Imperfect Vaccination Can Enhance the Transmission of Highly Virulent Pathogens?

A research article from 2015 points out that a vaccine that simply eliminates symptoms in the host but does not prevent the host from shedding the virus can help spread more dangerous variations of a virus. The study which examined chickens vaccinated against Marek's disease virus examined if leaky vaccines (vaccinations that do not prevent the host from shedding the virus) prolonged or enhanced more dangerous strains of the virus which would have typically been removed by the death of the host.

Imperfect Vaccination Can Enhance the Transmission of Highly Virulent Pathogens

Our data show that anti-disease vaccines that do not prevent transmission can create conditions that promote the emergence of pathogen strains that cause more severe disease in unvaccinated hosts.

This is somewhat of a lengthy article but you won't need to read everything about Rhode Island Reds transmitting Marek's disease. The first few paragraphs have a good analysis of the study.

It does seem that the current COVID vaccinations are doing more to stop the host from having symptoms and the vaccines are not totally preventing infected, asymptomatic hosts from spreading the virus. This looks to be just the "leaky vaccine" that was mentioned in this study. I've seen quite a few nods that the current delta variant of the vaccine seems to be spread by vaccinated individuals.

C.D.C. Internal Report Calls Delta Variant as Contagious as Chickenpox

Infections in vaccinated Americans are rare, compared with those in unvaccinated people, the document said. But when they occur, vaccinated people may spread the virus just as easily.

This makes you wonder if we're making things worse. I don't believe that we actually know at this point. Possibly 5 years from now we'll have a better solution and better vaccines. There's still so much to learn. Simply having a vaccination doesn't mean we've tricked nature. Not just yet.

I heard this on Joe Rogan.
Also the person who did the study, responded.
www.forbes.com... =6343c4df7bd1

Read responds: “We're talking a very different virus and very different vaccines. The details in biology really matter a lot. The chicken vaccines we worked with, the first-generation vaccine, definitely reduced disease, severity and death.” But unlike the COVID mRNA vaccines, the chicken vaccine “didn't stop transmission at all.” And this is one of the key differences between what was being studied in Read’s paper and our current situation with the global pandemic. “Those [vaccinated] chickens just kept churning out the virus for weeks and weeks and weeks.” Again, this is a key difference. “It’s a very different virus from SARS-2. A key issue here is transmissibility.”

This came up a few weeks ago here and it's a valid concern.

This is a far more recent article and you can make of it what you will. There's no real way of knowing if either outcome will be a factor in covid 19 at present though as far as I can tell.
www.poultryworld.net...





a reply to: dbates

a reply to: dbates
A couple of responses:

First, that study you referenced is the same one that everyone always references when this question comes up. What I think a lot of people miss is that the Marek’s disease virus that this study is based on is wildly different in its behavior than the coronavirus that causes COVID19. In particular, Marek’s virus is “highly virulent”, as the title of the study clearly pointed out. It can end up with a nearly 100% mortality rate to the unvaccinated in some chicken barns. I think the study authors had to essentially hand pick a nasty virus of this type in order to be able to show an effect. Infection mortality rate for COVID19 is around 1% in the unvaccinated, averaged over the population.

Second, the mRNA vaccines are actually pretty good at preventing infection, not just suppressing the symptoms. Here’s a pretty accessible article in Scientific American that discusses this:

www.scientificamerican.com...

a reply to: 1947boomer

Yes but Marek did not start out with that high of a mortality rate. The mortality rate among unvaccinated chickens rose following the implementation of the vaccine. That is why the theory exists that the vaccine caused enhancement of the virus.

Mareks is mainly an issue in commercial chicken factories.

The increase in mortality may be due more to higher stocking levels and low levels of hygiene than on tradition farming methods.

Chickens in good health and a natural environment are far more likely to contract mareks and not die.

Also see my link above regarding possible new info on leaky vaccines for mareks.



a reply to: Chalcedony

originally posted by: Chalcedony
a reply to: 1947boomer

Yes but Marek did not start out with that high of a mortality rate. The mortality rate among unvaccinated chickens rose following the implementation of the vaccine. That is why the theory exists that the vaccine caused enhancement of the virus.

See the statement from Lardo5150, above; he/she said it more elegantly than I did.

I think the main points are that starting with a high mortality rate (even if it’s not 100%) results in a lot more evolutionary pressure on the virus to evolve and the ability of an infected but vaccinated individual to shed viruses continuously is what kills off the unvaccinated population. Neither of those things apply to COVID19.

That’s why the abstract of the referenced study ends with the sentence:

“The future challenge is to identify whether there are other types of vaccines used in animals and humans that might also generate these evolutionary risks.”

It’s not a given that the answer is yes.

A lot of antibiotics contain chemistries that moderate the immune system but also selectively target a type of bacteria or fungus that is causing the symptoms in people. Doctors are trained to try to identify what kind of infection is being treated to properly give the right antibiotic for the disease the person has.

So using immune system moderators is done in meds but with the mRNA vaccines I have a feeling that there may be some complications from doing this with less resistance to other diseases. Usually I can find information on side effects and method of action of other medicines, but presently there is no information so far available as to if these covid vaccines have excessive problems with this. No evidence does not mean it is real or unreal, it just means there is no evidence. I guess we will know in another two months when winter comes back with seasonal illnesses or if there is a breakout of food poisoning that causes more severe disease than it should have. But alas, the FDA and CDC won't admit they were wrong and will deny all evidence to make it look unrelated if it does happen.

a reply to: dbates


Not Only that , but Most of the People who took the Vaccines will be DEAD Soon...............


(VIRAL VIDEO) Dr. Sean Brooks Warns Vaccinated Will Die Soon!


banned.video...

That is exactly the problem with the current vaccines. We know they do not stop the transmission of the virus to or from vaccinated people. But the vaccines do change the severity of the virus. That alone should be sounding alarm bells in TPTB but that is a lost cause with the current administration.

Just like ineffective or incomplete use of antibiotics leads to stronger infections that defy treatment, there is a likely hood that these vaccines will only lead to a more dangerous virus.

Most vaccine are leaky...just the way it goes. RNA based ones really leaky. DNA based viruses like smallpox are pure since smallpox has only 2 variants in the last 30,000 years.

I think just about ALL animal vaccines that are used heavily are leaky, so we don't see this assumption from the article there.

How long have we got?

Is it worth thinking about what I'd like for Christmas?


a reply to: Zanti Misfit

a reply to: nonspecific

According to the Video I Posted , the Gentlemen mentioned 5 Years Max . Hope your House is in Order by that Time .

a reply to: dbates

Stating what a lot of us have been thinking...

originally posted by: Chalcedony
a reply to: 1947boomer

Yes but Marek did not start out with that high of a mortality rate. The mortality rate among unvaccinated chickens rose following the implementation of the vaccine. That is why the theory exists that the vaccine caused enhancement of the virus.

This battle has been fought for 50 years and we're still no closer to eliminating Marek's disease. The solution is just to vaccinate all chickens forever I guess. Curious what the mortality rates would be with the new strains if vaccinations were stopped.

Marek’s disease vaccination needed now more than ever

Leukosis condemnations are as low as they are today simply because industry has been vaccinating 100% of broiler chickens (and layers and breeders) consistently for approximately 50 years.