For everyone "claiming their grandfather is a 33 degree mason"

Originally posted by theron dunnTHIS is how you defame masonry? By defaming your own honor or showing you have none?

I wasn't "Defame"ing anyone...
the point of my post was that the girls weren't whores..
and the last sentance was meant as a joke , sorry if it doesn't come off that way but it's rather late at night...

Originally posted by I_AM_that_I_AM

Originally posted by theron dunnTHIS is how you defame masonry? By defaming your own honor or showing you have none?

I wasn't "Defame"ing anyone...
the point of my post was that the girls weren't whores..
and the last sentance was meant as a joke , sorry if it doesn't come off that way but it's rather late at night...

Not YOU, the person that originally posted the inference...

Just to add Rose Croix can confer 33rd Degree if like you say another 33rd Degree has passed away and yes you are invited.

Originally posted by benjj
I can 100% confirm that in English Freemasonry there are only ever 33 33rd degree masters at any one time. To be raised to the sublime degree of 33rd another must have died. I have it on good authority that the same goes for all other grand lodges, the US included. Therefore the likelyhood that 'my grandfather was a...' is a load of rubbish.

Just to add a little credance to my comment, I am a freemason myself, the 8th consecutive generation of my family, the highest mason in which was up to around 16 I think. The degrees from 17-31 are 'symbolic' degrees and are conferred on the individual all in one go. So, to confirm, you go from 16-31 in one ceremony (its very long!). Anyone claiming to be a 18th, 19th 20th etc are talking out of their arse.

Hope this clears things up a little.

B

Originally posted by lucifuge
Just to add Rose Croix can confer 33rd Degree if like you say another 33rd Degree has passed away and yes you are invited.

That may be true, and again it may not... but Rose Croix (whatever that is...) is NOT a masonic group, though it may be a group with some masonic members... but Ford Motor Company has masonic members, and no one is claiming THAT is a lodge...

Originally posted by theron dunn

Originally posted by lucifuge
Just to add Rose Croix can confer 33rd Degree if like you say another 33rd Degree has passed away and yes you are invited.

That may be true, and again it may not... but Rose Croix (whatever that is...) is NOT a masonic group, though it may be a group with some masonic members... but Ford Motor Company has masonic members, and no one is claiming THAT is a lodge...

Rose Croix is the 18� of the Ancient and Accepted Scottish Rite of Freemasonry. Rose Croix Degrees were also included in the Rites of Memphis and Mitzraim, always being situated at the 18th.

Fiat Lvx.

ML, you are quite right, but in the context lucifuge offered it, it looked like he was claiming rose croix were a separte entity on its own, not a degree within the Scottish Rite...

Originally posted by theron dunn
ML, you are quite right, but in the context lucifuge offered it, it looked like he was claiming rose croix were a separte entity on its own, not a degree within the Scottish Rite...

Yes, I just wanted to clarify in case anyone became confused.

The 33� can be conferred only by a Supreme Council, or a degree of 33� Masons authorized to confer the degree. The 33� cannot be conferred in a Chapter of Rose Croix.

Fiat Lvx.

Sorry can you show me in my post where I claimed Rose Croix was a seperate entity on it's own? Did I say it wasn't a degree within Scottish Right? All I said was Rose Croix can confer 33rd Degree on you as a mason.

Originally posted by theron dunn
ML, you are quite right, but in the context lucifuge offered it, it looked like he was claiming rose croix were a separte entity on its own, not a degree within the Scottish Rite...

We are talking about the UK here and not confusing it with the US?

Originally posted by Masonic Light

Originally posted by theron dunn
ML, you are quite right, but in the context lucifuge offered it, it looked like he was claiming rose croix were a separte entity on its own, not a degree within the Scottish Rite...

Yes, I just wanted to clarify in case anyone became confused.

The 33� can be conferred only by a Supreme Council, or a degree of 33� Masons authorized to confer the degree. The 33� cannot be conferred in a Chapter of Rose Croix.

Fiat Lvx.

Originally posted by lucifuge
Sorry can you show me in my post where I claimed Rose Croix was a seperate entity on it's own? Did I say it wasn't a degree within Scottish Right? All I said was Rose Croix can confer 33rd Degree on you as a mason.

Originally posted by theron dunn
ML, you are quite right, but in the context lucifuge offered it, it looked like he was claiming rose croix were a separte entity on its own, not a degree within the Scottish Rite...

It LOOKED to me like that was what you were writing. If I was wrong, I most humbly apologize...

Originally posted by lucifuge
Sorry can you show me in my post where I claimed Rose Croix was a seperate entity on it's own? Did I say it wasn't a degree within Scottish Right? All I said was Rose Croix can confer 33rd Degree on you as a mason.

Not true. Only 33rd Degree Masons can confer the 33rd Degree. And Rose Croix is NOT the 33rd Degree. It's the 18th.

That's true in EVERY A.A.S.R. Jurisdiction. U.S., Canada, U.K., etc. etc.

By the way, it's Scottish RITE...not "Right"

Regards

[edit on 1-10-2004 by senrak]

Well I'm going off the advice of a highly respected brother who is currently 32* and he told me it was confered on him in Rose Croix. And that the only chance of him becoming 33rd was to be wealthy or until another one pops off and he is remembered by other confering bretheren. He is now waiting to be confered as Prov. Grand Tyler for East Lancashire. And he is also in the chair of 12 different lodges and is a member of about 20 in total, lives and breathes the fraternity.

Aside the fact in the UK being 33rd ranks you no higher than a MM.

Originally posted by senrak

Originally posted by lucifuge
Sorry can you show me in my post where I claimed Rose Croix was a seperate entity on it's own? Did I say it wasn't a degree within Scottish Right? All I said was Rose Croix can confer 33rd Degree on you as a mason.

Not true. Only 33rd Degree Masons can confer the 33rd Degree. And Rose Croix is NOT the 33rd Degree. It's the 18th.

That's true in EVERY A.A.S.R. Jurisdiction. U.S., Canada, U.K., etc. etc.

By the way, it's Scottish RITE...not "Right"

Regards

[edit on 1-10-2004 by senrak]

Originally posted by lucifuge
Well I'm going off the advice of a highly respected brother who is currently 32* and he told me it was confered on him in Rose Croix.

Both Senrak and your friend are correct...the difference is merely one of terminology.
The 33� can only be conferred in a Supreme Council...however, in the UK, the entire Rite is often referred to as "Rose Croix", as a sort of slang. In this sense, your friend is correct.
However, technically speaking, Rose Croix Masons are those Masons who have received the 18�. In other words, most Rose Croix Masons do not hold the 33�, and are thus incapable of conferring it upon others.

Aside the fact in the UK being 33rd ranks you no higher than a MM.

This is also true in the United States and Canada.

Fiat Lvx.

[edit on 1-10-2004 by Masonic Light]

My Grandfather was a mason, as was his father. They were members of a group/temple in OK. My father was going to go into it, but they apparently needed some money to let him in, and he didn't have it. The important thing was my Grandfather WAS NOT a 33 degree mason . My dad wasn't sure what he was, but he knew that.

My Dad says he has the freemason books from his father, but I haven't seen them. I have my Grandfather's ring with the freemason sign on it, it is too small for me though.

There's seems to be a few discrepancies here, and whilst a lot of you claim to be masons, very few of you seem to be able to agree on what the structure within masonry actually entails. Not accusing everyone by any means, but I've got a suspicion that not everyone on here is being totally truthful about their masonic status...

Apart from me, I'm not a mason and have never claimed to be and would have very little interest in ever becoming one

Careful, Oisin . . . . . Masonry is not the same everywhere. There are differences between Masonry in Canada, the U.S. and the U.K. I believe Canadian Masonry is very similar to U.K. Masonry. Southern Jurisdiction Masonry in the U.S. is also different in a some ways as well. I

Originally posted by LTD602
Careful, Oisin . . . . . Masonry is not the same everywhere. There are differences between Masonry in Canada, the U.S. and the U.K. I believe Canadian Masonry is very similar to U.K. Masonry. Southern Jurisdiction Masonry in the U.S. is also different in a some ways as well. I

Indeed. For example, in the UK, one must be a Christian in order to join the Scottish Rite (the English call it "The Ancient and Accepted Rite", and don't use the word "Scottish").
There, Scottish Rite meetings are held on the 18� (Rose Croix), while in the USA, at least usually, meetings are held on the 14� (Lodge of Perfection) while the 18�, 30�, and 32� are opened by proclamation.
In the UK, the 18� is the natural stopping point, with all degrees above the 18th being honorary. In the US, the 32� is the stopping point, with only the Court of Honour and 33� being honorary.

Fiat Lvx.

In Canada, one need not be a Christian to join Scottish Rite, for example.

I'm not sure about this, but i Canada one does not need to be a Master Mason in order to join the Shrine, just a Mason. I could be wrong about this, though.

Originally posted by LTD602
I'm not sure about this, but i Canada one does not need to be a Master Mason in order to join the Shrine, just a Mason. I could be wrong about this, though.

The Imperial Council of the Ancient Arabic Order of Nobles of the Mystic Shrine amended its Constitution in 1999 to allow all regular Master Masons in good standing in a recognized Lodge to become Shriners. Previous to 1999, one had to be either a 32� Scottish Rite Mason or Masonic Knight Templar to become a Shriner.

Entered Apprentices and Fellow Crafts may not apply for membership in the Shrine unless it is known they will receive the Third Degree before the Shrine ceremonial is scheduled.

Fiat Lvx.



[edit on 5-10-2004 by Masonic Light]

The degree system worked in England & Wales is similar, but different to that worked in the US. Ireland and Scotland have other similarities and differences.
Within craft freemasonry (the bit that comes under UGLE) your 33rd degree carries as much weight as a small and tiny thing that weighs not very much.

For those who would like to see an explanation of the additional degrees to craft freemasonry I would suggest this link:
www.internetlodge.org...