Addiction is not a Disease

originally posted by: pl3bscheese

: a feeling of guilt, regret, or sadness that you have because you know you have done something wrong

Shame

To not see this tool as an effective first step in the process of recovery is to be utterly blind and foolish.

The definition of shame that you have provided indicates self-awareness of having done something wrong - not shame being levied against one by way of social sanction (as a tool as you have said).

Perhaps a more creative process (for the individual) is initiated through repentance which is manifested through reconnection with one's soul which has been temporarily disconnected due to the search for external sources of pleasure and power. But this applies to many dimensions of human pursuits. The search for one nation's self-empowerment comes at the expense of the suffering and deaths of perhaps millions of unknown humans who exist as aliens to that culture. The citizens of such a militarily and economically successful culture also choose to feel good in the moment instead of facing the reality of the mess they've created with their greed which continues to pile up.

A junky's appetite for some plant's alkaloids cannot cause the destruction of all developed life on earth.

a reply to: Hecate666

a disease is often viral.

That is pretty much what the OP is presupposing and it's patently fallacious. There are some substance that can cause physiological changes that can negatively effect them and wanting more of that substance is not always a conscious decision which makes it an unconscious by-product of an illness. But it's psychological in nature rather than biological.

a reply to: pl3bscheese

If the causation of your liver damage is your addiction/dependency on alcohol, should the behavior of unconsciously self harming one self be considered an illness?

I have had a few years of good health after using and losing.

In the years off I tried to understand what happened to cause the car crash.

I came up with a simple model that I can understand.

It might help someone.

www.dendritis.com...

Damn, it's way to late for me...

But I can't help but think we throw around the terms, "disease", "disorder', "ailment", "disability", "malady" and "condition" to interchangeably. They're not the same thing, and making it even harder is that what one person goes through may have elements of more than one in that list.

You can have an ailment that disables you, but once gone you are no longer disabled. You can also have a disorder that causes a specific condition...and so on and so forth.

If I'm not making any sense it's because it's 3:30am and that stupid earthquake zapped me back to life.

Great post man and I agree 100% with everything.

I was addicted to many things, games, porn, smoke, women alcohol you name it.

I fix my addiction on my own. I have take control of the brain and he was fighting back. But I prevail. So if it was disease I would need medical treatment, but I fixed the problem on my own.

I have smoke 40 cigarets per day. Drink a bottle of vodka a day. And games were my haraddicaddiction I played games for all day.

a reply to: saadad

Agreed. I don't know of to many diseases that, with the power of the mind, can be "cured" in 24% of the population:

Dawson and her colleagues calculated a natural recovery rate for alcoholism of 24.4 percent -- that is, over the course of a year, 24.4 percent of the alcoholics studied simply wised up, got sick and tired of being sick and tired, and quit. Without treatment and without meetings.

Washington Post

I'd be more apt to say addiction is an illness, like a common cold. In some people it goes away on its own. For some, it can linger for a long, long time. For others, however, it can grow and develop into a chronic and debilitating condition that kills -- like pneumonia.

a reply to: NateTheAnimator

I'm sorry... what? You think someone can be unaware of their cravings deep down? That's ridiculous. Addicts are perfectly aware that they crave their DOC.

There is no unconscious self-harm in an alcoholic who has severe liver damage. They feel the pain in their abdomen and continue. It's a conscious decision.

a reply to: Golden Rule

Why are you making this more complicated than it is? Shame is felt by the individual, shaming is done by another individual in hope to cause shame (and so transformation).

If you feel better talking about repentance and souls, that's cool, but the same basic principal applies. The junkie needs to realize the error of their ways and have the spiritual and/or emotional urge to create their new mindset.

I've noticed a pattern where the millennials really don't want to use the word shame. I don't know why this is.

Ultimately it does not matter if addiction is a disease or not. What matters is how society responds to it. And in the case of recreational drug use, society totally fails. Man has always sought altered consciousness. What does it matter if a person prefers opioids over TV or sex or whatever? It's far more shameful for the way society treats drug addiction that the act of the addict. A person never uses drugs with a goal to become dependent on a substance. In fact, most users never do become addicted. But of those who do become dependent, most will come to the realization their addiction is destructive and they must abstain in order to move on with their life. How they do that is up to the individual; but the best way to start is to remove themselves from the environment that supports their addiction, undermining temptation.

a reply to: pl3bscheese

I'm sorry... what? You think someone can be unaware of their cravings deep down? That's ridiculous. Addicts are perfectly aware that they crave their DOC.

Umm..Yeah it's called indirect self harm i.e substance abuse. In the example I used the alcoholic is unaware that the causation for their liver damage is alcohol and many whom abuse substances don't realize the harm and mutilation their doing to their body is caused by the substances they abuse.. So in a way they are unconsciously self harming. They may consciously choose to use the substance when available but addiction/dependancy in many cases is unconscious due to the brain being altered from conditioned learning(positive reinforcement in this case) through prolonged use of the DOC.

In short the more you use, the more your brain will unconsciously learn to crave more of the substance.
Whether or not YOU classify addiction as an illness or not is irrelevant to the causality, which is in fact psychological.

originally posted by: NateTheAnimator
a reply to: pl3bscheese

I'm sorry... what? You think someone can be unaware of their cravings deep down? That's ridiculous. Addicts are perfectly aware that they crave their DOC.

Umm..Yeah it's called indirect self harm i.e substance abuse.

You realize indirect harm and unconscious harm are entirely different, correct? They are not the same, it's called unconscious harm, not indirect harm. Just weird, man.

In the example I used the alcoholic is unaware that the causation for their liver damage is alcohol and many whom abuse substances don't realize the harm and mutilation their doing to their body is caused by the substances they abuse..

Are you talking of someone who is mentally challenged? Show me a man who is not mentally challenged that isn't aware that alcohol damages their body, bare minimum. Show me an alcoholic who has liver damage that doesn't understand when they drink they hurt in their liver, and doesn't make the connection. It doesn't happen.

So in a way they are unconsciously self harming. They may consciously choose to use the substance when available but addiction/dependancy in many cases is unconscious due to the brain being altered from conditioned learning(positive reinforcement in this case) through prolonged use of the DOC.

You're not making sense, man. There's nothing unconscious here. There's a conscious being who chooses to drink. He hurts and knows he's hurting himself, but continues all the same.

In short the more you use, the more your brain will unconsciously learn to crave more of the substance.
Whether or not YOU classify addiction as an illness or not is irrelevant to the causality, which is in fact psychological.

Craving happens. There's nothing unconscious about it. Unconscious signals of the brain are things like your heart beat, your blood vessels constricting or expanding, your blood pressure regulation, and so forth. When an addict has a craving they feel it consciously, they mentally register it as a signal to have another drink soon. They then make conscious plans to go about feeding their craving.

You've proven nothing other than you're not really clued into what you're describing.

I need a beer.

Just kidding,
en.wikipedia.org...
BTW, the first beer was produced about 7000 years ago, I imagine even further back than that.

So what is it in mans make up that craves mind altering substances, I was a big drinker until 1988, and I did spend a lot of time in prayer to kick it.

The difference between an alcoholic and a junkie.

An alcoholic will steal your wallet then shrug if you ask if they've seen it.

A junkie will steal your wallet and spend all day helping you look for it.

a reply to: pl3bscheese

Craving happens. There's nothing unconscious about it. Unconscious signals of the brain are things like your heart beat, your blood vessels constricting or expanding, your blood pressure regulation, and so forth. When an addict has a craving they feel it consciously, they mentally register it as a signal to have another drink soon. They then make conscious plans to go about feeding their craving.

The causality for substance abuse is unconscious. The causality for the unconscious reaction is the substance altering the dopamine receptors. The brain associates increase in dopamine levels from the drug with pleasure, the more the drug is used the more the brain associates the drug = good times. AKA positive reinforcement. If a user uses drugs during times of low dopamine levels and does consistently, the brain will associate decrease dopamine levels as a cognitive irregularity and will strive for the opposite.
However, the brain will require more and more of the drug to maintain normal functionality, Which would be exponentially higher dopamine levels..It becomes an unconscious reaction whenever the brain's dopamine levels are low.

originally posted by: NateTheAnimator
a reply to: pl3bscheese

The causality for substance abuse is unconscious.

the relationship between something that happens or exists and the thing that causes it

Causality

No, it's not.

The causality for the unconscious reaction is the substance altering the dopamine receptors. The brain associates increase in dopamine levels from the drug with pleasure, the more the drug is used the more the brain associates the drug = good times. AKA positive reinforcement. If a user uses drugs during times of low dopamine levels and does consistently, the brain will associate decrease dopamine levels as a cognitive irregularity and will strive for the opposite.

There's nothing unconscious about this, whatsoever. Do you not know what unconscious means, either? It means not knowing. What you're describing is in line with tolerance, and dependency. Addicts are very aware of both. They increase dosage appropriately, and make plans to catch their fix before they crash too hard.

However, the brain will require more and more of the drug to maintain normal functionality, Which would be exponentially higher dopamine levels..It becomes an unconscious reaction whenever the brain's dopamine levels are low.

It's just not unconscious. They are fully aware that craving is increasing over time.

Truly think of what you're saying. You're equating increased craving with "unconscious" desire for another fix. There is no way you can make this leap in logic in the face of a junkies actions. They carefully plan out their means to get the fix, the amount they will need to use, and how to avoid getting caught. This isn't what someone who is unaware of their needs do.

Personally, if my DOC is in any way referenced I will make a LOT of associations rapidly that creates a feeling-state. I am fully aware that this has happened, and I know the only thing to do is focus my energies elsewhere. This is no different for any other successfully recovering addict. You learn how to not feed the circuitry associated with addiction to bring back the lifestyle you choose earlier in your life.

Saying this is not in one's awareness is in line with saying it's a disease, it's scapegoating and not allowing the addict to take responsibility for their own life.

a reply to: pl3bscheese

You're equating increased craving with "unconscious" desire for another fix.

Reread what I stated... I'm equating decreased dopamine levels with a compulsive motivation to increase the brains pleasure response.

Saying this is not in one's awareness is in line with saying it's a disease, it's scapegoating and not allowing the addict to take responsibility for their own life.

Again, you keep referring to disease as viral in nature which is fallacious... In this case as I stated earlier addiction is a mental illness, most addicts are not aware of their addiction as it's a compulsive behavior that they do not have control over anymore. Simple as that.