My Freedom, Your Freedom

Freedom is a big word and it encompasses many things.

what got me thinking lately, is that sometimes people applaud and champion freedom, and around the corner they applaud when people are rubed by their freedom, and I just can't wrap my head around double standards...

Georg Kreisler said it better, here is the english translation

When he misses the train that carries him to freedom
When he doesn't see the train and unnecessarily complicates everything
Yes yes, then there are rules he has to respect
Then his employer might say to him:

My freedom doesn't have to be your freedom
My freedom yes, your freedom no
My freedom is guaranteed by the constitution
Yours doesn't really matter

My freedom means I can make big sales
Your freedom means I might employ you
And since you have to buy my wares anyway, come work for me
So that your freedom doesn't cost me anything

And so it remains
That my freedom always continues to be my freedom
Your freedom continues to be part of my freedom
And if I don't have my freedom, you don't have yours
So my freedom becomes your responsibility
That's why I tell you

Defend my freedom with a weapon in your hand
And with a weapon in the hands of your children
So that when they work, none of your children ever forget
What freedom is

My freedom is always your first commandment
Remain true to my freedom until your death
If you don't find that logical, just remember:
Without my freedom, you're out of a job

Yes freedom is different from unrestraint
Freedom means to get busy
Manliness and sweat
I'll tell you what I think freedom is these days:
To leave things as they are.

So obviously, my freedom is always more important than your freedom
My freedom yes, your freedom no
My freedom is already hundreds of years old
Yours might come at some point

But for now, nothing will come of your ambitions
Because you don't have any power, nor a corporation
I'd be pretty stupid if I let go of my freedom for yours
So I will keep my freedom, you don't get yours
Yet.

lyricstranslate.com...

Here is the original, be warned if you're not steady in german you'll get dizzy...

a reply to: Terpene

Freedom means , if I didn't commit some crime, leave me TF alone. That's it.

a reply to: ancientlight

But you did, they just haven't made up the crime yet.

a reply to: Terpene

As many on the left have pointed out, freedom is also the ability to willingly give away your freedom and the freedom of others.

Freedom seems such an ugly word from the left unless they speak of freedom from responsibility or freedom from individuality or even freedom from speaking freely or freedom from owning firearms.

But (like the left) we'll all own our own definitions to what freedom actually is, what it means, and what it is worth.

a reply to: HeirHeart

Why do we always cling to our liberties and struggle to grant others theirs?

Don't we all win by grantig liberties and we all loose by restricting them?

Ancientlight said it best, I guess...

But in the context of the song text how free are we really?

how much of our freedoms are depending on others?

I feel like Almost all modern technological convinencies are a group effort, a chain with many links.
anyone of those links is free to strip us of that freedom at any time.
Has materialistic liberty anything to do with freedom?

a reply to: DBCowboy

That's great, let's hear it!

Expressing ones own position, without using ones favorite boogie man to define that position isn't easy, I know.
You should try it, nevertheless.

It sounds less reactionary, and more self defined.

a reply to: Terpene

Who are you lumping into "we" along with you? To offer an answer tho, it's probably because this is where we make our individuality. Your first responsibility is to you because it just makes more sense than you as an individual being responsible for everyone else.

As far as how free we are. I think the only choice we really have in this world is to do or die, and it's up to us to decide which of those is the lesser of two evils.

originally posted by: Terpene
a reply to: DBCowboy

That's great, let's hear it!

Expressing ones own position, without using ones favorite boogie man to define that position isn't easy, I know.
You should try it, nevertheless.

It sounds less reactionary, and more self defined.

Freedom from authoritarianism, freedom from socialism, freedom from tyranny.

Those aren't good enough?

How about the freedom to raise and teach my children as I see fit?

That sound about right?

Freedoms enshrined in the Constitution, didn't see that in your OP.

Got something against the Constitution?

Why are you so anti-American?

a reply to: HeirHeart

Didn't read the OP?
Thats ok, it happens to the most veteran...

Defend my freedom with a weapon in your hand
And with a weapon in the hands of your children
So that when they work, none of your children ever forget
What freedom is

My freedom is always your first commandment
Remain true to my freedom until your death
If you don't find that logical, just remember:
Without my freedom, you're out of a job

That sums up the context i referred to when saying...

But in the context of the song text how free are we really?
how much of our freedoms are depending on others?

We the working class... Or are you one of those elitists that are above the plebs daily struggle, and didn't feel adressed?

originally posted by: Terpene
Freedom is a big word and it encompasses many things.

what got me thinking lately, is that sometimes people applaud and champion freedom, and around the corner they applaud when people are rubed by their freedom, and I just can't wrap my head around double standards...

Georg Kreisler said it better, here is the english translation

When he misses the train that carries him to freedom
When he doesn't see the train and unnecessarily complicates everything
Yes yes, then there are rules he has to respect
Then his employer might say to him:

My freedom doesn't have to be your freedom
My freedom yes, your freedom no
My freedom is guaranteed by the constitution
Yours doesn't really matter

My freedom means I can make big sales
Your freedom means I might employ you
And since you have to buy my wares anyway, come work for me
So that your freedom doesn't cost me anything

And so it remains
That my freedom always continues to be my freedom
Your freedom continues to be part of my freedom
And if I don't have my freedom, you don't have yours
So my freedom becomes your responsibility
That's why I tell you

Defend my freedom with a weapon in your hand
And with a weapon in the hands of your children
So that when they work, none of your children ever forget
What freedom is

My freedom is always your first commandment
Remain true to my freedom until your death
If you don't find that logical, just remember:
Without my freedom, you're out of a job

Yes freedom is different from unrestraint
Freedom means to get busy
Manliness and sweat
I'll tell you what I think freedom is these days:
To leave things as they are.

So obviously, my freedom is always more important than your freedom
My freedom yes, your freedom no
My freedom is already hundreds of years old
Yours might come at some point

But for now, nothing will come of your ambitions
Because you don't have any power, nor a corporation
I'd be pretty stupid if I let go of my freedom for yours
So I will keep my freedom, you don't get yours
Yet.

lyricstranslate.com...

Here is the original, be warned if you're not steady in german you'll get dizzy...

All of these maladies and bad acts - guarded against for each of us, by the constitution.
That is if it’s used as written, with a little precedent legally.
And not twisted and stretched in different directions for each and every case, to placate some nasty mob. For votes and money.
Neither the govt nor the big corporations can treat you like this if the constitution is followed as written.
The last half dozen wars we sent our young people to were unconstitutional. The rules were simply ignored.
Not the constitution’s fault.
The constitution prohibits monopoly and indentured servitude. Not the constitution’s fault that politicians take bribes to allow these things.

a reply to: Terpene

I find that to be a wonderful quote Terp. Thanks.

a reply to: DBCowboy

The constitution is actually great! I think most don't know what powerful piece of paper they have at their disposal. They'd rather waste their time spewing political divide, when they could end corruption that reaches far beyond they're boarders.

It seems that it has to be "we the people".
not as in divided, but united, otherwise its just political opposition which is an integer part of the political system.
Right?

unfortunately "we the people" is divided, and that is by design.
You have only yourself to blame for, I'm affraid...
we all had to learn how to deal with rapidly evolving propaganda techniques.
It's sad to see such a great base for the people, to actually keep corruption out of government, just getting ignored...

the USA has no monopoly on freedom either, so I don't really understand why it should have a special place.

Freedom from authoritarianism, freedom from socialism, freedom from tyranny.

Those aren't good enough?

How about the freedom to raise and teach my children as I see fit?

That sound about right?

Sure... It's a short list and they seem to be the things that scare you...
Most western world uphold those freedoms for all who don't infringe that freedom for others...

To make one thing perfectly clear I think the US constitution is one of, if not the most powerful tool ever given to any nations sheep's.

And you're all fools for not using the rights you've been granted to actually make a change that could impact the world, instead you hate about white supremacy and wokes online.

Freedom I guess

a reply to: Terpene

The anti-Americans in our country caused the divide. It started way back but increased with the left and Obama.

Just because I won't take a knee to Socialism doesn't mean I'm the divisive one.

Just because I refuse to compromise on principles does not mean I'm the divisive one.

Might want to ask the fine folks why they ask folks like me to always compromise.

Why should I always have to compromise when no one else is?

a reply to: Terpene

No offense, but what Germans in Germany consider freedom has always mystified me. I spent about 2 months there in Weisbaden and made a couple of friends. It was a while back, 1989, and what you expect from your society is a bit different than what Americans expect from their society. Your culture goes way way back and in your family back then you may have still heard talk of what it was like for the common man and woman before Bismark days and how horrible it was compared to the socialist things that Bismark put into place socializing and thus bettering the plight of the ex serf in fuedal systems.

In the USA, no one has that culture really as we were all allowed -except slaves - and not that once freed, Irish, black, or whatever, they were allowed to purchase property. Or they were allowed to start their own business. And initially here people did not pay property or income tax - that is why so many people immigrated here. Because that was a freedom not available anywhere else in the world at that time, and to this day. I mean maybe there were some places like Hong Kong and Singapore that sort of have/had that, but that is it. And that is pretty much what is in our blood and what was taken from us and alot of us want that back, but European World Wars saw to it that we had to have all that taken away from us, so forgive me if I chose not to listen to German minstrels basically singing praise to Bismark, for me it falls on deaf ears.

a reply to: DBCowboy

It takes two to tango... "He started it" is childs rhetoric. Followed by victim mentality.

show me on the doll, where they forced you to compromise...

For me 911 and the subsequent patriot act was the moment I realized, that the propaganda machine in the USA has triumphed over the peoples minds.

I couldn't really take anything as an honest reflected concern of the people anymore.
It was obviously all propaganda...

I have to say Trump was fun, and kind of a breather in the whole propaganda machinery. Not that it wasn't in full swing but they were so preoccupied to talk crap about him they completely ditched their usual baseline. And it was world wide, never have I seen so many news outlets blow the same horn. It became blatantly obvious that nothing is to be taken at face value, and we should only rely on real life experiences, and never on media, to ever asses a situation that could affect others.

And the mean tweets deflected so much of that reciprocal hate amongst the people and concentrate it around him, it was genius.

a reply to: greendust

And initially here people did not pay property or income tax - that is why so many people immigrated here.

....that is pretty much what is in our blood and what was taken from us and alot of us want that back...

And with his last breath, the mouse asks for the chees.
Maybe if he looks very cute, and says nicely pitty please.

a reply to: Terpene

lol

I won't take a knee to socialists and you claim it's my fault.

I won't compromise on principle and you claim it's my fault.

You lost the damned argument the moment you posted the OP.

Don't you have some rights to infringe upon?

a reply to: TerryMcGuire

It takes some balls to say something nice about me, especially in these neck of the woods....

a reply to: Terpene

Take this job and shove it
I ain't working here no more
My woman done left and took all the reason
I was working for
You better not try to stand in my way
As I'm a-walkin' out the door
Take this job and shove it
I ain't working here no more
I've been workin' in this factory
For now on fifteen years
All this time I watched my woman
Drownin' in a pool of tears
And I've seen a lot of good folk die
That had a lot of bills to pay
I'd give the shirt right offa' my back
If I had the guts to say
Take this job and shove it
I ain't working here no more
My woman done left and took all the reason
I was workin' for
You better not try to stand in my way
As I'm a-walkin' out the door
Take this job and shove it
I ain't workin' here no more
Well that foreman, he's a regular dog
The line boss, he's a fool
Got a brand new flattop haircut
Lord, he thinks he's cool
One of these days I'm gonna' blow my top
And that sucker, he's gonna' pay
Lord, I can't wait to see their faces
When I get the nerve to say
Take this job and shove it
I ain't working here no more
My woman done left and took all the reason
I was workin' for
You better not try to stand in my way
As I'm a-walkin' out the door
Take this job and shove it
I ain't workin' here no more
Take this job and shove it

Johnny Paycheck song.

a reply to: quintessentone

If I had the guts to say

So it's just lack of curage, and repressed deceptions, due to an empty life.

This creates pressure that can be dangerous but if channeled exactly where it's needed it's very powerful propaganda tool.