White House also involved in advising DNI not to share whistleblower complaint

originally posted by: Sillyolme
a reply to: Sookiechacha

That is the reason they wanted him out.
And obviously it was not Joe Biden acting on behalf of himself, when the international community at large wanted this corrupt criminal out.
But its convenient for trump to vilify Biden and try and make it look like there's something here.
This attempt to get dirt on an opponent is going to backfire on him big time.


It looks like this is the reason that Dan Coats quit in the first place.

So Hunter Biden having his daddy get him a job in Ukraine that he had no qualifications for seems ok to you?

The company that Hunter Biden had his daddy get him a job at was being investigated for numerous violations. But just the company, not Hunter, is the MSNBC and CNN talking point this morning. Hunter definitely did nothing wrong.

Everything about this entire situation that involves fraud, international crimes, Hunter and Joe Biden, Ukraine is all Donald Trumps fault. I finally see your point.

Lolz🤪

originally posted by: Sookiechacha
a reply to: Grambler

There is no proof trump extorted Ukraine

There is evidence Biden did

There's plenty of evidence that Trump did.

There is no evidence that Biden did what he is being accused of, which is bribing the Ukrainian president to protect his son. There is evidence that Biden lobbied on behalf of the Obama Administration, and was authorized to use US loan guarantees as leverage, on behalf of Western values in the Ukraine.

Show me the proof of trump extorting

There is none, only a complaint he a whistle blower something happened

We don’t know what the whistle blower is saying happened, we didn’t my know of the whistle blower is accurate. We have reports it was actually Ukraine reaching out to trump not the other way around. We have left wing Jews sites reporting no foreign aid or money was ever mentioned in the call, and that the whistle blower never even heard the call

But apparently you have proof, so let’s see it

Meanwhile you are not being honest if you say trump did exactly what we know Biden did you would say it’s perfectly fine

We know Biden threatened to withhold a billion dollars if they didn’t fire the prospect that was in charge of yne investigation into his sons company

If that was trump, and I said “oh it’s cool, there no proof he wanted him fired over investigating his son, there were other reasons”

You would say that’s outrageous

originally posted by: Sookiechacha
a reply to: Grambler

There is no proof trump extorted Ukraine

There is evidence Biden did

There's plenty of evidence that Trump did.

There is no evidence that Biden did what he is being accused of, which is bribing the Ukrainian president to protect his son. There is evidence that Biden lobbied on behalf of the Obama Administration, and was authorized to use US loan guarantees as leverage, on behalf of Western values in the Ukraine.

Its 100% coincidence that Hunter Biden was involved in this correct?

That is exactly what you are saying, so I want you to state in on the record

a reply to: Scepticaldem

Hunter Biden had 0 experience in the field that the Ukranian company paid him millions to be on their board of directors.

LOL
NOW you're worried about a person's experience? Hello?

At any rate...

Biden received a bachelor's degree from Georgetown University and a Juris Doctor from Yale Law Schoo

From 2001 to 2008, Biden was a founding partner of Oldaker, Biden, and Belair, LLP, a Washington DC-based law firm.[9] He also served as a partner and board member of the mergers and acquisitions firm Eudora Global. Biden was chief executive officer, and later chairman, of the hedge fund Paradigm Global Advisors, founded in 1991 by Dr. James Park. At MBNA, a major US bank, Biden was employed as a senior vice president.[8] Following that, Biden was appointed by Bill Clinton to serve in the United States Department of Commerce[8] under Secretaries Norman Mineta and William M. Daley. He was director of E-commerce policy issues in the Department of Commerce.

en.wikipedia.org...

a reply to: Grambler

We don’t know what the whistle blower is saying happened

You're right. It could be, and probably is, way worse than what we already know. If it wasn't, the White House wouldn't be so scared, Rudy Giuliani wouldn't have gone on his distraction tour on TV and Barr wouldn't be breaking the law to protect the president.

originally posted by: Sookiechacha
a reply to: Scepticaldem

Hunter Biden had 0 experience in the field that the Ukranian company paid him millions to be on their board of directors.

LOL
NOW you're worried about a person's experience? Hello?

At any rate...

Biden received a bachelor's degree from Georgetown University and a Juris Doctor from Yale Law Schoo

From 2001 to 2008, Biden was a founding partner of Oldaker, Biden, and Belair, LLP, a Washington DC-based law firm.[9] He also served as a partner and board member of the mergers and acquisitions firm Eudora Global. Biden was chief executive officer, and later chairman, of the hedge fund Paradigm Global Advisors, founded in 1991 by Dr. James Park. At MBNA, a major US bank, Biden was employed as a senior vice president.[8] Following that, Biden was appointed by Bill Clinton to serve in the United States Department of Commerce[8] under Secretaries Norman Mineta and William M. Daley. He was director of E-commerce policy issues in the Department of Commerce.

en.wikipedia.org...

yea! He was doing so great here that he decided f it, I'm moving to the Ukraine!

Lolz🤪

a reply to: Sookiechacha

Yes it could be bad

Perhaps trump promises to withhold aid until they got rid of the prosecutors that let Biden go free

But as long as trump just says “oh it wasn’t about Biden, it’s that this prosecutor was bad aside from that”

Then you will admit this is perfectly legitimate, right?

originally posted by: Grambler
a reply to: Sookiechacha

Yes it could be bad

Perhaps trump promises to withhold aid until they got rid of the prosecutors that let Biden go free

But as long as trump just says “oh it wasn’t about Biden, it’s that this prosecutor was bad aside from that”

Then you will admit this is perfectly legitimate, right?

No, it wont admit that.

It wont even go on the record as saying that Hunter Biden had absolutely nothing to do with this. Its credibility would be completely gone if it relied on facts and common sense.

a reply to: Grambler

Why do you keep ignoring the facts of the actual situation of the time? Do you take cues from Rudy Giuliani?

Shokin was appointed General Prosecutor of Ukraine on 10 February 2015. He became deeply unpopular and was accused of blocking major cases against allies and influential figures and hindering the fight against corruption in Ukraine. Various street protests demanding Shokin's resignation were held and his Deputy Prosecutor, Vitaly Kasko, resigned on 15 February 2016 denouncing the corruption and lawlessness of the Prosecutor's office. US Vice-President Joe Biden lobbied for Shokin resignation and the Obama Administration withheld a billion dollars in loan guarantees for the time Shokin held office.

Prosecutor General Shokin on 16 February 2016 submitted a letter of resignation. Although the next day an official of the prosecution office stated "As far as I know he has taken a paid leave". On 19 February 2016 presidential press secretary Sviatoslav Tsegolko wrote on Twitter that the presidential administration had received an official letter of resignation from Shokin. On 16 March 2016 an official of the prosecution office stated that Shokin had resumed his work. On 16 March 2016 Shokin had not been formally dismissed. Shokin was formally dismissed in a parliamentary vote on 29 March 2016. Following his dismissal Shokin went into retirement.

en.wikipedia.org...

And...

The European Union has welcomed the dismissal of Ukraine’s scandal-ridden prosecutor general and called for a crackdown on corruption, even as the country’s political crisis deepened over efforts to form a new ruling coalition and appoint a new prime minister.

Ukraine’s parliament voted overwhelmingly to fire Viktor Shokin, ridding the beleaguered prosecutor’s office of a figure who is accused of blocking major cases against allies and influential figures and stymying moves to root out graft.

“This decision creates an opportunity to make a fresh start in the prosecutor general’s office. I hope that the new prosecutor general will ensure that [his] office . . . becomes independent from political influence and pressure and enjoys public trust,” said Jan Tombinski, the EU’s envoy to Ukraine.

“There is still a lack of tangible results of investigations into serious cases . . . as well as investigations of high-level officials within the prosecutor general’s office,” he added.

www.irishtimes.com...

a reply to: Sookiechacha

So I have linked the washington post (which hates trump) saying that money and aid was never mentioned in the phone call

I have posted CNN (which hates trump) saying the whistle blower didnt even hear the ohone cakk.

I have posted The Hill saying several Ukrainian and US officials said in fact it was the Ukraine that wanted to reach out to the US about crimes committed by democrats.

Yet still you are convinced there is proof of extortion, though you cant provide any

Now we have the Minsister of foriegn affairs from the Ukraine itself saying Trump exerted no pressure on kUkraine president

Minister of Foreign Affairs Vadym Prystaiko denies the information that U.S. state leader Donald Trump puts pressure on Ukraine's President Volodymyr Zelensky. The Head of the Ministry stated that during the interview with Hromadske on the occasion of The Wall Street Journal publication. The article told about Trump reportedly asked Zelensky to help Giuliani to investigate the work of Joe Biden's son in Ukraine.

112.international...

He must be lying to though, right?

All of th9s reporting must be inaccurate or lies, and you have the super secret proof you cant show us that trump extorted the Ukraine

meanwhile, you simultaneously believe Biden admitting to threaten to hold 1 billion dollars from the ukraine unless the fired the prosecutor who happened to be in charge of the investigation into his sons company is not extortion and absolutely fine

originally posted by: Sookiechacha
a reply to: Grambler

Why do you keep ignoring the facts of the actual situation of the time? Do you take cues from Rudy Giuliani?

Shokin was appointed General Prosecutor of Ukraine on 10 February 2015. He became deeply unpopular and was accused of blocking major cases against allies and influential figures and hindering the fight against corruption in Ukraine. Various street protests demanding Shokin's resignation were held and his Deputy Prosecutor, Vitaly Kasko, resigned on 15 February 2016 denouncing the corruption and lawlessness of the Prosecutor's office. US Vice-President Joe Biden lobbied for Shokin resignation and the Obama Administration withheld a billion dollars in loan guarantees for the time Shokin held office.

Prosecutor General Shokin on 16 February 2016 submitted a letter of resignation. Although the next day an official of the prosecution office stated "As far as I know he has taken a paid leave". On 19 February 2016 presidential press secretary Sviatoslav Tsegolko wrote on Twitter that the presidential administration had received an official letter of resignation from Shokin. On 16 March 2016 an official of the prosecution office stated that Shokin had resumed his work. On 16 March 2016 Shokin had not been formally dismissed. Shokin was formally dismissed in a parliamentary vote on 29 March 2016. Following his dismissal Shokin went into retirement.

en.wikipedia.org...

And...

The European Union has welcomed the dismissal of Ukraine’s scandal-ridden prosecutor general and called for a crackdown on corruption, even as the country’s political crisis deepened over efforts to form a new ruling coalition and appoint a new prime minister.

Ukraine’s parliament voted overwhelmingly to fire Viktor Shokin, ridding the beleaguered prosecutor’s office of a figure who is accused of blocking major cases against allies and influential figures and stymying moves to root out graft.

“This decision creates an opportunity to make a fresh start in the prosecutor general’s office. I hope that the new prosecutor general will ensure that [his] office . . . becomes independent from political influence and pressure and enjoys public trust,” said Jan Tombinski, the EU’s envoy to Ukraine.

“There is still a lack of tangible results of investigations into serious cases . . . as well as investigations of high-level officials within the prosecutor general’s office,” he added.

www.irishtimes.com...

So the new guy that VP Biden payed to take over looking into Ukrainian corruption also took a look into Hunter Bidens gas company correct?!?!?!? Well the investigation stopped because Ukraine finally got that check.

Can France pay investigators here in the USA to stop investigating things? That would be a crazy way of doing business, no?

Lolz🤪

a reply to: Sookiechacha

How is that responsive to anything I typed?

Biden admitted they would not fire shokin until he threatened them with a billion dollars.



And Again, so if Trump threatened to withhold a billion dollars unless the prosecutors that stopped investigating Bidens son were fired, and the ukranian government says "hey this guy was a bad prosector anyway"

You would say yep thats fine?

Of course not

a reply to: Grambler

Biden admitted they would not fire shokin until he threatened them with a billion dollars.

Biden "bragged" about his leverage. That doesn't mean that the Ukrainian people, who were staging protests, the EU, the USA and the Ukrainian Parliament didn't want him out and weren't working on his oustering as well.

This wasn't Biden's brainchild. He was there as Vice President of the United States, on behalf of the business and values of the United States and her allies. He was authorized to threaten to withhold the US loan guarantee due to the state prosecutor's corruption.

None of this justifies the actual facts of Trump illegally coercing the Ukraine president to open an investigation into his political rivals.

The rest of your post is just hypothetic and hyperbolic distraction.

originally posted by: Sookiechacha
a reply to: Grambler

Why do you keep ignoring the facts of the actual situation of the time? Do you take cues from Rudy Giuliani?

Shokin was appointed General Prosecutor of Ukraine on 10 February 2015. He became deeply unpopular and was accused of blocking major cases against allies and influential figures and hindering the fight against corruption in Ukraine. Various street protests demanding Shokin's resignation were held and his Deputy Prosecutor, Vitaly Kasko, resigned on 15 February 2016 denouncing the corruption and lawlessness of the Prosecutor's office. US Vice-President Joe Biden lobbied for Shokin resignation and the Obama Administration withheld a billion dollars in loan guarantees for the time Shokin held office.

Prosecutor General Shokin on 16 February 2016 submitted a letter of resignation. Although the next day an official of the prosecution office stated "As far as I know he has taken a paid leave". On 19 February 2016 presidential press secretary Sviatoslav Tsegolko wrote on Twitter that the presidential administration had received an official letter of resignation from Shokin. On 16 March 2016 an official of the prosecution office stated that Shokin had resumed his work. On 16 March 2016 Shokin had not been formally dismissed. Shokin was formally dismissed in a parliamentary vote on 29 March 2016. Following his dismissal Shokin went into retirement.

en.wikipedia.org...

And...

The European Union has welcomed the dismissal of Ukraine’s scandal-ridden prosecutor general and called for a crackdown on corruption, even as the country’s political crisis deepened over efforts to form a new ruling coalition and appoint a new prime minister.

Ukraine’s parliament voted overwhelmingly to fire Viktor Shokin, ridding the beleaguered prosecutor’s office of a figure who is accused of blocking major cases against allies and influential figures and stymying moves to root out graft.

“This decision creates an opportunity to make a fresh start in the prosecutor general’s office. I hope that the new prosecutor general will ensure that [his] office . . . becomes independent from political influence and pressure and enjoys public trust,” said Jan Tombinski, the EU’s envoy to Ukraine.

“There is still a lack of tangible results of investigations into serious cases . . . as well as investigations of high-level officials within the prosecutor general’s office,” he added.

www.irishtimes.com...

www.politifact.com...

This article covers it pretty good from a leftist point of view you can understand.

It states that Hunter Biden joined up with a couple other children from Democrat families with influence and started an investment firm. It specializes in "working with companies that require political influence ".....

Doesnt seem shady at all right?

a reply to: Scepticaldem

Doesnt seem shady at all right?

So?

Your curiosity doesn't justify the President of the United States holding needed military aid over a foreign leader's head, while demanding they work with the president's personal attorney and open an investigation into the president's political opponent.

a reply to: Sookiechacha

You have no proof of trump coercing Ukraine’s President

The Ukrainian foreign minister says that is a lie.

Do you claim he is lying as well?

Can you post your proof?

Meanwhile the fact you believe that Biden’s threat wasn’t the reason this prosecutor got fired is laughable


So now you want us to believe they were going to fire this guy, didn’t, Biden said do it now or lose a billion, they said your not the president, Biden said call Obama he will agree

Then Biden said you got six hours and I’m leaving


And at that point, they just happened to fire Shokin but it had nothing to do with Biden’s threat?

Hahahahaha!!!!

originally posted by: Sookiechacha
a reply to: Scepticaldem

Doesnt seem shady at all right?

So?

Your curiosity doesn't justify the President of the United States holding needed military aid over a foreign leader's head, while demanding they work with the president's personal attorney and open an investigation into the president's political opponent.

Proof please

Cnn says the whistleblower didn’t hear the call

The Washington post says aid was never mentioned

The Ukrainian foreign minister says no pressure was out in them

You are just spreading rumors with no proof to ignore Biden’s crimes, and it’s really sad

originally posted by: Sookiechacha
a reply to: Scepticaldem

Doesnt seem shady at all right?

So?

Your curiosity doesn't justify the President of the United States holding needed military aid over a foreign leader's head, while demanding they work with the president's personal attorney and open an investigation into the president's political opponent.

So AGAIN I ask you. This has nothing to do with Hunter Biden correct?

The article I previously posted for you from politifact goes as far as to say sleepy "Joe Biden didnt even know at the time of the billion dollar transaction that Hunter had any ties at all to Ukraine " . Says he heard about it through the media.....

So you think it is wrong to say to a government that you claim is corrupt ,(Ukraine, as biden withheld money from them due to corruption and you were ok with that) , what ever happened to that corruption investigations into Bidens son? You know, the one where no one has any idea what he was being paid for besides political influence?


Sounds similar to the way you guys can justify the Clinton foundation losing 98% of its donations, but swear it wasnt peddling political influence.....

Try harder

Lolz🤪

a reply to: Grambler

Proof please

Do you mean evidence? Because you use the words proof and evidence differently when it comes to Trump and Biden.

The evidence is in the timeline.

fortune.com...

The Ukrainian foreign minister says no pressure was out in them

Of course he did. And NOAA said that a hurricane was threatening Alabama! LOL

A senior adviser to Ukraine’s interior minister said the country is prepared to investigate Joe Biden’s son Hunter, but only if there is a formal request from President Trump.

“As soon as there is an official request," Ukraine will look into the matter, but “currently there is no open investigation,” Anton Geraschenko told the Daily Beast.
.....
“Clearly, Trump is now looking for kompromat to discredit his opponent Biden, to take revenge for his friend Paul Manafort, who is serving seven years in prison,” said Geraschenko, using the Russian term for blackmail.
“We do not investigate Biden in Ukraine, since we have not received a single official request to do so,” he said.

www.washingtonexaminer.com...

So, if Trump wants the Ukraines to find dirt on his opponent, he's going to have to make a formal request. No pressure! LOL

a reply to: Scepticaldem

What you don't get is, the nature of the so called "dirt" that Trump is extorting from the Ukrainians doesn't matter. The fact that he's extorting a foreign government for "dirt" on his political opponent is the issue.