost to deforestation. The little trees you see in forests today will never trap bugs in fossils like this.