The Collective Unconscious is a Psychic Backdrop which Marginalizes the Paranormal

originally posted by: BlueMule

Well, I don't think it is a given that UFOs are little green men in nuts n' bolts spaceships. That doesn't stop everyone from jumping to that conclusion.

In fact, based on my experience and studies, they most probably are every bit as paranormal as fairies. Same archetype, different form.

That doesn't make them hallucinations. It makes them psychophysical manifestations of the collective unconscious in symbolic, mythological form.

No one was suggesting they were all little green men and not everyone, indeed, few, "jump to that conclusion." Why are you trivializing that explanation? The point is that you have chosen one explanation over another and declared it to be true. Listen to yourself: "psycophysical manifestations of collective unconscious in symbolic, mythological form." What a mouthful! You've been reading Jung again, haven't you?

No culture serves as a repository for every bit of human experience, every bit of human knowledge, that ever was or ever will be. The collective psyche does. Time is not linear for it. It flows in both directions.

Time as we know it does not age the collective psyche, whereas cultures have a life-cycle. They are born, they age, they die. Then they reincarnate.

"Culture" can be used as a collective noun, meaning all culture, and it still applies. Not only that, people have at least a general idea of what that means. Your "collective psyche," on the other hand, is an unproven idea that you are taking as a given, and thereby hangs your "theory." You're approaching this with the "voice of authority" and include concepts of time, reincarnation, and the psyche that are nowhere near being accepted as anything more than theory.

I am suggesting there are alternative explanations that are just as valid as what you promote, and that there's no particular reason to accept your explanation over others'.

originally posted by: schuyler

No one was suggesting they were all little green men and not everyone, indeed, few, "jump to that conclusion."

Few?! You've GOT to be kidding me dude.

Why are you trivializing that explanation?

Because it doesn't jive with my experiences as a contactee or my studies as a comparativist so I've discounted it. I'm not twisting your arm to make you discount it too. Believe what you want.

The point is that you have chosen one explanation over another and declared it to be true.

So what? I'm not twisting your arm here. You don't like my explanation you don't have to accept it. All over ATS there are theads where people chose explanations for things. Go pick on one of them.

I am suggesting there are alternative explanations that are just as valid as what you promote, and that there's no particular reason to accept your explanation over others'.

Sir, I was not born yesterday. I'm aware there are alternative explanations. I've checked them out, and I've made up my own mind. Thank you. Good day.

"I am suggesting there are alternative explanations that are just as valid as what you promote, and that there's no particular reason to accept your explanation over others"

Sir, I was not born yesterday. I'm aware there are alternative explanations. I've checked them out, and I've made up my own mind. Thank you. Good day.

In America the young are always ready to give to those who are older than themselves the full benefits of their inexperience. -- Oscar Wilde

Lol

love of all keep searching fo your light www.youtube.com...

a reply to: BlueMule

I agree with the idea that the supernatural is directly connected to the unconscious mind to some extent, and that Jung's study of the collective unconscious helps patterns emerge from world belief. Where I disagree is that the collective unconsciousness is "not ready" for the big reveal.

The scales between believer and non-believer are in no way even, or, for that matter, weighted against the believers.

If the collective unconscious is clever enough to homogenize archetypes into consistent patterns based on human experience, then that same collective unconscious is powerful enough that the majority viewpoint would manifest as reality.

Take this example:

• The Sumerian Inanna
• The Assyrio-Babylonian Ishtar
• The Egyptian-Semitic Astarte/Hathor
• The Judeo-Christian Ashtoreth
• The Greco-Roman Aphrodite/Venus
• The Norse Frigga/Freya

All stem from the same archetype: the love goddess who embodies the feminine principle in spirituality. All stem from the same personification: of the planet Venus. All stem from the same base human desire for sexuality and satisfaction.

If the collective unconscious was powerful enough to create, and re-create this archetype, again and again, over thousands of years, hundreds of thousands of miles, and millions of people, then it is powerful enough to manifest the supernatural in the current age as well.

Based on a study of consensus forms from 2012, more than half the world's populations prescribes to some form of supernatural, religious, or spiritual belief:

• Christianity: 31%
• Islam: 23 %
• Hinduism: 15%
• Buddhism: 7%
• Folk Religions: 5%
• Other religions: 0.8%
• Judiasm: 0.2%

Roughly 81% of the world's population have some kind of religious affiliation, compared to only 16% identifying as irreligious or atheistic. This, of course, would place the scales heavily in favor of the believer over the non-believer, as nearly 5 out of every 6 people believe in some kind of supernatural or spiritual force.

So, lets take, as an example, the "existence" of angelic beings. By "angelic beings" I mean: divine intermediaries; creatures who exist as spiritual entities between the physical species of Earth, and the divine emanations of the Spirit World.

Where do we find these figures? Well, we find them:

• in Buddhism as the Dhamapalas, or defenders of the Divine Law
• in Christianity as angels, servants of God
• in Hinduism as the Deva, or shining ones; lesser-gods
• in Islam as malāʾikah, the divine messengers of Allah
• in Judaism as the malakim, divine messengers of the Lord
• in Jungian psychology as the daemon, or id, our subconscious, higher-self
• in Neo-Babylonian paganism as the Apkallu, aladlammu, Ugallu, and Lamassu
• in Platonic Neo-paganism Daimons, supernatural spirits that accompany human beings
• in various folk traditions as Guardian spirits, Spirit guides, and Totems

This is, of course, only a small sample of many world religions, and their beliefs in angelic beings or divine messengers. However, it is safe to assume that at least half (but certainly more) of the world's population believe in angelic beings. The 2013 consensus for world population was 7.1 billion, meaning at least 3.5 billion people believe in angels.

Now, if a population of 20,000 people (the average size of a bustling city in Mesopotamia) was powerful enough to bring the Inanna archetype to life, the exponentially larger sample size of 3.5 billion which believe in angels today should have no trouble doing the same.

So, where are our angels?


~ Wandering Scribe

Your talking about synchronization in some way really.

Also there other metaphysical ideas really that somewhat go along the lines...albeit, a bit cartoon. There one anime I watched not to long ago, called "Fullmetal Alchemist Brotherhood". Anyways, there two omnipresent things, ones a character called "Truth", while the others a Gate that it guards. The gate supposedly like a portal(that bright light at the end of a tunnel), which allows a person access to some core consciousness that has an unbearable amount of information, but usually it comes at a ironic price of the persons desire.

Here a clip of Truth and the main villain, although it might be a spoiler if you ever get into it. Btw, the gate usually has images, reflecting the persons growth, or alchemy( not science alchemy, but hey they tried pretty good with the science in the show)


Truth is a universal d*ck, as it will take the shape of the individual, with a grinning smile. However, it ends up claiming that it god, the earth, and just plain universal. Some of the other character even, mention that the gate is more like a giant central nervous system.

I kno...Very off-topic.

a reply to: Wandering Scribe

So, where are our angels

They should be on tap! Another question would be, Who has been messing with our supply?

a reply to: Wandering Scribe

Thanks for your thoughtful post, old friend. I enjoyed it very much!

I do so very much love the planet Venus. Mars is my ruling planet and there is something about Venus that just drives me wild! I love all her aspects, her forms, her ways.

Except one time when Venus was retrograde. I caught a ride with her as we drove backwards. I remember how she became utterly consumed with unreasoning lust for the flesh, any flesh, at any cost. It was overwhelming and unnerving. As Adonis knew full well.

The collective psyche has been projected onto the stars, planets, constellations for many ages. This accounts for the synchronicity between our minds and the cosmos. Our astral bodies are pushed and pulled by the connection to the stars and planets, and so are the archetypes that have been projected onto the stars.

Yes the collective psyche could in theory overwhelm the boundary between the conscious and unconscious mind, spilling the archetypes over into the conscious awareness of all. And in theory Venus could control her lust. Except when she can't. Then Adonis presumes to judge her Divine lust, and in so doing earns the wrath of her avenging Boar.

Every archetype has a positive and a negative aspect. Every angel has a demon. Every Gandalf has a Saruman, who would use his wisdom to lead the world astray for his own ambition. Every Christ, an anti-Christ. Each checks the others power, and so even though the scales are weighed against disbelievers, there is another kind of balance going on. A balance within a balance.

The dominant religion of the age of Pisces, Christianity, seems to have been written in the stars. Two fish - the Christ and anti-Christ, took turns dominating the sky during this age. First the Christ, at the dawn of the age. Then, as the second fish gained dominance in the sky, the paradigm of science was born. Christianity became dysfunctional. And yet, the archetype of rebirth endures.

As Pisces draws to a close, the two sides of the coin will form a new synthesis which will lead us into the age of Aquarius. Religion and science will merge, and neither will ever be the same again. It's tempting to condemn the anti-Christ, just as it is tempting to judge the lust of Venus. But they are both sides of the same coin, and the Goddess of Complete Being must be apprehended. That requires us to do what Adonis could not - withold judgement, so that her two sides can form a Complete Being beyond pairs of opposites. Otherwise her Boar will come for us, and then into darkness we go as we atone through death.

Perhaps during the course of the age of Aquarius, we will leave our solar system, withdraw our projections, and become enlightened. Or perhaps we will project them anew onto new stars.

Hope that made sense, lol.

originally posted by: TonyS
a reply to: BlueMule

I don't think I'm understanding some of your terminology and/or how you're using certain terms.

You said: "There are many people who fear the paranormal, and they contribute to the collective unconsicous just like everyone else." A collective "unconscious"? Unconscious, at least to me, means....unaware; brain dead; comatose; when you're unconscious, aren't you knocked out altogether? Did you mean...subconscious? Subconscious means to me; background consciousness. Something you know but aren't presently grinding on in conscious thought.

If something is blocking the paranormal I'd think its because the collective subconscious is utterly oblivious to everything around them except for what they are personally engaged in at the moment. I'm not explaining that very well, am I.

Oh well.

Carl Jung, really the guy responsible for bringing the concept and term to modern respectable thought, called it the unconscious...and collective unconscious...basically interchangeable....

I've seen a few UFO's in my life, and also had a number of...unusual experiences. I never use the word 'paranormal,' not intentionally for a specific reason, I just don't. But focusing on the UFO thing, particularly in relation to the discussion of 'what they are.' I can only say based on my experiences. The first UFO I ever saw, as a child, didn't seem to have any rhyme or reason for why it appeared when and where it did. At least that I can recall being aware of. It did zoom extremely fast out of nowhere, stop directly above/in front of us, before it zoomed off again though. Perhaps that could be an argument my/our consciousness was somehow involved in its manifestation. That one though, very much looked like a physical craft, 'flying disc,' the stereotypical image.

I have seen 2 or 3 as an adult as well, though. These were different, in a couple ways. These didn't look like physical craft at all. They were beautiful and colorful shapes/patterns that flew through the sky. It looked like energy, not a physical craft at all. Also, it didn't seem to be random at all. It very clearly corresponded to my own consciousness. One time for instance, was a time during which I was in a 'high state of spiritual consciousness.' I was once during this time considering the potential for my consciousness to alter my reality. I saw this computer-generated image of a person looking into the sky, and it just had all this amazing looking stuff in it. I considered the possibility for my consciousness to even alter things in that way and to that degree, the way the sky looked, producing amazing looking objects in the sky. Right after this, I go outside, and I see this amazing looking UFO, which again was more like a beautiful colorful shape that flew through the sky. The other time(s) as well, it corresponded somehow to be being in a high state of consciousness, and considering the potential for my consciousness to manifest externally, that they appeared. So I am definitely of the belief that UFO's are manifested by individual consciousness, or perhaps in some cases group consciousness. Though I do believe they are manifested by consciousness, it does not mean they are 'unreal.' It does not even mean that there is not potential for them to manifest in a more physical and tangible way.

originally posted by: BlueMule
That's why ET can't land on the White House lawn. ET, just like any other aspect of the paranormal, is caught in the currents of the collective psyche.

So you're saying ghosts and ETs aren't real, just psychic stuff, or are you saying our minds somehow prevent ETs who have their own minds from landing and something similar for ghosts? I'm not following.

a reply to: Frith

Hi Frith. I'm saying that ghosts and ET are real relative to us, and we are real relative to them. We project them, they project us. The fabric of reality is consciousness, not matter. We are pulling each other up by our psychic bootstraps.

a reply to: BlueMule

What is your opinion of testimony from people like the late astronaut Gordon Cooper who said he saw footage from a camera crew he worked with that took film of a landed UFO in which he also claimed the footage was sent off to another government facility and never seen again?

We do from time to time get blips of stuff that would blow open the subject of UFOs, but the cover-up keeps it from getting any bigger than it already has. I don't see how that type of thing could relate to a collective unconscious controlling it. Rather it would seem to be what it appears to be. Individuals who are fearful of the revelation and keeping it hidden.

a reply to: Frith

To paraphrase Galadriel,

"We sang of leaves, of leaves of gold, and leaves of gold there grew:
Of wind we sang, a wind there came and in the branches blew."

Mythology is the song of the universe. ET is a modern mythos.

We are living in a song, a poem.

"Poems are rough notations for the music we are" -Rumi

originally posted by: BlueMule
Mythology is the song of the universe. ET is a modern mythos.

When you post that you did finally answer my first question.

You don't think ETs are actually real. You believe them to be some type of psychic projection.

a reply to: Frith

In a reality that is, itself, the dream of a cosmic dreamer, the song of a cosmic singer, psychic projections are ultimately all there is.
Soul within soul. Everything is soul.

Mental, Transcendental monism.

i've only known of or met one person in my life that had a literal connection to the collective unconscious.

she explained it basically as this. the collective unconscious is like a library that houses every memory of every event that has taken place on earth. but, she called it the racial unconscious because it's kind of species specific. meaning our collective unconscious doesn't contain memories from every alien species that has existed. however, it does contain memories of some particular aliens, those of whom who have reincarnated into human bodies. it's really hard to explain just by typing it out.

but, these things, these paranormal entities. spirits, bigfoot, aliens, they exist and can co-exist in our physical reality. whether or not their "homes" are in bordering or adjacent realities or dimensions. because some beings have the ability to traverse multiple realities/dimensions.

now that being said, there is native american idea of the Tulpa. Which is a physic projection. For example, 1 million people have an intense fear of "slender man". This intense fear in turn causes the manifestation or physic projection of "slender man" thus causing people to have legitimate experiences with an entity that was previously just an idea or a fear.

Psychic energy is generated by the force of electrons colliding in the brain.
Like a large hadron collider, The brain is a like a large intestine with many connecting sites to other *folds* in the brain.
The difference being is that these are filled with neurons, which carry the charges across the layers to other sides of the brain.

The brain will light up all over because these charges are jumping but also colliding.

the body's brain consists of mainly water, So it is already highly conductive.
This is why when you recieve a volt of electricity it can overload your brain and lead to organ failure.

some people ground electricity very well and are immune to large volts.

the ability to condense charges of a self generated nature * the particles used are not dirty particles* Something physics needs to pick up on.

is that not all energy is the same form of energy and not all electricity is the same electricity. You could change the currents of electricity, but if they are not both generated by copper coils. Then they would not be the same. And depending on where the energy was obtained, Other particles resembling and acting like electrons can take their place.
Because even air can have higher concentrations or lower concentrations of any given element depending where you are.

It's not all black and white, You could get down to calculations and find which particles are better are emmiting lumins and if those lumins have a certain quality compared to other gas and there for electricty.

Sure it all runs generally the same, But subtle changes still exist.
Anyways the brain is constantly feeding these implosions, So it carries away waves. In theory the human body just be generating radio waves as well as electro magnetic frequencies from the moving electrons.

The tubes are in nano scale tho, I believe humans exist in a *etheric state* as well as physical because of these principals. The particles generated from the implosions would react differently to physical mass because the outcome is different than an atom and different than the regular charged particles.

If reincarnation is real, This would be the process that allows it to function. Because the compressed new particles generated hold the bits of consiousness that generated it and hense memories which were stored in the cell.
So they are fragments of memories being generated and these memories exist through conductive particles aligned for containment of memories in neuronic cells.

If it that makes sense, its bordering on the same princpals of a black hole somewhat. The brain acts as a funnel which is constantly compressing these charges into self conductive mass.
The effects can be seen as an aura. Likewise, Spirits can appear darkened because the particles itself is compressed and does not absorb light unless trying to manifest the particles will pull together to form the preprogramed image last saved to them when alive.

I don't think all species of animals have the same processes, But reguardless it would be an evolutionary feature of advanced life for some species.
The ability of recollection is the most powerful in the universe.
It's the only thing that can lead an arcitech from blueprints to physically applying the model. And preserving the models for future generations.

our importance to learn and remember is constantly a daily reminder.
How many rituals do we have for things that have happened in he passed?
Like today is Canada day, Happy canada day everyone !

It's these little things that seem so seemingly insignifigant that should lead one to think that there is more to humanity than what we are being told.

But the impossible is not possible. One needs energy in order to create or destroy and needs the proper amplifers to do so.

And the more energy and mass is being transported and spent in any maner the higher the surface tension and energy spent.

mass consiousness only works in the spirital plane, the realm of compressed particles composed of souls.
We can try to align to their frequencies and communicate with them if the shards are still intact.

SO mass consiousness can occure where the energy is most present.
What we think and do can have a ripple effect across the whole of human brain vibrations. Since the particles are attuned to our specific essence since created and generated within us and not an external source.
We can all feel each other think, the subconsious will decipher it. But the consious mind cannot assimilate and tune the frequency like a radio station to recieve the signal.

You could create technology to talk to people in their hear through these methods, But it would a computer program and non dirty electric emmitters. Perhaps biotech could make living machinery to acomplish the task to get a clean clear signal.

Anyways as for UFOs, Those are very much real.
Why even argue. Humans have probs orbitting in space and we are using a poorly effecient technology *rockets*
Whose to say if humans had anti-gravity we wouldn't be orbitting Titan right now sending a live feed of first world *colonizers* that's right we would send a colony first without thinking at the first chance we could do so.

And its not hypocritcal to think that other species are flying around doing the same?
Oh wait, The big bang is enough justification to say we are the first advanced consious to pop from the primordial soup of existance.

Pretty ignorant IMO, and a huge cause factor of why people act say and do the things they do now.

They think well what the hey if we die **** it we never had a chance.

You as an individual probably never had a chance but can't speak for the rest of us who want to achieve solar colony status.

People can imagin a lot of stuff and it helps us adapt and create new technology but don't think for second that your version of how J.K rollings should of been is going to spawn into existance just because you thunk it up.

We can only share ideas and feels between each other because this consious energy is communication energy. Its not blow the world up energy. Its a genetic imprint left over by body after the compressed particles carry their last thought of function with is primarly memories. When it hops from one vessel to another, You are generating alternate energy of the same verity because each body is different as well as each * soul* but the fragments get meshed together. This is why spiritualists will say some souls are stronger than others is because literally the souls are merged together with many passed lives and energies to create a more complex complete spiritual organism.

Poltergiests are what these beings are. Newer souls may be one or 3 combined fragmentary states. But the shards can be taken from electronics, or by other particle consiousness existing in the *spiritual plane* of preprogrammed particles.

Its not completely impossible at all and is more probable to occure in some of these ways.
If we can define the paranormal with dry science.

What is the paranormal then? But being normalized.

This is 100% truth. The *paranormal* is being normalized.
It will become so normalized to the point that science will completely inhabit its domain with concrete evidence.
This will happen. The truth cannot be hidden when the goal of mans quest is the know the truth.
It will come back to haunt them like the specters skeptics laugh at.

a reply to: AnuTyr

Your post will take me a while to digest. Please stand by.

originally posted by: BlueMule
In a reality that is, itself, the dream of a cosmic dreamer, the song of a cosmic singer, psychic projections are ultimately all there is.
Soul within soul. Everything is soul.

Mental, Transcendental monism.

Humans are horrible to each other. We kill, rape, and enslave each other. Wars have killed millions. In the USA we just got through our government lying to us about the threat of Iraq and starting a war which has resulted in ongoing death and chaos.

As a result I think its very likely we would hide things from ourselves like ET visitation. It fits quite well with our viciousness and thirst for control over our fellow man. Using collective unconscious as an explanation isn't needed when you think about it in that way.