You and yer sodium.

On the off chance that the board does go down for good, I'd like to leave a post that some here might find helpful (or super-not helpful at all).

Can't help but notice that there are a lot of folks been around here for years that have medical issues. Most of them seem to be metabolic disorders, heart disease, maybe some folks that have issues with emotional and behavioral stability challenges. If you think that nutrition may help, or you are already on a path to health that heavily involves nutrition, ya'll might want to know this.

How much salt do you take in? We aren't even going to get to sugar (yet); How much salt?

'Cause if you are eating, say 2000 milligrams of sodium a day, you are going to require more than 4000 (!) milligrams a day of potassium to process that.

That's because there are proteins that carry salt and sugar and potassium to our cells. Imagine the transporter as a little truck. Once it leaves loading dock, it can't come back to unload until it has 1 salts, 2 potassiums and a sugar. That's two more potassiums than 1 salt. So look at the 2000 vs 4000 thingy i wrote up there and you can do the math.

Do you have any idea under the sun how much fruit and vegetables you would have to eat a day to get enough potassium to satisfy 2000 milligrams of salt? Well, start reading labels and googling. One of the pro-keto docs I've met says it looks like 7 cups of veggies a day. He's insane. I can tell you it's doable because I do it, and I'm not eating seven F#ng cups of vegetables.

Many of you have been told that you should be on a "low-sodium" diet, 1500-2000 milligrams per day. That's not low sodium. That's a joke.

You only need 500 a day. You aren't going to do that, but it makes 1000 seem more reasonable, right?

Okay, that's it. Don't think I need to elaborate because anyone serious about talking control of their health will recognize the tree up which this dog barks.

Fight Gravity!

There are 500 milligrams of sodium in 1/4 teaspoon of table salt.

I teaspoon of baking soda contains 1,259 milligrams of sodium.

a reply to: TheDiscoKing

I've always wondered about that salt thing.

First thing they give ya when admitted at the emergency ward ? Saline solution.

What about all of the critters living in the oceans ?

Everybody likes salt !

a reply to: TheDiscoKing

I've been taking potassium nitrate. Not a lot of data on human consumption out there but it definitely helped mice. Dissolves readily in water and has no taste. The potassium is good for a lot of different things including eliminating salt and the nitrate is broken down into nitric oxide which relaxes the blood vessels.

a reply to: KnowItAllKnowNothin

First thing they give ya when admitted at the emergency ward ? Saline solution.

The origin of normal saline has been traced to an 1883 study by a Dutch scientist named Hamburger. His work suggested, mistakenly, that the concentration of salts in human blood was 0.9 percent.

Amazingly, the ascendance of normal saline as the default IV fluid seems to have been based solely on Hamburger's early experiments. "It remains a mystery how it came into general use as an intravenous fluid," a group of British physicians wrote in 2008, noting the absence of any other experimental data to support it. "Perhaps it was due to the ease, convenience, and low cost of mixing common salt with water."

As it turns out, normal saline isn't very normal at all. The average sodium level in a healthy patient is about 140 (as measured in something called milliequivalents per liter). For chloride, it's about 100. But the concentration of both sodium and chloride in normal saline is 154. That's pretty abnormal—especially the chloride.

It wasn't until the 1980s that researchers began investigating whether the higher concentrations of chloride might have adverse effects. In 1983 a scientist showed that elevated levels of chloride could decrease blood flow in dog kidneys, causing damage or even renal failure. And in the 1990s, scientists showed the high level of chloride in normal saline could make blood acidic, a change than can disrupt all kinds of biochemical processes in the body.

But did changes like these affect how patients fared?

Serious efforts to answer that question only got underway within the last 10 years. The first attempt appeared in 2012. Researchers examined a database of patients who received saline or balanced solutions like lactated Ringer's during surgery, and compared complications and mortality between the groups. The findings were striking — mortality was 2.7 percent higher in those that received normal saline, and complications were more common as well. That same year, Australian physicians showed that ICU patients given chloride-rich fluids had nearly double the rate of kidney injury compared with those given balanced fluids.

Why Did Sterile Salt Water Become The IV Fluid Of Choice?

A few years ago, I decided it was time to be healthier.

I quit drinking (a problem in itself back then), I started exercising, and started focusing on my diet.

3 years later, and I have become a food snob. Other than at friends and family, if you can't make it taste good while cooking it, I won't be back. I don't even salt fries anymore.

Craft services is a bit tougher, but they always have a decent salad bar.

The thing that hit me 3 weeks into my healthy eating was my energy. Even with my rough schedule, I wake up rested and ready to go.

I lost 20# and almost have a six pack back.

I eat as organic as possible and snack on fruit.

I do allow myself 2 cups of coffee in the morning...black...and a half moon cookie a day.

Thanks for posting this, I wish I had known sooner!

a reply to: theatreboy

You are absolutely welcome.

It sounds like you are keeping it super-tite. I do coffee and I can't resist those ginger chews. Fortunately my problem wasn't sugar, but the sugar came way down as a byproduct of stalking my sodium intake.

I have been to the doctor more often lately because of it all, but at my last appointment with a new PA I was asked, "Is your blood pressure always low?". All I could do was stare at her til I realized she was serious and just said, "As long as I'm able to keep it like that, yes". Dying of laughter inside.

I have had very consistent results now over a few years keeping the BP low just by being my own personal salt nazi.

I suppose I would say that I am continually surprised at the results that I get from tackling the salt first. Everything else just falls in line. That's why I posted the numbers for salt and baking soda up there. It's not the gluten that will keep a person out of the bread isle, the salt takes care of that all by itself.

The problem with salt is some people people just salt food without tasting it. It is more of a habhit to them.

There are others that avoid all salt. The problem with that is without salt in your diet, your heart can just suddenly stop.

It is all about balance and not going to ether extream.

Now about IV solution. There was an ambulance service in South America that made their own. They boiled the water and added the salt. Someone accidently made a batch that had 10 times what they normally used. There was a patient in a bad automobile accident and lost a lot of blood. They happened to get this 10 times stronger IV. This caused the blood in their body to draw water from the body tissues, trying to balance out the salt level chemically. This additional fluid made up for not being able to push enough fluid into them by the IV. Because of this, they made it to the hospital and survived even though they had lost more blood then they could have to survive any other way.

This might be why normal saline is medically useful. It will gather fluid from the tissues of the body to increase blood volume. This does increase blood pressure temporarily but that is good when the patient has lost blood and their pressure would be low from lack of blood volume.

a reply to: TheDiscoKing


My humble opinion is low salt is more dangerous to health , studys confirm it.

When people drink Coffee , it depletes sodium

Coffee = increased sodium loss! 6 cups of coffee = 1,800 mg sodium lost out the urine 4 cups of coffee = 1,200 mg

Look to Dr DiNicolantonio in this matter .

People do generally need more potassium , i take pills to get more potassium .....beans also have nice amount.

one part sodium, one part potassium, and three parts chloride is a good ratio in the diet. But you also need some Iodine to stop the muscles from being too tight from the chloride and flouride ions. It is all about balance.

Genetically I lack a functional diuretic hormone, so the more salt I eat, the more I pee... The gene app said this is a great trait, but in a world where salt is evil, it is a curse. One point seven percent inuit genetics on my paternal side along with one snp from my mothers side causes this to happen, some woman will have two x's with this genetics too.

If I do not get enough salt or I take meds that block the uptake of sodium or chloride, I can't even get off the couch or get up from kneeling on the ground. But my condition is rare. I researched this when I had severe side effects from diuretics and was told by the doctors I cannot take them anymore...so I got my genetics done and got a few gene apps. This condition would be passed on to my son if I had one, but not a daughter unless she did get one of the male snps. Women can have some Y genes, but once it reaches a threshold, then the daughter would be a boy. My one daughter needs more salt than the other, but not as much as I need. Now I have to say, I am not really fond of the taste of salt, my dad told me when I was young that if I feel off, take a small piece of salt fish and eat it...over the years I have learned when to do this, and I also crave smoked fish too. My father and his brothers were like me, we ate lots of fish and smoked fish, and we always had salt cod or salmon in the fridge. I know when I need it.

My brother is the same way, and we , like my dad and uncle are workaholics, always doing something. A few of my anti-epileptic meds blocked sodium channels too...they almost killed me. The Neurologist said I was too nice of guy to kill and said I must find natural ways to treat my epilepsy, I already had discovered that asparagus worked better for me than the meds with little to no side effects and after that, I experimented and found multiple different food chemistry to control my temporal lobe epilepsy, the most potent one is hopemade special soups, all contain cabbage, celery, and some other chemistries that control it. Potatoes also can settle the brain storms from the epilepsy.

There is a lot more to this than I have mentioned, but I will note, I pee out all my salt, if I sweat which lowers my peeing, my skin turns white and is salty as hell to the taste...most people do not have this genetics. It is found in people like eskimos and populations in far northern areas and sometimes in some native people who live on islands in the oceans. I do not have all the genetics to make it so I can follow their diets, Some native Americans also have this genetics but not that many.

My one/one/three ratio I mentioned applies to other people, with the chloride coming also from veggies and it is important to note that that three number is required to form other mineral metabolism necessary for metabolic

I may need more sodium than most people, but still I do not need more than the two thousand mg they say is the upper limit, and with that genetics I got is also an intolerance to sacharides like sugar and maltose and lactose. So, I do not break apart sucrose or maltose, lack that enzyme. so I need the osmolyte action of the salt to detox more than most people since I do not get enough glucose from sugars and starches. CSID disease. I do have an alternate pathway to break apart limited maltose but quite a bit less than most people. Yet, the paleo diet is not right for me, neither is the keto diet, I have figured out an appropriate diet but of course, I do screw up occasionally, I spent most of my life eating all kinds of foods, when I sweat out the toxins it was not bad, but I don't sweat them out so much anymore now that I am old. I just occasionally get nostalgic and crave things I should not be eating.

My metabolic story is way different than most of the Europeans. I never said I was normal. At least I have learned to control my hyponatremia and hypoglycemia now that I had problems with much of my life.

What is said in the OP is good for the majority of people, but there are others like me out there too.

originally posted by: TheDiscoKing
There are 500 milligrams of sodium in 1/4 teaspoon of table salt.

I teaspoon of baking soda contains 1,259 milligrams of sodium.

Wow I didnt know that.
Ive been taking bicarb almost daily for 20 years because some foods give me heartburn.
I also take daily
Vitamin C
Vitamin D3
Vitamin b12

Wish I could knock my alcoholism on the head.

a reply to: rickymouse

After reading the OP and comments to this point, I am glad I don't bother worrying myself sick with such as this. I don't take any dietary supplements, I consume undetermined amounts of salt, eat what I want when I want and don't bother worrying about it. After all, I could get in my car and head to the grocery store tomorrow and get hit and killed by a simi in a split second. All the toxins in our environment will probably kill me before salt does. I'm an old man now and don't particularly give a rat about what or when they pat the shovel in my face at this point. I think living worry free is probably more beneficial, to me anyway, to one's health than worrying about everything under the sun.

I know, I know, there are people with special circumstances and needs that probably should pay special attention to such as this, but fortunately for me, I am not one of them. I have been healthy as a mule and dumb as a jackass all my life and I don't see any reason to change now.

originally posted by: charlest2
a reply to: rickymouse

After reading the OP and comments to this point, I am glad I don't bother worrying myself sick with such as this. I don't take any dietary supplements, I consume undetermined amounts of salt, eat what I want when I want and don't bother worrying about it. After all, I could get in my car and head to the grocery store tomorrow and get hit and killed by a simi in a split second. All the toxins in our environment will probably kill me before salt does. I'm an old man now and don't particularly give a rat about what or when they pat the shovel in my face at this point. I think living worry free is probably more beneficial, to me anyway, to one's health than worrying about everything under the sun.

I know, I know, there are people with special circumstances and needs that probably should pay special attention to such as this, but fortunately for me, I am not one of them. I have been healthy as a mule and dumb as a jackass all my life and I don't see any reason to change now.

Sodium and chloride are used by the body to regulate the excretion of metabolic byproducts from the cells. If you do not eat much salt, then eat something high in salt, it causes cells throughout the body to dump toxins into the extracellular fluid and then it passes through to the blood stream and the kidneys and liver excrete the sodium and chloride coupled to wastes. So keeping a steady amount of salt in the diet is necessary, if you eat very little then pile it up, the toxins will cause the liver and kidneys to shut down action to protect themselves from cell death. I have read a lot of stuff on how this process works.

Moderation is important and so is balance of osmolites. Now both sugar and salt are osmolytes, so consuming a combination of both at high levels can also cause problems. Like I said, there is a real lot of variables with this, some people eat more carbs, others eat more salt to help detox.

By the way, I am sixty eight, I am older, you are only old when you get over eighty. I will most likely live to eighty, because that is when my life insurance expires...term insurance that because of my epilepsy is being extended by a rider for disability till I reach eighty. My wife also will live till at least eighty so nobody will get a cent. Because I now eat better, I feel better.

I am cooking up a stew made from oxtail today from the half cow we buy each year. It has a lot of veggies and it will be beef barley stew...grass fed organic beef, lots of onions which are a diuretic and keep blood flowing, cabbage to help keep my epilepsy at bay, some carrots for the eyes, and celery to deter cancer growth. It will contain baby yellow potatoes for potassium, and some rutabagga also for anticancer properties. It will take many hours to prepare a big pot, but we will be eating it for three or four days for lunch and one supper.

Now, I designed my soups to help control my epilepsy, but they taste great...if they tasted bland I would utilize other food chemistries. I have been making soups to control my epilepsy for twenty years now, medicine can taste great, and it does not need to be expensive either. I can make a huge pot of chicken soup that treats my epilepsy and it also is very antiviral, for seven bucks. I make it for the daughters and their kids almost weekly during flu season, they really like the soup and I also make really good homemade breads with ingredients that are mostly organic...six rolls and a loaf of bread costs about a buck thirty now.

So seven bucks for a soup with lots of chicken will serve eight people. The chicken is not organic in the soup, but I researched different brands and found some that are more natural...and the chicken has more flavor than some of the common chickens in the stores. What the chicken eats determines it's taste, an older bird is also tastier. I usually make the soup from the dark meat, like leg quarters of a decent brand, the meat chemistry in dark meat is actually more anti-epileptic and also more anti-viral than the breast.

It appears that almost all the health experts promoting healthy super foods got it wrong. They have not researched things well enough, they focus too much on fat content and do not pay attention to the diet of the animals and eggs we eat. There is a lot more than vitamins and minerals that are important in food yet they are ignoring this stuff.

If you are feeling good with what you eat, then I would say keep your diet as it is. Eating more natural is always better than eating a lot of highly processed foods. You can eat twenty to twenty five percent highly processed foods and still be good, but many people eat way too much. One thing is that balancing sodium. chloride, and potassium is necessary. Also moderating consumption of glutamate to calcium is important. Too much glutamate can unbalance the calcium glutamate channels in the cells, one side gets too big and energy does not flow into the cells properly. Glutamate and glutamine are not the same, both are needed in balance to keep things from getting sore in your body.

I have tested a lot on myself and analyzed what I have read and researched what enzymes in the body can be over or under expressed and why it happens. Testing on myself sometimes makes me sore or have issues, so I have to monitor how dietary changes effect me and make sure to try changes or combining food chemistries so they can be tracked to see how things are effected.

a reply to: alwaysbeenhere2

Wish I could knock my alcoholism on the head.

Don't worry, it's coming. Gout and arthritis will do that for you.

a reply to: rickymouse

I had 2 honeybunns yesterday morning and 2 dingdongs and a bag of Act III butterlovers popcorn last night, and a big plate of homemade spaghetti in between.

originally posted by: charlest2
a reply to: rickymouse

I had 2 honeybunns yesterday morning and 2 dingdongs and a bag of Act III butterlovers popcorn last night, and a big plate of homemade spaghetti in between.

My granddaughters husband has genetics which are way different than mine. I had all my families DNA done and bought apps for analyzing it, even my ex-wife's because she is the mother of my oldest daughter. My son in laws and grandson in laws got it done too which I also paid for. Now I did this for curiosity and to find how the genetics of the grandkids was formed.

My grandson in laws genetics has multiple markers that mean he can process grains really well, but he can have major problems with fat metabolism...kind of opposite my genetics. He has scottish and Danish in his ancestry. I warned him that in his future he can have discoloration of the skin from certain fats in his diet and he is susceptible to getting those yellow fat filled blobs near his eyes in old age if he eats lots of fats. He also has the ELN genetics, his sister has one pointy ear like an elf ear. Probably from Piks genetic in Scottland possibly, but some Irish people have that too. He does not have the elf ears though. That genetics is strange, he has some genes that don't fit the norm so there are some weird abnominalities that can form. It is not tumor genes anyway. His dad says his daughters pointy ears is from him watching Spock on star trek when he was younger. There are some actors and producers in Hollywood who have those ears. People with that genetics often are artists, musicians, and actors and stuff like that...artsy people. Makes me think it would have been fun to live with the Piks centuries back, They were the original hippies I bet.

a reply to: TheDiscoKing

Thanks. That was an awesome answer !

So unsurprising to see the history of the saline IV, like many other histories, is a tale of bumbling officials, and experts blindly following protocols.

Then they typically boast something about standing on the shoulders of giants ! Ha !

We don't use iodized salt here, and eat very little processed foods.

We use Himalayan pink salt, some Celtic salt, and a little Herbamare sometimes.
Have heard about golden salt, but not tried it yet.
Never tried Redmond's salt neither.

Have you ever heard of Schuessler’s Tissue Salts, or cell salts ?

What are Schuessler’s Tissue Salts?
Schuessler’s 12 Tissue Salts (cell salt or biochemic) remedies are often called a ‘medicine chest’ for the whole family.

Tissue Salts were first developed by the German doctor, Wilhelm Schuessler, who said ill-health was caused by an imbalance in the bodies twelve vital cell salts. Schuessler believed that these imbalances could be corrected by easily absorbed and homeopathically-prepared, micro-doses of each salt.

Schuessler’s Tissue Salts (also known as biochemic or cell salts) are potentised micro-doses of the 12 essential minerals your body needs to repair and maintain itself. They are prepared in homeopathic 6X potencies that are gentle enough to be used by the youngest to the eldest member of your family. They can even be used with pets.

Schuessler introduced his homeopathically-prepared Tissue Salts more than 100 years ago but today, they have spread to most parts of the world where families and individuals rely on them as simple home treatments for a wide range of problems.

Tissue Salts, as either individual remedies or in combination, are an ideal addition to the home medicine cabinet for simple health complaints. They are:

Gentle
Absorbed rapidly
Natural
Pleasant tasting
Lactose free
Convenient to carry
Non-toxic and non-addictive
Safe to use with prescription medicines
Suitable for broad, general health complaints (unlike standard homeopathy that requires more precise symptom matching).
Tissue Salts are used as either single potentised salts or potentised salts mixed in combinations. See the list below for the indications of each salt or combination. ...

I tried them for a certain issue, but didn't notice any difference.
Hard to gather clues from the world of subtleties.

a reply to: rickymouse
Arent you and yours setting yourselves up for future selective extermination?



Juuust kidding!

I live in the U.P of michigan. The water here has very little salt in it, I would say most of the salt in the water here comes from salt that leaches in from road salts put on the roads. Many parts of the country have salt in the ground water. People living in those places get salt from drinking water from the ground. also the veggies that grow here do not uptake salt that well, plants that grow near the ocean are much more tolerant to salt and will have more.

Fish in the ocean have methods of not uptaking salt in their body, freshwater fish absorb salt. So the salt content of fish in different environments remains about equal. Farmers have to give salt to the cows or they are sickly, they used to toss it on the hay years back or put out salt licks. if they do not do that, the cows are not healthy.

The video someone gave above stated that salt was put on lettuce in ancient times. Which makes sense. Salt actually draws enzymes out of the mouth to stimulate digestion of carbs in the mouth. By the same method that salt draws juices out of meat when salting meat. So salad dressings usually contain some salt in them to make it so we can digest veggies a little better. Salt on boiled eggs also helps draw out saliva so the yolk of the hard boiled egg does not stick in your mouth...it mentions in multiple places that salt needs to be higher in keto diets, so that is relevant to egg yolks having fatty acids.

Lately they have been talking about microbes to make butyrate in our gut from veggies....I prefer to have a cow eat the veggies and have them have the microbes....then I eat the butter...the taste of butter, and even oleos is from butyrate or butyric acid. Butyrate helps to heal the gut...olive oil does not have butyrate in it.

From young I knew I liked butter because when holding a buttercup flower under the skin my skin appeared yellow from the reflection. Grew up on a farm.

a reply to: KnowItAllKnowNothin

He mentioned giving pets extra salt. That answered questions I had recently concerning one of my dogs. She has an allergy issue where lick granulomas developed on her front fore paws. I can not get them cleared up so about a month ago, knowing salt is a natural antibacterial, or antimicrobial, and they may not be getting enough salt in their diet, I started giving her extra salt thinking her feed may not provide enough in their diet. I give her a daily vitamin and 1000 mg of fish oil as well. The granulomas are not as bad now but are still there but her coat looks shiny and great actually.