New Mexico Flag that longer exists. Another Mandela Effect?

I was reading up on historical Native American Use of the Sunwheel this evening. I used to live in New Mexico so I am pretty familiar with it's use on things like highway signs (Arizona), yearbook covers, and the pre WWII state flag. So I thought I would search for a picture of the old flag... and it never existed. In fact, it is now said that the flag has never changed since it's creation in the 1920's.

Here are some examples of use. It should be noted that the sunwheel was very common as business logos, architecture, and even a boy scout medal was modelled after it.

Arizona Highway sign:


Military:


Business:


Boy Scouts Award:


Boy Scouts Token:


Las Cruces Yearbook Covers:
3 pages of covers Here

Not on the flag [anymore?]:

The simple and meaningful design features an interpretation of an ancient symbol of the sun as found on a late 19th century water jar from Zia Pueblo. This red symbol is called a "Zia" and is centered on a field of yellow.

Four is the sacred number of the Zia and can be found repeated in the four points radiating from the circle. The number four is embodied in the four points of the of the compass, North, East, South and West; in the four seasons of the year Spring, Summer, Autumn and Winter; in the 24 hours of each day by sunrise, noon, evening and night; by four seasons of life, childhood, youth, adulthood and old age. The Zia also believed that with life came four sacred obligations: development of a strong body, a clear mind, a pure spirit and devotion to the welfare of people/family. All of these things are bound together within the circle of life.

The red and yellow colors are the colors of Isabel of Castilla brought to the continent by the Spanish Conquistadors.

Source

I have been all over the interwebz trying to find an image but nothing comes up. Does anyone else remember that the flag had a sunwheel on it as depicted in the Las Cruces yearbooks and regional lore?

I know there are threads, several of them, about The Mandela Effect. Basically to summarize it is when many people have a shared memory that ends up not being true in the current reality. Example The Berenstein Bears do not exist, they are the Berenstain Bears. You never learned how to pronounce their name or "ein" words using the example of their name, or any other memory about them and how to spell or pronounce their name. Another example is the location of Sri Lanka [south and a little to the east, or off the east coast], and another being the Televised funeral of Mandela in the 1980's and Bill Cosby naming Sophia's children on the Cosby Show after him in his memory [Winnie and Nelson -or he later dies, and dies again, and again], the death of MLK [bomb, crazy lady, pistol, or rifle]. In all instances the "Mandela Effect Memory" will be completely gone from record. The going theory is that it simply happened in a parallel universe that our consciousness was in our parallel body at the time... either way.... those that do not have the Mandela Effect Memory would be the native inhabitants of the parallel universe where it really never happened to begin with.

So...

Anyone remember, or remember learning, or did learn that the New Mexico State flag had a sunwheel on it and was later changed to remove the stigma from the symbol? If so, please elaborate why you remember this, what made you remember as a learning tool?

I have seen no evidence of this "memory" on the interwebz.

Have a great day!

It's a cool symbol with a great meaning for ancient cultures, ruined by nazi's stupidity. Using it today shouldn't be linked to evil, but ignorance is bigger today than Hitler's time.

originally posted by: Volund
Does anyone else remember that the flag had a sunwheel on it as depicted in the Las Cruces yearbooks and regional that symbol as oppolore?

Why do you think the New Mexico Flag ever had that (swastika) symbol, as opposed to the current "Zia" symbol?

Example The Berenstein Bears do not exist, they are the Berenstain Bears.

Again, why do you think it was EVER the Berenstein Bears?

Another example is the location of Sri Lanka [south and a little to the east, or off the east coast], and another being the Televised funeral of Mandela in the 1980's and Bill Cosby naming Sophia's children on the Cosby Show after him in his memory [Winnie and Nelson -or he later dies, and dies again, and again], the death of MLK [bomb, crazy lady, pistol, or rifle].

What makes you think any of these things have changed?

I have seen no evidence of this "memory" on the interwebz.

So, where did you get this "memory"?

It was replaced by the zia symbol in the wake of the Nazi regime. Before 1932 it was the state symbol and was on all signs and flags. More info here...
www.sfreporter.com...:6637

It sucks the Nazis put the stink on the swastika. It is a lovely symbol. I'm afraid there is no restoring it to its former glory.

originally posted by: Volund
Example The Berenstein Bears do not exist, they are the Berenstain Bears. You never learned how to pronounce their name or "ein" words using the example of their name, or any other memory about them and how to spell or pronounce their name.

It was always Berenstain bears. I had all of them. They were some of my favorite books.
In fact I remember my mom telling me that other people said it wrong.
I think people assume too much.


But yes Nelson mandela has died like 3 times already


wait

Stephen Beko, a black anti-apartheid journalist, died in a South African prison in the 80's, then they made a movie about it (with Eric Stoltz in a supporting role, I believe) at that time Mandela and Beko were about equally well known in the west (barely at all) people just got that confused.

Scratch off one of my Mandela deaths.. It was my teacher who told me that one.. Ugh.

a reply to: Benevolent Heretic

Again, why do you think it was EVER the Berenstein Bears?

For some reason most people do, apparently. 79 pages of futile head banging
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Here is a Video explaining the Mandela Effect for the who aren't familiar with it.

Just because something (like Berenstain for example) is not a conflicting memory means nothing if you understand what the Mandela Effect is t begin with

Lets say, for example, MLK as an example died from a white sniper. It is fact in this universe. In another universe he could have died when a bomb went off in his home (documented that his home was attacked and blew up), or died from a crazy lady attacking him with a letter opener (again, documented but in this universe he lived), or any other reason of a failed death attempt... they may have succeeded in another Universe and ended his life. The same people then shift into a different Universe where he isn't dead yet, and go about their normal lives... until MLK dies in that Universe. Then they think to themselves "um, wait a second". They then look up all the info they thought he died from to see that he lived, because in that Universe he *did* live. People either get it, or they don't (or they don't care, in which case.... get back to work). That doesn't make the memory wrong per se, just not right the right version of history this universe. Yes, people can just have false memories, but when the same memory is shared by many who also remember the "lesson" on how to remember it if it was a difficult subject... well that may be the Mandela Effect.

Mandela Effect on Reddit

The Mandela Effect Website

Parallel Universes, How Stuff Works



So back to the original question,
Does anyone have this memory of them changing the New Mexican flag after WWII to remove the stigma of the sunwheel? Because the memory itself is associated with a stigma and a lesson on morality (the evils of this or that and why this had to happen) I believe it to be more than simply a false memory.

a reply to: Volund

I get all of that, and even say in some of my posts that my past was changed after I met up with something powerful that made my soul say I didn't want to die.

^^Thats as much as I want to say about that.

The Berenstain thing though. It's always been that for me. And even back in the late 80s my mom was arguing with people that it was berenstain not berenstein. In fact I think that one is just a spelling issue, as on some of the books it's spelled BOTH ways.

I understand how if changing dimensions is true that only memory might survive while physical objects would be not the same. I understand how we can all be talking and all be in the same "zone," and still maybe not shift the same.

I don't see proof of this, and I don't know if you could ever prove it, as the proof would be lost in the shift...

I think the Mind is above Spacetime, in a hierarchy of dimensions. I think the mind is maybe not even one thing. One part of the mind is above time though. Computers have no memory, but we do. We surpass spacetime, in the mind.



As far as that flag, I have no idea. I've maybe never seen it. As in my last post I do now see how my teacher probably got confused with someone not mandela, and taught me wrong and I went with it. But that still leaves him dieing twice.

Maybe another memory mishap. I don't know.

I get a lot of Dejavu, and even dejavu that tells the future because the dejavu is a movie, and the movie is still playing, and I remember the future.. Remember the future.

Physics is weird.

I'm more & more interested by the Mandela effect - thanks for bringing another key example to the fore. I also think you did a great job of summarising what the Mandela effect is, without too much of a 'shock to the system' once you are already aware of what it is, and have your own 'Mandela-type' memory fails.

As for me, I seriously lean to the 'ein' side of the Berenstein Bears saga, as does my wife - I also remember looking at the location of New Zealand on a globe when I was young, and remember that it was situated to the North East of Australia. A modern globe tells us that it is in fact to the South East of Australia.

I have started to think that reality is a lot more fluid & 'plastic' than we had previously given it credit for. I have realised that perhaps, we really shouldn't be surprised by stuff like this - maybe we crossed some sort of threshold when our scientists started looking at the quantum world. Perhaps their observations (the observer paradox, etc) and thoughts, translated out into wider general understanding of their theories, has left us in a very sensitive medium of Reality, where we can actually begin to have a much greater effect on it.

My thoughts presently are that, much after the fashion of Jaques Vallee, there is already a covert group trying to manipulate Reality to serve their own strange, and perhaps ever-indecipherable needs. He referred to the UFO phenomenon as part of a 'Control System', which interacts with Humanity in strange and non-self-similar ways, in order to manipulate the flow of our thought processes, as a species. He linked it to the fairy lore of medieval times, specifically referencing a parallel reality called Magonia, where time passes differently, where motives seem strange and culture is different, with many types of being existing there. Perhaps the Magonians have found a way to protect themselves from the 'Control System', and are in fact trying to warn us of the true nature of reality by adopting some of the methods of the 'Control System' to inform us.

Anyway, I'm going off the deep end. S & F, thanks for bringing this issue to the fore on ATS again; I think it represents the new dawn of our investigations into the nature of reality, and believe that it quite possibly holds the key to unlocking our most perfect existence, if we can find a way to throw a spanner in the works of the insidious 'Control System' - perhaps it is AI, perhaps advanced non-Human life. Either way, they are messing with us big time, and the 'ein/ain' issue may be the key.

a reply to: Benevolent Heretic

Umm. You seem very confrontational, and I would recommend you do some related reading before being so unpleasant on what is actually a very pleasant and non-confrontational thread. There are thousands upon thousands upon thousands of people reporting very strange 'Mandela effect' issues, and they are of all stripes, not just the most prominent Berenstein/ Berenstain one, though that seems to be the one that woke many of them up to the possibility of parallel incursion.

Incidentally, I think you should probably take a chill pill and not participate in threads that raise topics concerning the apparently fluid nature of reality. If you're so damn convinced, and it upsets you so much (perhaps you're scared of a reality that doesn't work in a Newtonian fashion?) why do you feel the need to make it sound like the OP is a kook - when in fact he's just offering a possible new example of this puzzling, and quite well-substantiated (subjectively) issue?

originally posted by: skunkape23
It sucks the Nazis put the stink on the swastika. It is a lovely symbol. I'm afraid there is no restoring it to its former glory.

And it won't be long before the same can be said of the "Don't Tread On Me" flag.

Funny you mention the NM state flag. I was born and raised in NM. I recall in highschool, in one of my classes, we had a huge almanac.Inside, it had illustrations of all the state flags. New Mexicos was all red with a yellow zia. Instead of the other way around.

I always thought it was weird.

I find it interesting that the New Mexico University Yearbook still used the Swastika in name and symbol through to 1969 - 24 years after WWII ended.

Why didn't they stop using the symbol and label it as taboo along with everyone else?

a reply to: JohnPhoenix

As far as I can recall, the New Mexico State University yearbook remained "The Swastika" as a tribute to the Native American groups in the state who used it for hundreds of years before the Nazis corrupted the symbol and its meaning. The yearbook changed its name when one of the history professors and some students on campus Initiated a campaign to get it changed. The professor was Dr. Brown, and he still taught when I attended NMSU in late 80s. He taught a brilliant course on the Holocaust.