Question ATS More…

originally posted by: Mak Manto

originally posted by: ChiefD
Oh goody, another thread from someone not living in the US slamming US media......yawn.....

Yeah, like I'd rather take a ridiculous "media" like RT, Info Wars, WND, and their batty crazy ilk seriously. How anyone in their right mind can call these legit news sources is beyond me. Along with your drama laden whining as to how the ATS site owners are messed up, this smacks of star and flag whoring.

I think most people on here agree that RT isn't legit, but what they're saying is that ATS is being hypocritical in how they act.

SensiblyReckless, I like that phrase, ATS treason.

This is what I'm a bit miffed at. The staff has taken a view on how bad and biased other sites are, but ATS's # doesn't stink, and to even mention it, you're commiting ATS treason on here.

The difference between ATS and other sites. Is that we are still talking about this. The OP and all people who think like him would probably of been perma banned on other sites. I personally think ATS and their mods are being fair and fairly restrained compared to almost every other site. Like I said when you do not have strong moderators all you end up with is swearing and trolling. The policies they put in place allow us to discuss things like this very topic in an open manner.

a reply to: karmicecstasy

Only because the thread is now on the front page...

And no, many times they're not fair. You say to me that without strong moderators, there would be trolling and swearing. Have you looked at half the threads involving Israel and Palestine or on ISIS?

Members are attacking each other, so I'm going to post my comment in the thread that I made that one of the super moderators deleted, because he thought I was "bad mouthing" ATS members...

Congratulations, ATS...

This site has become nothing more than a den of people accusing each other of being for the terrorists, using hateful words against the Palestinians and the Israeli's and simply hating for what is happening.

The fact so many people on here have become mean-spirited bigots, spewing hatred, it's become way too much for me.

This post, for those of you who may come to attack me for it, is not for Palestine or Israel. It's simply disgust at what is happening.

Well done, jerk-offs. You've made this site into the very thing it wasn't supposed to be. For the admins and mods of ATS, please see what your site has become and do understand some of us aren't accepting it anymore.

Russia produces amazingly well produced propaganda on a regular basis. Why anyone feels RT, a government funded and supported source is somehow free of this, makes me chuckle a little. You are the suckers they are looking for. I would never say trust CNN, Fox, or any other U.S. news source. You must pick and choose what you take in wisely. Same goes for RT. The most truthful news source? Please...

Clearly by the # of staunch supporters they have however, they are certainly doing their job well! The Russian government should give their mouthpieces a raise. : )

I can totally see what SO is saying...I'm not an expert on american sociology but my understanding is deeper than it was... America is RTs biggest audience & they are sowing seeds of doubt while appealing to peoples confirmation bias, making them unquestioneing "subscribers" basically to Russian State funded media. RTs role in shaping the American psyche is somewhat worrying at a time when big cracks seem to be appearing in American society the likes of which have not seen since the Civil War..
I think that's what SO is getting at..that RT wants to exacerbate American skepticism, and cause a significant "pole shift" in peoples fundamental outlook "Question More" - sometimes you can question so much you loose trust in your fellow human beings, in your neighbours, the people that raised you, the people that fed you etc.........unless SO is just really funking with us, I think that's what he's essentially saying¿ saying as someone else put it "they want to annex the off topic forums" funkadelic ...
But truly worrying... especially when they get $300million per year from Russian state finance...

originally posted by: Mak Manto
a reply to: karmicecstasy

Only because the thread is now on the front page...

And no, many times they're not fair. You say to me that without strong moderators, there would be trolling and swearing. Have you looked at half the threads involving Israel and Palestine or on ISIS?

Members are attacking each other, so I'm going to post my comment in the thread that I made that one of the super moderators deleted, because he thought I was "bad mouthing" ATS members...

Congratulations, ATS...

This site has become nothing more than a den of people accusing each other of being for the terrorists, using hateful words against the Palestinians and the Israeli's and simply hating for what is happening.

The fact so many people on here have become mean-spirited bigots, spewing hatred, it's become way too much for me.

This post, for those of you who may come to attack me for it, is not for Palestine or Israel. It's simply disgust at what is happening.

Well done, jerk-offs. You've made this site into the very thing it wasn't supposed to be. For the admins and mods of ATS, please see what your site has become and do understand some of us aren't accepting it anymore.

Yes I am saying without strong moderators it would be 1000 times worse than it is now. Have you been anywhere else on the internet lately. Conversations are just swearing, trolling, and picture responses. With no substance whatsoever.

I think your post was removed for saying well done jerk-offs. I have seen plenty of posts saying those same things as you did without that and they are still on here.

This isn't about whether or not RT is a tool of the Russian government, or if American media is the better choice to go to.

Look at the title of the thread: Question ATS More...

And the question people are asking is if the staff is going to be the same as usual, getting angry and going after those who do, or if they're going to drop the veil of hypocrisy and stop.

a reply to: Mak Manto

It would be a service of poetic justice rendered should this thread disappear.

Maybe RT could run a bias confirmation piece afterwards.

originally posted by: Mak Manto
This isn't about whether or not RT is a tool of the Russian government, or if American media is the better choice to go to.

Look at the title of the thread: Question ATS More...

And the question people are asking is if the staff is going to be the same as usual, getting angry and going after those who do, or if they're going to drop the veil of hypocrisy and stop.

What veil of hypocrisy. It would be hypocritical if ATS only allowed threads that bash RT. They allow threads that bash every news network. Who are they going after. In your example of them going after you. It is obvious your post was taken down for saying well done jerk-offs. Taking your post down for that is not going after someone. When there are multiple posts and even rant threads saying the same things and worse about ATS. They just did not call people jerk-offs so they are still up. What would be going after someone is if ATS took down all their, posts, threads, and banned the person.Then put up for all to see your IP address and all information you used to join the site.

a reply to: TinfoilTP

Once again, I don't hear people going on about how RT is not biased...

I think everyone agrees it is, but this is about what ATS is becoming.

originally posted by: Mak Manto
a reply to: TinfoilTP

, but this is about what ATS is becoming.

A site owner posts a well explained opinion.
Some members by their very nature see a conspiracy.
This site became a conspiracy magnet long time ago, what changed? I don't get it?

originally posted by: karmicecstasy

originally posted by: Mak Manto
This isn't about whether or not RT is a tool of the Russian government, or if American media is the better choice to go to.

Look at the title of the thread: Question ATS More...

And the question people are asking is if the staff is going to be the same as usual, getting angry and going after those who do, or if they're going to drop the veil of hypocrisy and stop.

What veil of hypocrisy. It would be hypocritical if ATS only allowed threads that bash RT. They allow threads that bash every news network. Who are they going after. In your example of them going after you. It is obvious your post was taken down for saying well done jerk-offs. Taking your post down for that is not going after someone. When there are multiple posts and even rant threads saying the same things and worse about ATS. They just did not call people jerk-offs so they are still up. What would be going after someone is if ATS took down all their, posts, threads, and banned the person.Then put up for all to see your IP address and all information you used to join the site.

They don't allow threads that bash ATS, they don't allow threads that show evidence that ATS could be a tool of the government.

That's my point. It's alright to say MSNBC, Fox News and CNN are tools of the government, but if ATS is linked, goodbye thread.

originally posted by: TinfoilTP

originally posted by: Mak Manto
a reply to: TinfoilTP

, but this is about what ATS is becoming.

A site owner posts a well explained opinion.
Some members by their very nature see a conspiracy.
This site became a conspiracy magnet long time ago, what changed? I don't get it?

I don't see a conspiracy...

I see ignorance and hypocrisy.

a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin

Sure FOX, CNN, BBC and all the rest of them are bias or could even be accused of pushing propaganda but they are not quite in the same league of RT.

While I agree wholeheartedly that RT is foreign anti-west, pro-east motivated propaganda, and I've long since lost faith in infowars-- they are still useful as a platform from which to begin an investigative research project, I must point out that western media, e.g., news, movies, TV, music, etc., are also propaganda at its finest. They are on point with Bernays style modern public relations. There's no way around it; it is what it is.

When it comes down to the wire I'm a Texan, and the United States is my team. Russian propaganda is always going to seem worse to me than that of my own team. That does not mean that I, or anyone else, should ignore/neglect the issues here at home. We are completely surrounded by propaganda literally nearly everywhere we go.

168617: I read the first page of the thread up until the point you accused people of the same thing as above. Looking at the thread in a vacuum, without comparing multiple threads to see if those posters do it over and over again. It seems like you just do not like people disagreeing with you.

What annoyed me, is when something I never meant to say was used against me: “80% of Americans want Obama to bomb Syria?” was never meant. What was meant, was there was a poll in which 80% of Americans wanted Obama to ask Congress for approval to bomb Syria (as opposed to not ask Congress at all)
www.nbcnews.com...
at the time this poll made sense because it looked like Congress would not grant Obama any permission to bomb Syria (owing in part to the Republic split on the issue, owing in other part to the Iraq 2 stupidity-nature of that very proposition).

Whenever you post a thread, you are going to have people who are of the exact opposite position of you posting

Good. Everyone could make an echo chamber if they really wanted.
Yet there’s little I find more infuriating than me being criticised for a position I do not hold –am actually hostile to. I thought it very clever (but derailing) the way someone selected something to take out of context. Yes; I wrote this thread badly, but what was taken out of context I felt very selective, and therefore not remotely fair for what went into that thread.

Before the first page of that thread is over you are obviously mad that some people are still not agreeing with you and you start accusing people of being paid agents.

I don’t see myself that way, but there’s little I can do, if that’s how you see me. You’re more than entitled to think I was only angry with people because they disagreed with me.
But I know what runs in my own head is different (it’s what’s already been said).

Or maybe I am just a paid shill lol and you can dismiss what I say out of hand.

No. I don’t think you’re trolling at all –just expressing your opinion.

I expect that check in the mail ATS!

No. I don’t send ATS hate mail either (just compliments & sometimes questions)

TinFoilTIP quote]Just because your thread doesn't go in the direction you expected, doesn't mean it was because of a huge conspiracy. I see you making accusations, even posting an old thread. Yes I know that but the reason why I mention that old thread, is because there are certain members there who I have sincerely come to believe, deliberately have a derailing influence on ATS that are too challenging.

I don't see anything but the usual stuff. Some people with strong opposing opinions show up and take you down a trail they enjoy traveling.

Unfortunately if I’m right their activity won’t be that blatant.

I wish I could actually name ATS usernames, but if I did I’d probably be violating a rule, and in any case I happen to sincerely agree with the reasons for this rule. But (rightfully or wrongly) I feel the said thread does contain names. Just decide for yourself.

originally posted by: Mak Manto

originally posted by: karmicecstasy

originally posted by: Mak Manto
This isn't about whether or not RT is a tool of the Russian government, or if American media is the better choice to go to.

Look at the title of the thread: Question ATS More...

And the question people are asking is if the staff is going to be the same as usual, getting angry and going after those who do, or if they're going to drop the veil of hypocrisy and stop.

What veil of hypocrisy. It would be hypocritical if ATS only allowed threads that bash RT. They allow threads that bash every news network. Who are they going after. In your example of them going after you. It is obvious your post was taken down for saying well done jerk-offs. Taking your post down for that is not going after someone. When there are multiple posts and even rant threads saying the same things and worse about ATS. They just did not call people jerk-offs so they are still up. What would be going after someone is if ATS took down all their, posts, threads, and banned the person.Then put up for all to see your IP address and all information you used to join the site.

They don't allow threads that bash ATS, they don't allow threads that show evidence that ATS could be a tool of the government.

That's my point. It's alright to say MSNBC, Fox News and CNN are tools of the government, but if ATS is linked, goodbye thread.

I have seen plenty of threads and posts that bash and question ATS.(looks around) I think I am in one right now. No site is absolutely perfect but this site does better then most when dealing with these topics. People also allude to ATS being a spook enterprise all the time. In the thread SkepticOverlord put up about RT many people do just that. There posts were not taken down. I can still read them. ATS has not repelled down a rope and men in black flashed my memory away. That I know of. I am setting up cameras ATS. Ill catch you next time.

Threads and posts usually get taken down because of the way they are worded not the contents of the thread or post. However I will say what I always say when a conversation reaches this point of disagreement. You are free to believe what you want. Even on ATS, gasp. So I will respect your view and leave you to believe what you want. Have a nice night. It was a pleasure talking with you.

ChiefD Oh goody, another thread from someone not living in the US slamming US media......yawn.....

How dare us wretched foreigners have opinions hay?
I’m commenting on Western propaganda generally, and believe Britain and America operate under (almost) exactly the same media, as well as cross-party-consensus, as American policy is following. This after all is why we are your greatest ally (or is it you’re Britain’s greatest ally? I’m really not totally sure, and I definitely don’t say it’s an exclusively one way relationship).

Yeah, like I'd rather take a ridiculous "media" like RT, Info Wars, WND, and their batty crazy ilk seriously.

In other words they’re not corporate enough?

How anyone in their right mind can call these legit news sources is beyond me.

I suppose some people research their facts.

Along with your drama laden whining as to how the ATS site owners are messed up, this smacks of star and flag whoring

I never knew criticising the people who created this site was actually star & flag whoring. I’m actually very grateful towards people like SkepticOverlord owning this site, but obviously being grateful, isn’t the same, as agreeing politically.

a reply to: Liberal1984

What annoyed me, is when something I never meant to say was used against me: “80% of Americans want Obama to bomb Syria?” was never meant. What was meant, was there was a poll in which 80% of Americans wanted Obama to ask Congress for approval to bomb Syria (as opposed to not ask Congress at all) www.nbcnews.com... at the time this poll made sense because it looked like Congress would not grant Obama any permission to bomb Syria (owing in part to the Republic split on the issue, owing in other part to the Iraq 2 stupidity-nature of that very proposition).

That I understand and sympathize with. That is just what some posters do so they can win the debate. So in their minds they are a winner. Its just something we all have to deal with from time to time. Is it rude and an obvious tactic to deflect what your saying, yes it is. Does it mean someone is a paid agent. Probably not, but heck you can never know with a hundred percent certainty either way.

Just either ignore those posters or come at the subject from another direction that they can not refute and call them on what they are doing. But if you automatically play the paid agents card your only giving them more ammo to use against you. You should not accuse people of that unless you are 100 percent sure with absolute proof.

originally posted by: Mak Manto

originally posted by: ChiefD
Oh goody, another thread from someone not living in the US slamming US media......yawn.....

Yeah, like I'd rather take a ridiculous "media" like RT, Info Wars, WND, and their batty crazy ilk seriously. How anyone in their right mind can call these legit news sources is beyond me. Along with your drama laden whining as to how the ATS site owners are messed up, this smacks of star and flag whoring.

I think most people on here agree that RT isn't legit, but what they're saying is that ATS is being hypocritical in how they act.

SensiblyReckless, I like that phrase, ATS treason.

This is what I'm a bit miffed at. The staff has taken a view on how bad and biased other sites are, but ATS's # doesn't stink, and to even mention it, you're commiting ATS treason on here.

Ok, what you described is a perceived conspiracy by yourself of the site.

If I walk into a private establishment and tell the owners it stinks, then tell all the members enjoying the establishment it stinks asking them why don't they leave....... Do you get the picture?

All I have is my biased opinion forced upon others.

If I pointed out the dead mice rotting away in every dusty corner and pointed out the cockroaches and cat feces everywhere, then maybe the people would listen and the owners would clean their place up.
You come with your opinion and no irrefutable proof.

I already told you, the thread's become too big. It's on the front page, so they won't do it.

a reply to: SensiblyReckless

Haha, if my delusions are anything to go by, then Skunk Works is the place to find out what they are hiding from you and LOL is where to go when you want to find out what they are doing to you.

Who needs MSM?