The problem of Africa.

a reply to: Spiramirabilis

This saddens me as an animal lover. Already animals have found themelves cut off from migration and/or foraging routes. As the population expands there will be less and less space available.

Consider North America....had we not slaughtered the entirety of the buffalo in the plains, would we have any real agriculture to speak of? And how would our cities look?

Africa is the last wilderness were you find big game and large predators. For me, seeing human population and economic growth in Africa is extremely bittersweet. Think about it: all the big ticket items at zoo's derive from Africa, save for a couple animals like the orangutan. None of them can exist among densely populated humanity.

a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

This saddens me as an animal lover. Already animals have found themelves cut off from migration and/or foraging routes. As the population expands there will be less and less space available.

Well, this would be quite the conversation Tex - if I was really going to follow through :-)

It would also all be mostly off topic. Our world is changing and it's no longer the one that we grew up reading about in books. We're going to have to adapt and innovate. Or fight each other for what's left until there are only a few of us left standing. Let's just say this is the point in the conversation where I usually say it's not a good time to be sentimental - or nostalgic.

I am an animal lover too. My concerns zigzag from preserving our planet's ecosystems, into sustainability and animal rights. So, I'll leave it there

I have a very romantic view of Africa - like a lot of people. My dad lived there for several years and I still haven't managed to see it. But there are also the many people that live there who are entitled to improve their lives exactly the way we have. Hopefully they can learn from our mistakes. Africa can't exist as some kind of amusement park vacation land for the rest of us. I think there are ways to have it all - but people being what they are...every last elephant will be dead before those options become workable

Having said that - I feel the same. I can't imagine the entire continent of Africa gobbled up and covered in asphalt, dams and fences. Cul-de-sacs and strip malls where there used to be pronghorns and jackrabbits here. We call it progress :-)

a reply to: cenpuppie

Very interesting, I have always thought that instead of exploitation and colonization that the third world should be looked at as the final frontier on earth for opportunities, investment and infrastructure projects. I would hope that the African people can be taught to eventually do those types of projects on their own with minimal help from foreigners.

I believe birth control, safe sex and education is extremely necessary and can do a lot to help to slow down it's population growth.

a reply to: Spiramirabilis

You and I likely agree to an extent that we'd not disagree. I can't/won't dispute what you say.

One positive(?) hope is that we can revitalize the mammoths in the taiga. It seems to be a region that humanity prefers not to inhabit. It would at least be a living preservation of the genome. One i have mixed feelings on as well.

a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

It's a brave new world - ya know?

I think...in moments when I'm feeling all warm and fuzzy about mankind, and glass-half-fully, that we can ride all this out and make things work. For all of us

Preserving our resources, managing wildlife, feeding the world. New clean ways of creating energy, creating clean water - growing food - adapting to weather. Why not?

Right? :-) Why not?

a reply to: Spiramirabilis

Talk to a futurist, and you will hear that food production will be automated via nanotech, with no need for land usage to create our food, and that it will be before the next century is hailed.

5 years ago i would have told you how gross and disgusting lab grown meat was. Today ill tell you there is soon to be no other way.

(in fact, most futurists agree that humans will shed their bodies in favor of a virtual existence, with occasional interactions in "meatspace" facilitated by robots that you inhabit. Consider that in relation to aliens and the common stories about them).

a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

Thinking about being a robot makes me sad, so - not going there. Meat - not on my plate :-)

But, yes to the rest

Check this out:
And this...
Water...
WInd...

That's without me even scratching the surface or trying very hard. Science, engineering, innovation, teamwork. Money to be made - sky is the limit

Without bizarre and illogical interference - I think we can do this. But, I'm practically a hippy. And a girl scout - so it's hard to take me seriously

Being an African, I must say it's interesting to get an outside perspective on our "problems". To aid or not to aid, that is the question....... You have the liberal west who see the aid as kind of reparation for all the years of pillaging, then the not so liberal west using the old sink or swim adage. Everyone seems to forget this is Africa and what works in the west/east won't necessarily work here no matter how logical that solution may be, there is definitely no quick fix for our beautiful continent which is really sad because under all the corruption, wars and innocent blood is something really special.

a reply to: 5en5ei

can you tell us what is special? what is the quality?

And you better not say diversity.

originally posted by: jellyrev
a reply to: 5en5ei

can you tell us what is special? what is the quality?

And you better not say diversity.

I'd say diversity. Diversity of animal and plant life. Thanks to historically lower populations that we will see soon.

To me, that makes it special. Not to mention its the birthplace of our species.

a reply to: jellyrev

can you tell us what is special? what is the quality? And you better not say diversity.

I have a feeling there isn't an answer that's going to make any sense to you

originally posted by: 5en5ei
Being an African, I must say it's interesting to get an outside perspective on our "problems". To aid or not to aid, that is the question....... You have the liberal west who see the aid as kind of reparation for all the years of pillaging, then the not so liberal west using the old sink or swim adage. Everyone seems to forget this is Africa and what works in the west/east won't necessarily work here no matter how logical that solution may be, there is definitely no quick fix for our beautiful continent which is really sad because under all the corruption, wars and innocent blood is something really special.

Ahh you hit the nail on the head.. you said :

this is Africa and what works in the west/east won't necessarily work here no matter how logical that solution may be

Absolutely. It doesnt mean Africa or Africans are inferior... simply different. Culturally and just by who they are : Africans. We are all different, but regardless of how some want a world of homogeny and will call out all sorts of things ( racism, ets) we are ALL different. Those of us who are NOT white...we learn different, our bodies are different, our DNA is different... I love the differences and find it hard to understand those who demand we be alike. These differences should be recognized and not swept under the rug or disregarded. I get an MRI on my skull and my skull and teeth are different than the white majority here. Im different from blacks. Blacks are different than whites. Whites are different than asians. etc.. We are different! It took how long to figure out black kids in the US actually learned differently than white kids? Their actual PROCESSING was simply different. Racists masquerading as decent humans buried this and claimed it was a racist statement to make that blacks and whites learn different.. so who did that hurt? Blacks. GENERATIONS of blacks. That when taught in a certain way, blacks excelled. So.. lets let Africans settle AFRICA'S problems in a way that can be sustainable. Not a Western way ( or the coming Eastern way) but the African way.

We meddle and it doesnt work.. people die. More people die when we "help" than if we let nature work its magic and balance itself.

a reply to: crazyewok

Gota say, i agree with you 100%.

But also we have to ask ourselves why is so much money being funneled into Israel ($9.8 million per day in 2016), and before anyone says it's for help they need, i think not! Palestine needs more help pretty much more than any place, and they received precisely $0

Hmmm blackmail of some kind?!

Africa is not in the shape it's in because of colonialism. Africa is in the shape it's in because of African mentalities. That is to mean the mentality of corruption going unchecked. Buying someone off, government or otherwise, is not uncommon. Keep doing that s#, and you're going to be continuously bent over and f# in the bunghole. One would suggest if they didn't like that life, they'd rise up and put a collective end to corruption, but at it's barest bones, they won't because even a civilian can buy some power or favors. Corruption for Africa, for both governments and civilians, is about that money-given POWER. They're drunk on the concept, and are making the exact poor choices any corrupt population would elsewhere. This is their fault as modern cultures, not as former colonies.

The continent is in the shape it's in not because of colonial brutalities, but the mentality of it being ok to exterminate your neighbors because they come from a different tribe. I don't give a rat's ass about any intricacies of tribal relations, if you don't like what's going on, you put a stop to what's going on. But not in Africa, they keep trying to annihilate each other over retarded, meaningless squabbles, tribe by tribe as if it's The Most Important Thing Ever.

They are in the shape they are in because of themselves. Greed and stupidity won't help them, and if they don't knock of the s# and get with it sooner rather than later, the First Peoples of Earth to arise are going to be the first to poof, at their OWN doing.

originally posted by: nyctota
a reply to: crazyewok

Hmmm blackmail of some kind?!

More like bribery. Governments using tax payers money to soften up and prepare aid recipient countries to accept and sign-up to fat corporate contracts.

When India told the UK, thanks but we no longer need this aid money, the UK 'fought back' with offers of 'technical assistance'.

Last year (2011) the UK gave India about £250m in bilateral aid as well as £29m in technical co-operation.

By focusing post-2015 support on trade, skills and assisting private sector anti-poverty projects which can generate a return on investment, the UK estimates its overall contribution will be one-tenth of the current figure. www.bbc.co.uk...

India has developed a space programme and recently made history by launching 104 satellites in a single mission. It has also proposed a £10bn fleet of warships and submarines and a £10bn bullet train. indiagbnews.com...

The utilisation of space technology is now a competition for investment. As India’s economy slows and, like China, threatens to fall into a potential middle-income trap, investment will become the touchstone of India’s foreign policy. foreignaffairsreview.co.uk...

a reply to: jellyrev

Lol, diversity is perhaps not the right word. We might be from different races, cultures, areas and speak different languages but this continent couldn't be more divided than what it is right now and those differences are becoming glaringly obvious
What's special about Africa, it's home and where I belong. Perhaps you would like to witness your beautiful country/continent go down the drain and watch all your hopes and dreams for yourself and your children go with it and then have the privilege of reading what why when and how from the very people who cause/helped it happen..... No victim card here but why is our continent so important to the rest of the world that it couldn't be left alone instead of been told how govern itself and share it's natural wealth in the process. I've read a few comments here about Germany and Japan getting themselves up and running within a decade or two after almost utter annihilation, the important word being "themselves" they didn't have the whole world trying to save and pillage them at the same time.....
Just my 2cents worth of opinion unless you're from Zimbabwe in which case it's about Zim$1000000

a reply to: 5en5ei

Zimbabwe was left alone. Infact when the UK left Zimbawe was one of the richest nations in Africa with a healthy Economy.

The blame of Zimbabwe is Mugabe. Its his isolantionist anti white policys that has destroyed Zimbabwe .

You cant blame the rest of the world for destroying Zimbabwe when Mugabe wont let anyone in.

a reply to: Nyiah

I can agree with some of what you said, yes Africa must be the birth place of corruption. Reminds me of an old saying the fish rots from the head, perhaps the annihilation of tribes over small squabbles is because leaders use our differences against us to keep us divided so they can keep claiming that good ole aid coming in or like in South Africa's case keep claiming that good ole tax money. Colonialism can't be blamed for today's problems, it also gave us our infrastructure.
Yes we have put ourselves in the position we are but no one can deny it's not without a good nudge and some help from everyone who wants something out of our continent

a reply to: crazyewok

Agreed Zimbabwe can only be blamed on their people and leadership, however I feel had they not received aid and had Zimbabwe been left entirely to it own devises Mugabe would be sleeping with the fishes. I have many Zimbabwean friends one of whom was a staunch zanu man and was part of their military division, his words to me were if we had know 20 years ago what we know now he would be dead.

a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

Take you're a big fauna and flora type of person, yes we have plenty of that. But to describe the feeling when one is looking out from Gods Window (yes its the actual name of the place) is impossible, standing in the middle of the karoo during a cold winters night and gazing up stars to many to count and so bright you don't need a flashlight to walk around is unbelievable, or standing next to Victoria falls and hearing her roar. But not just that there is more to this place that is magical and mesmerizing you can't help but be in awe sometimes.