GOP Congresswoman Asks For Obamacare Horror Stories, Gets Dose Of Reality Instead

originally posted by: Xtrozero
I'm still trying to figure out how a poor person/family can pay the deductible on a bronze plan.

Exactly the point.

How the hell can a person making $20,000 a year pre tax pay $6,000 copay on top of $120 a month just for the insurance and live?

Just the insurance deductible and taxes has taken a full half of their gross pay.

How are they supposed to live?

Insurance is worthless if you die of exposure and starvation.

a reply to: macman

You missed the part of $108 per adult. Never said free. I know simple solutions are not in vogue right now. One can only hope.

Simple economics.....where does the rest of the money come from?

And that whole part, where not one single Govt program has ever been successful, within budget or without major Govt corruption was just glossed right over.

originally posted by: macman
Simple economics.....where does the rest of the money come from?

And that whole part, where not one single Govt program has ever been successful, within budget or without major Govt corruption was just glossed right over.

Yeah, all military operations were unsuccessful, same with things like Head Start. That's why we all speak German now.

a reply to: macman

Howz that printing of money for QE working for ya? Why can't we do the same for saving lives.

It is so good to see so many people who opt out from being insured. They are the real patriots. Well that and parasites. Everyone of you guys know, that when you get sick and know that you are going to die if you don’t get some help, you’re going to hit the nearest emergency room. I for one hope they put you in a courtesy car and drop you off at the nearest bus stop, and tell you have a nice couple of days before you die. You got some nerve not putting a penny in and yet want the benefits.

Let’s go real slow here for those people who have a hard time keeping up. The fine buys you nothing. Paying premiums buys you access to healthcare. See how that works.

I’m all for you being able to do what you want. You don’t want health insurance? Don’t get it. Just realize you don’t get health care either. Hospital write off mooches like you all the time. I think it’s time we stopped that. No care no write off.

Obamacare? Well you’re sure right about it not being perfect. But it did make some progress in rectifying the monstrous situation that existed before. The one where truly sick people were locked out. Not allowed to participate at all in in the concept of insurance, spreading the risks, simply because they were too risky.

Oh and here’s something to bitch about. All you people who get subsidies You’ll notice when you file your taxes that your earned income tax credits disappeared. Yeah that’s right those subsidies were really just smoke and mirrors.

a reply to: Greven

Wait......you are comparing an over bloated military budget to incompetent Govt agencies?

And Head Start is a shining example?


Honestly...you really need to pull your head out and look around.

a reply to: MOMof3

Printing money to save lives??

Mom you may be...someone with a small grasp of economics you are not.

But again, a single payer system will still need funding from someone/somewhere. And where oh where does that money come from? The tax payer. So bravo......more taxes to pay for people's life choices. All driven by a Govt that screws the easy things up on a daily basis.

Here is a question for you....since you trust in the Govt sooo much, how would you feel about the State or the Fed raising your kids?

a reply to: macman
The military is a government-run thing. If you hold absolute that the government cannot run anything right, then the military cannot have done anything right.

I would say the argument fails immediately. Yes, Head Start is an amazing program (pdf). Do you know anything about it? It's been running for several decades, and we've got some good ideas as to how it performs(pdf):

Providing access to Head Start has a positive impact on children’s preschool experiences. There are statistically significant differences between the Head Start group and the control group on every measure of children’s preschool experiences measured in this study.
...
However, the advantages children gained during their Head Start and age 4 years yielded only a few statistically significant differences in outcomes at the end of 1st grade for the sample as a whole. Impacts at the end of kindergarten were scattered and are mentioned below only when they appear to be related to the 1st grade impacts.

During Head Start? Good outcomes! After Head Start? Still some good outcomes! It appears the program's effects fade over time, which could be a failing of public schooling more than the program.

It's fine to criticize programs that don't work. It's not fine to say that no programs work when some certainly do.

a reply to: macman

My three kids are in 30,28,26 yrs old. One just get his BA degree in business this may(worked for service master and paid his own way) , one is an Administrator for a long term care center, the other is a CNA and a mother.

No one was there to help me give birth, no one was there when I nursed and fed and gave them life. No one was there when I got them ready for the baby sitter at 5 in the morning so I could go to work for the next 11 hours. No one was there the numerous times that I did not have enough food because I missed a day at work. So I don't know what you are talking about because that is the experience of most families.

You give me a reason why working americans should lose their homes and shorten their lives for insurance company profits.

originally posted by: Greven

The military is a government-run thing. If you hold absolute that the government cannot run anything right, then the military cannot have done anything right.

The Govt run Military is a nightmare now days.
The missions run by the military members are what is the success.

originally posted by: Greven
I would say the argument fails immediately. Yes, Head Start is an amazing program (pdf). Do you know anything about it? It's been running for several decades, and we've got some good ideas as to how it performs(pdf):

Providing access to Head Start has a positive impact on children’s preschool experiences. There are statistically significant differences between the Head Start group and the control group on every measure of children’s preschool experiences measured in this study.
...
However, the advantages children gained during their Head Start and age 4 years yielded only a few statistically significant differences in outcomes at the end of 1st grade for the sample as a whole. Impacts at the end of kindergarten were scattered and are mentioned below only when they appear to be related to the 1st grade impacts.

During Head Start? Good outcomes! After Head Start? Still some good outcomes! It appears the program's effects fade over time, which could be a failing of public schooling more than the program.

It's fine to criticize programs that don't work. It's not fine to say that no programs work when some certainly do.

Oh goodie, a Govt based program,which states in your article that a small increase is seen and little difference after grade 1, all the while being how much over budget?

So no.....the Govt could screw up a wet dream. Success measured for Govt programs always seems to fall under some different form of math and results then anywhere else in the world.

a reply to: MOMof3

So, what I gather is that you did it all on your own....and why should the tax payer fund you for those life choices of having kids?


Also, you didn't answer my question...since you like Govt so much, would you be willing to allow the State and/or Fed to raise your kids?

And....people's life choices, health and medical is included in this, are the responsibility of everyone else now?

I like the hyperbole of people loosing their homes and stuff...but the hyper-emotional rantings don't do much for me. Please, explain why the tax payer has to fund people's life choices.

a reply to: macman
Uhh... you realize that, if an individual is in the military, then he or she is part of the government... right?

It's not a fear-term.

The evaluation I linked is one of the most critical yet made on the program. Why do you say Head Start is over budget?

Yeah, the good effects of Head Start fade after kids are no longer enrolled in it. This has been known about for decades, but I don't think it's very well studied. One idea for why it happens is that Head Start generally targets low-income children. These children then move into low-income schools. These low-income schools provide lower-quality education because they can't really afford things.

a reply to: Greven

You just don't understand do you.

Those running missions are not the Govt. They are the military member.

The Military, mostly the upper staff, is so jacked up it is beyond reason.

a reply to: macman

I can't explain anything to a view and heart such as yours. Goodbye.

a reply to: MOMof3

And again...no response.

I guess you just can't defend your stance.

originally posted by: Greven
The military is a government-run thing. If you hold absolute that the government cannot run anything right, then the military cannot have done anything right.

I was in the military, as was my wife, and I can tell you with 100% certainty that not all wars and battles are won, fought effectively, or paid for efficiently. Yes, some military movements may run smoothly, but that doesn't mean that the military as a whole is not just another wasteful, poorly run, over-reaching, politicized system that tends to abuse its employees.

BTW, your logic in the above quote is really faulty--just because something isn't run properly doesn't mean that, on occassion, it does something right.

a reply to: SlapMonkey
If you will recall, he is speaking in absolutes:

originally posted by: macman
And that whole part, where not one single Govt program has ever been successful, within budget or without major Govt corruption was just glossed right over.

No program has ever been successful, he claims. Yet, you here suggest that a few - on occasion - are. It seems you disagree with his assertion as well.

a reply to: Greven

People within an Agency/Department can have successes.

Please show me an agency/department that is a success story.


All are over budget..all are overrun with bureaucrats and corruption and all take money from the tax payer.

originally posted by: okyouwin
It is so good to see so many people who opt out from being insured. They are the real patriots. Well that and parasites. Everyone of you guys know, that when you get sick and know that you are going to die if you don’t get some help, you’re going to hit the nearest emergency room. I for one hope they put you in a courtesy car and drop you off at the nearest bus stop, and tell you have a nice couple of days before you die. You got some nerve not putting a penny in and yet want the benefits.

Let’s go real slow here for those people who have a hard time keeping up. The fine buys you nothing. Paying premiums buys you access to healthcare. See how that works.

Yeah. I remember how Obama said it was going to work before he was elected. I remember he claimed he was against the individual mandate. I remember how he said things like "If a mandate was the solution, we could solve homelessness by mandating that everyone buy a house".

Yeah. I remember the lies. I know that's inconvenient and we're not supposed to remember the guy who promised there wasn't going to be a mandate in the first place. Of course now that he just did it anyway and doesn't have to care what he said then, here we are arguing about what should happen to the people who don't follow orders.

And by the way. Isn't it interesting that the same media that does remember the guy who said you could keep your doctor and your insurance hardly ever mentions the fact that Obama flip flopped completely on the mandate to start with? Isn't it strange that the people who claim they're against Obamacare have not taken full advantage of this massive lie? If it ever gets mentioned at all, it's hardly ever. They've made a huge deal out of just about every other lie he told but somehow, they always leave out the one that lays the foundation for all the rest of them.