Selling your Soul - Property Rights of Consciousness Explained

I was reading this thread (this one here) and pondering the post at the top of page 3. The thread in question is by a 16 year old girl in 2008 who was thinking about selling her soul to Satan. It got me thinking. Do we own our soul, or is it on loan for a time?

If we strictly consult the Bible, we find that we are known from the beginning. Further, it seems that we are known all the way to the end. In other words, the entire time we spend here in the reality of transitioning time, we are known fully. The way I think about this is to consider that time is like a recording of sorts. It is playing for us in time (like a movie), but it was recorded much earlier. Imagine going to the theater and being plugged into the movie. While you are there, the computer system cuts off your memories temporarily. You become a character in the movie, then emerge back into the actual timeline when the story is finished. You then reengage your true identity and reflect on the story you experienced.

Take this thought back to the Bible's description of how reality works for us. First, consider what and who you really are.

Matthew 18

10 “See that you do not despise one of these little ones. For I tell you that their angels in heaven always see the face of my Father in heaven."

By "little ones," the writer is speaking of the children of God. God is the Father (Aleph Bet / Strong House) containing the children. In reality, where are we? The verse tells you. We are ALL facing the Father in Heaven. Like school children, our Angel above is locked in the story below. Who is telling the Story?

John 1 gives us the key to this. The word logos has two basic meanings.

John 1 (Word / Logos)

1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was with God in the beginning. 3 Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. 4 In him was life, and that life was the light of all mankind. 5 The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome[a] it.

Logos / Word / Dvar Hashem all mean the same thing here. Here are the two definitions we have available to us:

LOGOS 1: From Wikipedia: Originally a word meaning "a ground", "a plea", "an opinion", "an expectation", "word", "speech", "account", "reason",[1][2] it became a technical term in philosophy, beginning with Heraclitus (ca. 535–475 BC), who used the term for a principle of order and knowledge.

In this sense, God is making a plea. He is rendering an opinion to us that shows an expectation on his part for our conduct as children growing in to adulthood. In the tradition that originates this thought, children are working toward an inheritance from the family.

LOGOS 2: Ancient philosophers used the term in different ways. The sophists used the term to mean discourse, and Aristotle applied the term to refer to "reasoned discourse"[4] or "the argument" in the field of rhetoric.[5] The Stoic philosophers identified the term with the divine animating principle pervading the Universe.

LOGOS 3: Under Hellenistic Judaism, Philo (ca. 20 BC – AD 50) adopted the term into Jewish philosophy.[6] The Gospel of John identifies the Logos, through which all things are made, as divine (theos),[7] and further identifies Jesus as the incarnate Logos.

In this sense, we have Jesus telling us that the Old Testament was a revelation about him. In the New Testament, the revelation is then explained. Like Chuck Missler says, "The New Testament is in the Old Testament concealed; the Old Testament is in the New Testament revealed."

LOGOS 4: The final sense of the word LOGOS is a master storyteller. In this sense, the LOGOS is placing a LOGO, or stamp (mark) on the listener. All good stories become part of us. You cannot unlearn something you learn. Once you know, you cannot unknow.

The question here is this: Can you sell your soul in this story? The answer, if you consider the outcome, is no. The story is not without an ending. You are the subject of this story and a student of the ending. Like any student, you can only act with your will accordingly. If you are alive in the story, you always have the choice to adapt your will to the truth or to the error the truth is revealing. What is that truth?

First, the will of the soul determines it's bondage or freedom from the error. To act according to the truth, you are free from the error. No more bondage to the error is possible if you know the conclusion to the story. What is that conclusion?

To know, you simply need to know the will of God and adapt to that will. The will of God is to give. Taking makes a thief. Second, we are ALL owned by the Spirit we originate from. That Spirit is holding us while the story is taking place. Spirit is the mother of the soul. She is the water of the Jordan River. Mother in Hebrew is Aleph (Strong) Mem (Waters). Father is the Alephbet (letters of the story). Son is the (WORD). We are reading the Son, which is the word John describes. Darkness CANNOT overcome the LIGHT. CANNOT!

Second, you simply need to know the point of the story. Freedom comes from Truth, and Truth sets you free. Are you ready to be free? Are you ready to own your soul as a free Spirit? Are you ready to gain your inheritance?

Galatians 5

13 You, my brothers and sisters, were called to be free. But do not use your freedom to indulge the flesh[a]; rather, serve one another humbly in love. 14 For the entire law is fulfilled in keeping this one command: “Love your neighbor as yourself.” 15 If you bite and devour each other, watch out or you will be destroyed by each other.

16 So I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the flesh. 17 For the flesh desires what is contrary to the Spirit, and the Spirit what is contrary to the flesh. They are in conflict with each other, so that you are not to do whatever[c] you want. 18 But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law.

19 The acts of the flesh are obvious: sexual immorality, impurity and debauchery; 20 idolatry and witchcraft; hatred, discord, jealousy, fits of rage, selfish ambition, dissensions, factions 21 and envy; drunkenness, orgies, and the like. I warn you, as I did before, that those who live like this will not inherit the kingdom of God.

22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, forbearance, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law. 24 Those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires. 25 Since we live by the Spirit, let us keep in step with the Spirit. 26 Let us not become conceited, provoking and envying each other.

Why is this true? How can I give you freedom with words? Because they are the culmination to the story God tells you. You are only in bondage until you get the point of the story straight. Have a little Faith.

Define Faith: confidence or trust in a person, thing, deity, or in the doctrines or teachings of a religion or view. According to Hebrews 11, 11 Now faith is confidence in what we hope for and assurance about what we do not see. 2 This is what the ancients were commended for. 3 By faith we understand that the universe was formed at God’s command, so that what is seen was not made out of what was visible.

YOUR BONDAGE and FREEDOM: Galatians 3

Galatians 3 and the way out of Bondage. Have some Faith!

Children of God

23 Before the coming of this faith,[j] we were held in custody under the law, locked up until the faith that was to come would be revealed. 24 So the law was our guardian until Christ came that we might be justified by faith. 25 Now that this faith has come, we are no longer under a guardian.

26 So in Christ Jesus you are all children of God through faith, 27 for all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. 28 There is neither Jew nor Gentile, neither slave nor free, nor is there male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 If you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham’s seed, and heirs according to the promise.

reply to post by EnochWasRight


Does the car own the driver, or does the driver own the car?

Jesus bought humanity back, so no, it is not ours. When we die, our souls go back to God who made it. There was a time when all of humanity was sold under sin, but Jesus died to redeem us all from that curse.

But there is a concept in a "legal right" for Satan to have some people. That does not mean he can ever own their souls, because it is non-negotiable from the human standpoint. We didn't make our souls and we can't keep our souls after death, therefore we are merely the car, not the driver.

That is an interesting question right there.

I came across this interview last week about Tupac.

I am sorry but I cannot remember where I read this, but i know that he said, that when he sold his soul to the devil, he thought it was a just a figure of speech, and got a really big shock when he discovered it was real.

He said his contract was for 7 years. This may be significant, as 7 seems to come up a lot around this subject.

7 years later he was dead.

I did not post any of his videos here on the subject as the language is very strong and I was not sure as far as the rules here in relation to content.

WarminIndy
reply to post by EnochWasRight

 

Does the car own the driver, or does the driver own the car?

Jesus bought humanity back, so no, it is not ours. When we die, our souls go back to God who made it. There was a time when all of humanity was sold under sin, but Jesus died to redeem us all from that curse.

But there is a concept in a "legal right" for Satan to have some people. That does not mean he can ever own their souls, because it is non-negotiable from the human standpoint. We didn't make our souls and we can't keep our souls after death, therefore we are merely the car, not the driver.

I see what you are saying. There is a loan to consider here with the car. Like all material things, we will not take our car with us. It will die and go back where it belongs. I see the Spirit differently here. Our I AM consciousness is what is being refined. When it returns, it is an individuation unique to itself. It is not taken back. God only gives. The expectation at the end is that our authority is taken away and replaced with freedom from the law and guardian, just as my second post of Galatians 3 outlines. We are no longer designated by a nation. We are now the self-governed by faith. God is all in all. Authority being taken away is a good thing. It gives us freedom from the restriction and curse.

1 Corinthians 15

20 But Christ has indeed been raised from the dead, the firstfruits of those who have fallen asleep. 21 For since death came through a man, the resurrection of the dead comes also through a man. 22 For as in Adam all die, so in Christ all will be made alive. 23 But each in turn: Christ, the firstfruits; then, when he comes, those who belong to him. 24 Then the end will come, when he hands over the kingdom to God the Father after he has destroyed all dominion, authority and power. 25 For he must reign until he has put all his enemies under his feet. 26 The last enemy to be destroyed is death. 27 For he “has put everything under his feet.”[c] Now when it says that “everything” has been put under him, it is clear that this does not include God himself, who put everything under Christ. 28 When he has done this, then the Son himself will be made subject to him who put everything under him, so that God may be all in all.

I will also point out that there is something amazing waiting at the end.

Here is our future, but not the future of those who put Christ to shame.

1 Corinthians 2

6 We do, however, speak a message of wisdom among the mature, but not the wisdom of this age or of the rulers of this age, who are coming to nothing. 7 No, we declare God’s wisdom, a mystery that has been hidden and that God destined for our glory before time began. 8 None of the rulers of this age understood it, for if they had, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory. 9 However, as it is written:

“What no eye has seen,
what no ear has heard,
and what no human mind has conceived”—
the things God has prepared for those who love him—
10 these are the things God has revealed to us by his Spirit.

We, however, CAN understand. We CAN conceive. If the Spirit teaches us, and we face the Father (Facing away from our sin), then we are being taught and moved by the Spirit. The eventual goal is to move so close to that Spirit that we become one with it. Our inheritance is the Holy Spirit we will receive.

That's the way I see it anyway. No need to argue the point. We will know when the end comes. Why love God? Why love your brother? Both are the body of Christ. God is All in All. We must recognize this for Atonement. At One Ment is bringing all things back together as a family.

Some only love themselves. This is facing away from God.

iamea
That is an interesting question right there.

I came across this interview last week about Tupac.

I am sorry but I cannot remember where I read this, but i know that he said, that when he sold his soul to the devil, he thought it was a just a figure of speech, and got a really big shock when he discovered it was real.

He said his contract was for 7 years. This may be significant, as 7 seems to come up a lot around this subject.

7 years later he was dead.

I did not post any of his videos here on the subject as the language is very strong and I was not sure as far as the rules here in relation to content.

A seven year contract is necessary by the Jubilee laws. God sets all captives free every seven years. Land goes back to its owner. This is why Satan must be set free at the end of the Day of the Lord (1000 years from now). He will be locked up shortly, then released under a jubilee.

iamea
That is an interesting question right there.

I came across this interview last week about Tupac.

I am sorry but I cannot remember where I read this, but i know that he said, that when he sold his soul to the devil, he thought it was a just a figure of speech, and got a really big shock when he discovered it was real.

He said his contract was for 7 years. This may be significant, as 7 seems to come up a lot around this subject.

7 years later he was dead.

I did not post any of his videos here on the subject as the language is very strong and I was not sure as far as the rules here in relation to content.

Also, consider why the tribulation is seven years. Why is the mark of the beast given at that time? Follow the pattern and know the future before it arrives. Resist the mark, which will ultimately be a form of selfishness.

2 Timothy 3

3 But mark this: There will be terrible times in the last days. 2 People will be lovers of themselves, lovers of money, boastful, proud, abusive, disobedient to their parents, ungrateful, unholy, 3 without love, unforgiving, slanderous, without self-control, brutal, not lovers of the good, 4 treacherous, rash, conceited, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God— 5 having a form of godliness but denying its power. Have nothing to do with such people.

6 They are the kind who worm their way into homes and gain control over gullible women, who are loaded down with sins and are swayed by all kinds of evil desires, 7 always learning but never able to come to a knowledge of the truth. 8 Just as Jannes and Jambres opposed Moses, so also these teachers oppose the truth. They are men of depraved minds, who, as far as the faith is concerned, are rejected. 9 But they will not get very far because, as in the case of those men, their folly will be clear to everyone.

Count the number of items in verse 1-4. 18 items. 6+6+6. He says, "MARK THIS!" The Mark is the Spirit we love.

Go back to the fruits of the Spirit in the OP.

Read this:

7 But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming to where he was baptizing, he said to them: “You brood of vipers! Who warned you to flee from the coming wrath? 8 Produce fruit in keeping with repentance. 9 And do not think you can say to yourselves, ‘We have Abraham as our father.’ I tell you that out of these stones God can raise up children for Abraham. 10 The ax is already at the root of the trees, and every tree that does not produce good fruit will be cut down and thrown into the fire.

11 “I baptize you with water for repentance. But after me comes one who is more powerful than I, whose sandals I am not worthy to carry. He will baptize you with[c] the Holy Spirit and fire. 12 His winnowing fork is in his hand, and he will clear his threshing floor, gathering his wheat into the barn and burning up the chaff with unquenchable fire.”

Water baptism (Immersion into reality) is for one purpose. We are to repent. Those who do not are marked by the fruit of the Darkness. Those who repent are marked by the fruits of the Spirit, opposite evil. It's simple to consider. Seven years will mark our choice.

What happens if someone is an Atheist?
What happens if someone worships Odin and the other Norse gods?
What happens if someone is Hindu?
What happens if someone has adopted the practice of worshipping the very first gods of Sumer?

Who, or what would they sell their soul to, even if they didn't believe in the concept?

Thor is kinda secksy. Mebbe I could sell my soul to Thor?

reply to post by AliceBleachWhite


Really?

Thor: [walking into a pet shop] I need a horse!

Pet Store Clerk: We don't have horses. Just dogs, cats, birds.

Thor: Then give me one of those large enough to ride.

AliceBleachWhite

What happens if someone is an Atheist?
What happens if someone worships Odin and the other Norse gods?
What happens if someone is Hindu?
What happens if someone has adopted the practice of worshipping the very first gods of Sumer?

Who, or what would they sell their soul to, even if they didn't believe in the concept?

Thor is kinda secksy. Mebbe I could sell my soul to Thor?

Then they can't sell their soul to Satan. The OP opened with a girl who want to sell her soul to Satan. He referred to her belief that she could.

But can an atheist sell their soul? Hmm, since they believe there's nothing to sell to, then no.
Odin worshipers, they went to Valhalla if they died as warriors, so yeah, they kind of sold their souls to an ideology.
Hindus, there's too many gods and goddesses and devas, so which one?
Sumerians, well, let's see, the Annunaki were overlords, so perhaps yes.

I would imagine its like selling a character on an mmorpg;
Even though you leveled up the character it is still owned by the company who own the game.

Selling my soul? Property rights of consciousness? The hell have you been smoking, Enoch? Whatever you're on, it's not good for you. Wow.

I like simple answers, except for the mind boggling wonderful world of infinity, possibilities and probabilities, there are some complex things that appeal and in fact not only appeal, but they open all the doors, windows wide and make a free and wonderous path (all positive, no gravity of harm) that closing the doors is like being in a hole in the ground. Too claustophobic for that!!! Acknowledging that there is also beehive, legion, abyss's and timeouts and fascists realms that don't appeal and we have to heal them.

But when it comes to soul, you own your soul, free will, with freedom being the first order. This holds true if you are a fractal or seed of your Greater Soul, but in a sense this is only a part of the dream lab school we enter, the hologram, and is needed for its growth factors. However we already exist in No Time as the entire infinite tapestry, and this part of us that walks in this identity and has this free will moment, though all the other aspects do too, is one thread in the tapestry, its already complete and being completed all at the same time. This is the story of our unending journey towards perfection, and everyone takes it. So in the bigger picture, free will is boosted so to speak by the Teleos Design of all energies, (they progress and grow and upgrade by default as natural) and that instead of being pushed randomly from behind, all things, including material evolution or Spirit evolution, is pulled from the Future and The Eternal Now and the Wholeness of the Tapestry, our true selves, wherein we are connected as infinite parts of infinity to Source/God, in Oneness, but not One Person, infinite Persons.

So whatever foolishness a person does is only temporal, but harmful things can bring terrible consequences, long shutdowns and abscence of feelings, and repair, dark nights of the soul after this, so to be avoided, not to suffer regressions and huge setbacks.

Again on the subject of 7, and the idea of abomination of desolation.

I like to sound words out and see what to make of them, trying to think outside of the box.

Sometimes when I hear the sounding out of abomination of desolation, I hear OBAMAnation of desolation.

Then a few weeks ago I found this video, I just looked for it but couldnt find it again, but this guy was talking about Daniel, and talking about what he said, he was likening this to Obama.

He was saying that if you took the day that Obama received his Nobel Peace Prize, then went forward 3.5 years you had Obama visiting Jerusalem.

Then had him standing in room, looking prowd in a place where people usually bow their heads. There was also reference to him getting to this place, talking about donkeys and stuff.

I do not know if any of this means anything to you, but I thought I would pass it on.

AliceBleachWhite

What happens if someone is an Atheist?
What happens if someone worships Odin and the other Norse gods?
What happens if someone is Hindu?
What happens if someone has adopted the practice of worshipping the very first gods of Sumer?

Who, or what would they sell their soul to, even if they didn't believe in the concept?

Thor is kinda secksy. Mebbe I could sell my soul to Thor?

Salvation requires faith. Christ is the way, truth and life. Life is given as baptism. There is a catch. The goal is to be raised on the last day, which is the last 1000 years. For details on this, read John 6. Today, we are at the very end on day 6. Day 7 begins, but there are many that won't be raised due to their lost faith. Truth is evident. Again, read John 6:36-6:66.

AfterInfinity
Selling my soul? Property rights of consciousness? The hell have you been smoking, Enoch? Whatever you're on, it's not good for you. Wow.

Matthew 20

20 “For the kingdom of heaven is like a landowner who went out early in the morning to hire workers for his vineyard. 2 He agreed to pay them a denarius[a] for the day and sent them into his vineyard.

3 “About nine in the morning he went out and saw others standing in the marketplace doing nothing. 4 He told them, ‘You also go and work in my vineyard, and I will pay you whatever is right.’ 5 So they went.

“He went out again about noon and about three in the afternoon and did the same thing. 6 About five in the afternoon he went out and found still others standing around. He asked them, ‘Why have you been standing here all day long doing nothing?’

7 “‘Because no one has hired us,’ they answered.

“He said to them, ‘You also go and work in my vineyard.’

8 “When evening came, the owner of the vineyard said to his foreman, ‘Call the workers and pay them their wages, beginning with the last ones hired and going on to the first.’

9 “The workers who were hired about five in the afternoon came and each received a denarius. 10 So when those came who were hired first, they expected to receive more. But each one of them also received a denarius. 11 When they received it, they began to grumble against the landowner. 12 ‘These who were hired last worked only one hour,’ they said, ‘and you have made them equal to us who have borne the burden of the work and the heat of the day.’

13 “But he answered one of them, ‘I am not being unfair to you, friend. Didn’t you agree to work for a denarius? 14 Take your pay and go. I want to give the one who was hired last the same as I gave you. 15 Don’t I have the right to do what I want with my own money? Or are you envious because I am generous?’

16 “So the last will be first, and the first will be last."

---Pride put you at the end of the line. Humility sets you at the head of the line. As I indicated in my last post, John 6 tells the way to live over the next 1000 years. It's a time of peace on Earth.