Homosexuality and the Bible

I am going to be really blunt, and really honest.

Basically you are putting you foot in your mouth by preaching this dogma about pleasing one's self. That is what you are saying isn't it???

Aren't you saying that to please one's self is a sin???

If I am correct than that is what you believe.

If that is so then you must also believe this:

You must think that feeding one's self is a sin.

Oh, it isn't you say???

Oh that is different you say???

How is that different Helen???

Is not feeding the body a way of pleasing it???

Is not that a sin in your eyes???

Or is that an exception???



Abraham

Originally posted by quango
helen (or anyone) -

What about a person who is gay but abstains from sex?

Or do you not think that's possible?

Good Question quongo!

So what you are saying is that one calls Him/herself gay but abstains from sex!

Well.....you have to ask the question to someone who is gay ......and why they are abstaining from sex!
If a certain problem is bothering you, then you seek out to fix that problem.......without help one can be lead into a 'depressive ' state and become troubled.....
It all depends on what that person is feeling ......it could be a number of reasons.......
I'm sorry but only someone in that situation will tell you why they have chose to do so.......

Possible to be gay and abstain from sex?
Well again it depends on why they chose to abstain from sex in the first place!
It could be a number of things.....
Why do people chose to go on a cleansing diet?
To rid your body of accumilated wastes .....from too much 'bad' food.......again,it could a number of different things that only that person can answer!

Today we live in a society where if one is not part of it.....and does not welcome new age and modern new whatever .......one is frowned upon and considered a threat to the rest of the world!
We live in a world where we dont know that we are slaves to it.....and have been brainwashed into accepting whatever is given to us as fact!
(I only speak of myself.....others may hold the same or different view)
helen

Originally posted by helen670
Possible to be gay and abstain from sex?
Well again it depends on why they chose to abstain from sex in the first place!

Let's assume that they are abstaining for the same reason a heterosexual would abstain... waiting for one person to marry, and stay with for life..

The main point i'm getting at: Can a person be gay without ever having sex? If not, why not? Is a straight person straight if they've never had sex?
One doesn't have to be having sex to be aware of what gender he/she is atrracted to. And you don't choose who you're attracted to, you just are...
My point here is that I believe homosexuality (just like heterosexuality) to be a natural thing, and person, rather than choosing to be gay or straight, simply is one or the other.

Leveller, I've never seen anywhere in the Bible that would indicate confusion on the homosexuality topic. It is very clear.

As to whether or not a homosexual is still one even if that person does not commit the act, I'd say it is immaterial. Commiting the act in one's mind is the same as doing it, if I read Christ's words correctly. So, if one keeps the thoughts pure it is irrelevent.

The act of homosexuality is no different than any other immoral act, it is a sin that requires forgiveness from the Father. Christ's blood was shed to wash away all sins, including that sin.

Originally posted by Thomas Crowne
As to whether or not a homosexual is still one even if that person does not commit the act, I'd say it is immaterial. Commiting the act in one's mind is the same as doing it, if I read Christ's words correctly. So, if one keeps the thoughts pure it is irrelevent.

Where is the line between pure and impure? Is any sexual thought or attraction lustful and therefore a sin?
Does marriage to the person of interest negate this?

Originally posted by Abraham Virtue
I am going to be really blunt, and really honest.

Basically you are putting you foot in your mouth by preaching this dogma about pleasing one's self. That is what you are saying isn't it???

Aren't you saying that to please one's self is a sin???

If I am correct than that is what you believe.

If that is so then you must also believe this:

You must think that feeding one's self is a sin.

Oh, it isn't you say???

Oh that is different you say???

How is that different Helen???

Is not feeding the body a way of pleasing it???

Is not that a sin in your eyes???

Or is that an exception???



Abraham

Well your wrong!

Feeding yourself..........
Well Abraham........it is a sin!
So I guess you cannot be right to answer the question you put forward to me!

Man does not live by Bread alone!
Gluttony is a sin......therefore over eating ,other then to just get enough nourishment for the body is a sin.......because as you said........it is pleasing to the eye.......and pleasing the body!
So Abraham............It is not an exception!
Sin's are many.............that is why we first look at pleasing God..........
helen.

This dirtbag's garbage was deleted for the good of everyone concerned.



T.H.U.G. N.A.T.I.O.N [ITS COMING]

[Edited on 24-6-2003 by Thomas Crowne]

Originally posted by quango

Originally posted by helen670
Possible to be gay and abstain from sex?
Well again it depends on why they chose to abstain from sex in the first place!

Let's assume that they are abstaining for the same reason a heterosexual would abstain... waiting for one person to marry, and stay with for life..

The main point i'm getting at: Can a person be gay without ever having sex? If not, why not? Is a straight person straight if they've never had sex?
One doesn't have to be having sex to be aware of what gender he/she is atrracted to. And you don't choose who you're attracted to, you just are...
My point here is that I believe homosexuality (just like heterosexuality) to be a natural thing, and person, rather than choosing to be gay or straight, simply is one or the other.

quongo......It may be for other reasons that you have not stated.....(as for the gay person,you have to ask him/her that question)
Reasons other people dont ever have sex is because they wish to serve God......become monks or nuns......dedicating their whole life to God....
eg....in the early centuries.....people left to go to monastism....in the desert to live a solitude life and live according to the life of serving God.......prayers for the whole of the world......that way,they abstained from having sex because it is what they wished to do,of their own choice.....(lives of many great Saints that lived long ago....and by doing this, many have had revelation of what is to befall mankind..eg....the end of the world and the appearance of the Antichrist)

On the other hand......as ThomasC.....said..thinking of it is a sin...it is like you have commited that offense.....but it is not all lost.......
You can have remission of sins....

quote///One doesn't have to be having sex to be aware of what gender he/she is atrracted to. And you don't choose who you're attracted to, you just are...

Not true.......one has feelings........but who is to say those feelings are that of what is real or fanatasy?
People get over things......some take more time then others.........it is a choice one has to make....
It is a choice rather then what is true and natural.....
helen

Aries you are a bigot and should be banned. Even though practicing the homosexual life is sin, they should be shown love and tolerance while being told that their life style is wrong. You do not cure sin with killing people. In fact you are a bigger sinner than those homosexuals you condemn.

First, have said this before. Gay sex is just pleasing oneslf since not procreating according to helen is evil. But what about a hetro who is sterile? Or a women who has gone through menopause? If she has sex she will go to hell since she can no longer have children? Bull!!!(not John Bull, just plain Bull)

Also, where in the bible does it say "You a gay, you go to hell."? Never. It might say "If a male looks to a male for fun then he shall have done something wrong in the eyes of a guy who sent hellfire and brimstone on several cities because three people said they didn't believe in him which gave him reason to kill thousands of innocents." Well, that actually makes some sense. People have showed quotes from the bible that could mean gay a sin, or could mean jumping on your head three times while rubbing your belly is a sin.(not literally) Thing is you never get a straight answer from a christian. They use stuff from a bible, and say it means what is said. Then you quote something where god orders people to kill babies or is wiping out thousands with a plague, and it is just a metaphor.

Don't look at organized religon for the answer, they just want mindless sheep.(bible says so many times how you are a sheep and god is the shepard, so follow blindly like a sheep and never question or will burn in hell for free thinking)

Anyways, if being gay or lesbian is what floats your boat(besides buoancy) then float on(unlike the Titanic).

Also, sleeping pleasures the body helen, should I stop sleeping so I don't get the pleasure of dreams or rest?

Originally posted by James the Lesser
First, have said this before. Gay sex is just pleasing oneslf since not procreating according to helen is evil. But what about a hetro who is sterile? Or a women who has gone through menopause? If she has sex she will go to hell since she can no longer have children? Bull!!!(not John Bull, just plain Bull)

Also, where in the bible does it say "You a gay, you go to hell."? Never. It might say "If a male looks to a male for fun then he shall have done something wrong in the eyes of a guy who sent hellfire and brimstone on several cities because three people said they didn't believe in him which gave him reason to kill thousands of innocents." Well, that actually makes some sense. People have showed quotes from the bible that could mean gay a sin, or could mean jumping on your head three times while rubbing your belly is a sin.(not literally) Thing is you never get a straight answer from a christian. They use stuff from a bible, and say it means what is said. Then you quote something where god orders people to kill babies or is wiping out thousands with a plague, and it is just a metaphor.

Don't look at organized religon for the answer, they just want mindless sheep.(bible says so many times how you are a sheep and god is the shepard, so follow blindly like a sheep and never question or will burn in hell for free thinking)

Anyways, if being gay or lesbian is what floats your boat(besides buoancy) then float on(unlike the Titanic).

Also, sleeping pleasures the body helen, should I stop sleeping so I don't get the pleasure of dreams or rest?

james......the fact of the matter is .....too much sleep is not good for us!
Sleep should be enough for the body to receive rest.......so I guess that too has it's faults!
What can I say?
We all sin .......one way or another.......but that does not mean we are all doomed to go to hell!
There are monks that only get enough sleep for the body to get rested.......time is spent with prayers and work.....eating once a day.....and only vegetables......no animal meat for a monk is permitted.....
Only on feast days....is permitted to eat a bit more......and this is still being done today!
And many monks live to over 100 yrs old!
...............In a marriage sex is not seen as a sin.....then again there are certain days that one should abstain from having sex......
helen.

Its obvious Aries is the only gay to not be allowed to be in the GAY club.

Poor guy, they looked at him and instantly said, "whoa, to gay."

Well Aries probably should also retake English Composition or maybe he is a high school drop out. Is his posting the level of scholarship in high schools today? By the time you are in the eigth grade, you should be able to write a simple sentence without any grammatical errors.

Thank you for proving to me that you know absolutely nothing about sin. It is obvious that you cannot handle the debate on what is sinful and what is not. If you actually believe that feeding one's self is a sin than I feel sorry for you. So what do you do, pray everytime you eat. Do you pray for God not to hate you for loving life???

I really don't get it. How can you really think that food is Satan's crop???

Show me a quote in the Bible or what ever you read that says eating is a sin. Please do that for me. Do it for yourself. Cause it is obvious you are in chains. You are in chains of fear and deception. God doesn't want us to suffer. God wants us to be pleased. For you to think otherwise is sinful in my eyes.




Wake up lady.



Abraham

AbrahamV....Man does not live on bread alone!

The Devil was tempting Christ with these words in the desert...
�Man does not live by
bread alone, but by the word of Gd� (Deuteronomy 8:3).

St. John, in his first Epistle, summing up the three forms of temptation, puts the matter this way: "Do not love the world or the things in the world. If anyone loves the world, love for the Father is not in him. For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh and the lust of the eyes and the pride of life, is not of the Father but is of the world. And the world passes away, and the lust of it; but he who does the will of God abides forever." (1 John 2.15-17)
helen....

Originally posted by quango

Originally posted by Thomas Crowne
As to whether or not a homosexual is still one even if that person does not commit the act, I'd say it is immaterial. Commiting the act in one's mind is the same as doing it, if I read Christ's words correctly. So, if one keeps the thoughts pure it is irrelevent.

Where is the line between pure and impure? Is any sexual thought or attraction lustful and therefore a sin?
Does marriage to the person of interest negate this?

Well, of course being married to the person of interest negate this.

As far as the thoughts that enter the mind about others, here's a rule of thumb that can help: You can't stop a bird from flying over your head, but you can prevent it from building a nest!

The moronic Aries' post above was edited for content, which means that nothing remains but my notification that I edited it.

I don't think the President of the Internet Crap-for-Brains Hate Society will be around much more.

Originally posted by helen670
AbrahamV....Man does not live on bread alone!

The Devil was tempting Christ with these words in the desert...
�Man does not live by
bread alone, but by the word of Gd� (Deuteronomy 8:3).

St. John, in his first Epistle, summing up the three forms of temptation, puts the matter this way: "Do not love the world or the things in the world. If anyone loves the world, love for the Father is not in him. For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh and the lust of the eyes and the pride of life, is not of the Father but is of the world. And the world passes away, and the lust of it; but he who does the will of God abides forever." (1 John 2.15-17)
helen....

You still have failed to show me where it says that food is Satan's crop.

Let us pick apart these quotes.

First one:

�Man does not live by
bread alone, but by the word of Gd� (Deuteronomy 8:3).

Okay, fair enough. Even still that doesn't say that eating is sinful. All that says is that one can eat and live all they want but that doesn't mean that one will live if one lives without God. They may live in this world but not in his/her's. You See?

Second one:

"Do not love the world or the things in the world. If anyone loves the world, love for the Father is not in him. For all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh and the lust of the eyes and the pride of life, is not of the Father but is of the world. And the world passes away, and the lust of it; but he who does the will of God abides forever." (1 John 2.15-17)

That simply says that one can lust and love all one wants but that love for God and his will is an option too. It doesn't say that one will lose anything or sin because of this lack of love for his/her will.

Am I right or am I wrong???

I would guess that I am wrong. Cause you are always right.

Right?

Little off topic here, my apologies, but I must say...thats the first time since I have been here that I have seen someone with 5 warns....

Again...my apologies to everyone.


regards
seekerof

The debate over the sinfulness of homosexuality is tiresome to me. Helen may know the bible verse that states that what a man/woman thinks in their heart constitutes sinful acts. Put simply, one may think of a woman naked while she is fully dressed or say in the mind" I really would like to...." and one has sinned.
The point of the verse [ ] is to tell us that we are all guilty of sin and can not help ourselves out of it.
Abstinence is a good thing period.