I'm a monster.....

Greetings ATS,

I will make this as short and sweet as possible and I won't win many friends with this post but it is a post that needs to be made regardless. I don't care about the 9 lives that were lost. I don't care beyond a general condolence for the families that bear the burden of their deaths. I can not grieve any further because the American government propaganda machine is making me choose between these 9 lives or my Constitutional guarantees and when spun in that perspective, there is no contest.

Most of those in the anti-gun variety conveniently forget that the only reason they have a voice in any decision is because Americans with guns fought and died to assure them of that right. America is the lone power in the entire world at this point that can and possibly will hold it's government to account for the sole reason that the populations has arms. Should this government, with all it's treacherous malfeasance and unabashed tyranny in epic defiance of the Constitution itself ever find itself able to disarm the American people then woe behold the rest of the world. We have been killing innocents the likes that could only make Hitler deliriously happy the last two decades, imagine what it could do when the cuffs were truly off.

Awwwwww, you wan't to stop gun violence because you're a responsible person? Send a letter to the Illinois HoR about Chicago. Figure out a way that you can reduce gun violence through laws when the vast majority of gun violence is committed by people that have zero regard for law. Concoct a better argument than what amounts to a statistically insignificant amount of people dying by guns per year as compared to freedom, liberty and the traditions this country was founded on.

I must be a monster because I care more about your Constitutional guarantees than 9 lives, or 26 lives or 1000 lives. The reason is simple, and it's remedial math in nature. Our country is comprised of more than 300 million people and based on our governments behavior over the last two decades, giving up our Constitutional right to bear arms basically nullifies most if not all of the 300 million people. It would be no different then selling them all into slavery. It's what our forefathers warned us about, it's what has been happening in spades in this country as of late and continues ever so boldly with no regress in sight.

Label me what you wan't but I promise you this, from the day I was born till the day I die, I will be an American. Can all of you say the same?

Haha, this should be interesting...

I just don't like how one incident, two, twenty, three thousand in the course of multiple millennia can erode an entire country's individualistic rights in such a small amount of time.

There are certainly ways to improve on it, but nothing or no one seems to be working in our favor. A population of 300 million will behave like most other animalistic hierarchies.

Many are blind to the fact that they themselves are little more than an animal. Those without self control and critical thinking are the real monsters.

Everybody SINGGGG " Happiness is a warm gun
(Bang bang, shoot shoot)
Happiness is a warm gun mama
(Bang bang, shoot shoot)
When I hold you in my arms
(Oh yeah)
And I feel my finger on your trigger
(Ooo, oh yeah)
I know nobody can do me no harm
(Ooo, oh yeah)

a reply to: eisegesis

I just don't like how one incident, two, twenty, three thousand in the course of multiple millennia can erode an entire country's individualistic rights in such a small amount of time.

Multiple millions of dollars, complete control of the countries media and the hammered in shame of political correctness and racism.

I read an article just yesterday about NASA possibly working the government to send nukes to deflect an asteroid if it were threatening Earth and then promptly seen over 500 people on Facebook laugh because it was redundant because NASA was actually a branch of the USAF.

Most Americans are clueless not only about our governments structure, history and recent degradation but much more unfortunately for the rest of us, It's origination.

a reply to: Helious

I think the instinct for anti-2nd amendment folks to jump on top of violent tragedies is a mistake. The only time I get my feathers ruffled and feel angry about the amount of guns in America is when I hear about kids accidentally shooting each other or some other tragic accident due to irresponsible law-abiding gun owners.

You are correct about the gun violence. Restricting the 2nd amendment will not stop criminals from shooting people. Why they jump on gun violence as opposed to irresponsible gun accidents, I'll never know.

My only theory I can come up with is that attacking the 2nd amendment based on a lack of gun safety will only result in perhaps some required safety courses (which, flame away, I would support) but attacking the 2nd amendment based on gun violence would potentially result in removing guns from owners completely which is a larger fish.

I really don't know but it makes me doubt the motives of these movements when it's a response to violence.

sorry but i find it hard to believe.
just to be clear, i fall under the "better have it and not need it than need it and not have it" camp
But especially in america, your freedoms are close to nothing, there is this flawed idea that the government would become physically hostile, but it didn't need that. it is oppressing you with debt, student loans, constant spying of your emails.
Wasn't it George Carlin that talked about the illusion of freedom/choice?
this guy explains my point better than i can:

a reply to: TerryMcGuire

You do realize that song is about shooting dope right...

I just think that some restrictions should be in place with the mentally ill having a gun.
I think the doctors should report people with certain symptoms and on certain meds to make sure they don't have access to a firearm.
I know 99.9% of gun owners are responsible but isn't it responsible to give up your gun If you are mentally unwell?.
I don't have the answers at all but If nothing is done it will get more and more common.

We should all be in mech battle suits.

WORLDS A DANGEROUS PLACE!

originally posted by: Helious

America is the lone power in the entire world at this point that can and possibly will hold it's government to account for the sole reason that the populations has arms.

This posts are always so hilarious.
European countries are doing just fine controlling their governments without weapons.

Lets see if tou can prove your point anyway..

Should this government, with all it's treacherous malfeasance and unabashed tyranny in epic defiance of the Constitution itself ever find itself able to disarm the American people....

Erm... You call your government ..what?
With your guns, you accept such a government? Can you see the comedy?
And you are waiting until they want to take your guns away... So that you will no longer be able to hold on your guns while watching them keep taking your rights away..
Why don't you use them instead of complain about this tyranny?

Label me what you wan't but I promise you this, from the day I was born till the day I die, I will be an American. Can all of you say the same?

Why do you want to call yourself and remain an american when the country, in your own words sounds so truly awful?

a reply to: Helious

You are so right, it makes no sense.

Americans are losing credibility as competent defenders of freedom. We no longer appear to be concerned with the rights of individuals.

The standard by which violence is measured is x per 100,000. Those numbers can hardly move at all regardless of what regressive policies may be jammed down our throats.

That means that all of this ridiculousness is irrelevant to anything but authoritarian nanny state politics of the worst kind.

a reply to: Helious

Sorry, my thoughts came out a little disjointed last night.

Control, oh the many forms it takes. Some are obvious and some work behind the scenes. Money, religion, health and safety. These are the four pillars that hold the roof over our heads. A manipulation of any one of these four pillars causes instability towards the intended target.

Look how much money is spent on advertising each year. Look how many textiles, food, clothing go to waste when so many are starving and cold. Look at the control religion has over it's people. Most are oblivious and would fight to the death defending their false idol.

Look how unhealthy everyone has become when there is easily accessible information on how to avoid most ailments. They'll say, I only trust my doctor and you're not an expert and how can food be thy medicine? Hopeless...

Safety, probably the biggest farce in history is the worst control mechanism there is. Did I ask for your protection? Did I agree to your reinterpretation of my rights? We vote idiot scum into office and that is where their servitude ends.

a reply to: Helious

We have been killing innocents the likes that could only make Hitler deliriously happy the last two decades, imagine what it could do when the cuffs were truly off.

The real monster in the room.

Up till now, despot tyrants the like of Hitler were vanquished by brute force at the very last. Up till now, the tyrants didn't have access to nukes. Imagine Hitler in todays world, in the bunker deep below ground, his empire crumbling, artillery pounding on the roof, finger on the button.

Todays Hitler bunker is called the Situation Room.

a reply to: Helious

I know a way to reduce gun violence without having to deprive Americans from their beloved guns, but it actually requires more social policies, meaning more taxes (whether from big companies or from the people, up to you to decide).

Are you guys willing to do so? To accept to pay a bit more to finance a few more social policies?



It's really easy, gun violence (and actually all kind of violence) is heavily correlated with, and most likely caused by, poverty and lack of education:

- Make education up to university heavily subsided
- Make policies to reduce poverty (create jobs, increase minimum salary, create a social security, ...)


Furthermore this will ensure the citizen of your country work more, get better job thus paying even more taxes! It's really a win-win for everyone and it always baffled me how so many Americans are against it since it would really benefit the country as a whole. But I know; "not in my backyard". I'm OK for more social policies as long as I don't have to pay for it. Meh...

a reply to: Helious

No matter how much sense you speak you cannot stop ultimate goal of those who wish to deprive you of your tiny speck of remaining freedom.

originally posted by: and14263
a reply to: Helious

No matter how much sense you speak you cannot stop ultimate goal of those who wish to deprive you of your tiny speck of remaining freedom.

I'm constantly amused by these sorts of comments. Clearly many people in this country are blind to the rest of the world, and how many freedoms they actually have. It's kind of sad when some moron has to dance at a national monument that forbids that sort of thing and get arrested, to "prove" a point that we live in a country with no freedoms left. He can happily dance and act like an idiot in 99.99995% of the U.S., but.. his freedoms are gone because he feels he can't dance where it is not allowed by law.

The issue in the U.S. is not the lack of freedoms.. it's the overabundant laws and regulations that decades of non-cleanup and amendments cause. To quote the Joker from the Batman movie, this country needs an enema. The massive ball O red tape that is our laws and regulations provides by its convoluted nature, loopholes for every crooked person to find a way through them, but bogs down the daily life of honest Americans just trying to get by.

An evil government is not why a lady is not allowed to collect rainwater. It's stupid overabundant laws and regulations that have never been pruned or changed.. just added to over the centuries since our countries inception.

It's like the ironic laws that prevent folks from clearing brush in forests. Instead of persevering anything, it causes a massive fire hazard that creates huge bonfires. Thus is our legal system, our laws and regulations, the IRS, you name it.

As far as "freedoms" go, it's probably the root cause of why the U.S. leads the world in these sorts of mass killings. The ability to arm ones self coupled with the inherent feeling that you are entitled to do anything you want, and are being subjugated and controlled if you can't, might well lead to these events.

I am fine with guns.. people having guns.. but clearly something is not right. It's not WRONG for the government to want to do something to try and fix it. Perhaps instead of freaking out every time there is a tragic event like this, help in finding ways to help preventing it in the future. The first thing that happens are pro and anti gun people bleating their rhetoric before the bodies are even cold, and it's sad and rather disgusting that they use events like this to push their agendas.

It is monstrous to let political programming override your capacity to be concerned for others.
Your unrealized fears for the future do not trump other people's real suffering in the present.

Here's how we handle these things:

1. A problem arises: people getting shot is a problem.
You do not scream what about me when people are getting shot.

2. If it's serious enough it dominates conversation and we start talking about how it happens and how to stop it: getting shot is that serious.
You do not scream what about me during a conversation about other people's serious problems.

3. If we think it looks solvable we start to draw up an actual plan to change things: This is a solvable problem. It does not exist in a comparable form in other developed nations.
You do not scream what about me while we are figuring out how to solve a serious problem.

4. We look at that plan and identify conflicts, drawbacks etc and discuss how to balance everything and make it work: That would be the time for you to say "what about me".

5. If we can answer the "what about me", then after a long inertia-fraught process designed to avoid you from suddenly finding yourself deprived of your rights as you fear, we can actually go forward with our plans to solve the problem.

6. If anything goes wrong for you then, you can go to court and get it undone.
Court is of course the place to not care about others and insist that it's time to solve your problem first.

a reply to: Helious

you are missing ONE very important part of the equation, OP: the vatican banned the Bible on pain of death from 500 AD to 1500 AD… and it was Protestants fighting for access to the Bible (Geneva Bible) that led to all of our current freedoms, an end to feudal systems, etc

a reply to: Nevertheless

Me thinks you've got that bassackwards there buddy... I think you meant European govts have no problem controlling their people since they don't have guns...

Jaden