Just Breaking on CNN, Strike on Syria Within Hours Without Congressional Approval

Originally posted by Senduko
Yup, don't the Russians have something like E-4 ( doomsday plane).

If they do, they've kept it pretty quiet. I've heard of doomsday bunkers, even a top secret doomsday machine that no one knew about (which sort of defeats the purpose of a doomsday machine), but I've never heard of a Russian E-4 equivalent.

10.52am BST UN secretary general
Speaking in the Hague, in the Netherlands Ban Ki-moon has pleaded for a diplomatic solution to the Syrian conflict before expected Anglo-American military action. This from AP:

Ban said Wednesday a United Nation team investigating the alleged chemical attack must be given time to establish the facts.

And he has urged the United Nations Security Council not to be "missing in action" as the Syria crisis deepens.

Ban was speaking in the Great Hall of Justice at the Peace Palace in The Hague, which is marking its 100th anniversary.

"Give peace a chance. Give diplomacy a chance. Stop acting and start talking," he said.

Guardian

Originally posted by Zaphod58

Originally posted by Senduko
Yup, don't the Russians have something like E-4 ( doomsday plane).

If they do, they've kept it pretty quiet. I've heard of doomsday bunkers, even a top secret doomsday machine that no one knew about (which sort of defeats the purpose of a doomsday machine), but I've never heard of a Russian E-4 equivalent.

I think Russia have soemthing Called; the Dead Hand.

In the early 1990s several former high-ranking members of the Soviet military and the Central Committee of the Communist Party in a series of interviews to the American defense contractor BDM admitted the existence of the Dead Hand, making somewhat contradictory statements concerning its deployment.[7]

reply to post by spy66


They do, but they didn't admit its existence until after it had been in use for decades.

find one thing these 3 picture have in common

There was an update on the Doomsday plane

Update: Hagel visited Malaysia on Aug. 24 and later was in Jordan to discuss about Syria. Maybe his plane made a stopover on its way back to the U.S.

So, at this point nothing conclusive ( even though that might be wishful thinking)

Originally posted by 2012newstart
i wonder isn't it a trap for America if it is known fact Syria to possess Russian anti-ship missiles. (don't know how many Israel destroyed, but there should be some more underground). What will happen if there are US ships affected by them, may be destroyed. It will be Russian missiles to do that no matter the Syrian would hit the button. US-Russia cold war or what. In all, how about a scenario that Syria uses some advanced unknown weapon and make it a nightmare for either US ships or Turkey, or Israel. There are Iskanders too. Perhaps Syria is not so easy thing to win, let alone 2 day punishment only. I do not discuss the chemical weapons. They Could have been launched by Assad regime. I believe it is possible Assad regime, as well as the opposition, to have used chemical weapons. Neither of them is free of any guilt in that conflict. So apart of the chemical weapons use so far: what is it that Syria could still use against America. S-300 may not be enough even if they have it. Putin said some new weapons were sent unseen in Middle East before.

You need well trained men to use complex weapons.

Obviously Syria's forces do not seem profesional from videos posted on the Internet.

There is a problem of morale as well.

Syrians cannot successfully engage US ships, even if they have the weapons.

India is the best user of Russian weapons, using them in ways not imagined by Russians themselves.

Middle east forces have not been able to adapt to Russian techniques.

It's amazing that nobody knows that the President can run military operations for as long as he wants while we're still in a State of Emergency (you know - since Sept. 11th 2001) that's never been rescinded.

Even if we weren't, the President can also run military operations for 90 days without Congressional approval.

Anywhere in the world.

reply to post by ArtooDetoo


Syrian isn't Libya unless your suggesting Assad is an Pawn in there Game Also John Kerry told Assad in that short meeting, only Assad can bring stability in Syria and ME.

reply to post by Senduko


That's an odd stopover to make coming out of Jordan. It vaguely makes sense, but they would have had to come out of Amman, head out over Cyprus, and back to Incirlik. It would have almost made more sense to go to Malaysia, come up through Thailand, up through Afghanistan then back down to Amman. Or even to go to the ME first, instead of Hawaii then to Malaysia.

reply to post by ArtooDetoo


you could cut the air with a knife, ,looks very uncomfortable , no friends here!

JOE BIDEN called to IMPEACH George Bush if he Attacked Iran Without Congressional Authority

So will Biden be calling to Impeach Obama for dropping bombs in Syria without congressional authority? Hypocrisy!

I posted this on another thread. After reading some of this thread, and I'm not 100% sure it hasn't been covered, I think it's applicable here, too.

For people who keep referring to the opponents of Assad's regime as "the rebels" or "the FSA (Free Syrian Army), may I suggest an alternative that is not only more accurate, but also revealing?

Al Nusra Front. The FSA is divided in to smaller factions, none of which are permanently allied with one another. THe largest, most influential, religiously extreme (Wahhabi) , best funded (Saudi, Kuwaiti, Yemeni money), with the most international connections (Al Qaeda) is "Al Nusra Front".

I propose we make it common place to refer to the "rebels" or the "FSA" as simply Al Nusra front anymore.

So on one hand you have Assad, who dictator he may be, supports a moderate government that is officially secular. Under him, Christians, Jews, Muslims, Druze, all lived together relatively harmoniously, much like Lebanon before their civil war in the 70s.

On the other hand you have a rebel army full for foreigners, many of which are ethnic Arabs who have traveled from countries in Europe and North America to be a part of this conflict and fully intend to travel back "home" after the fighting is over. The rebels are dominated financially, ideologically, politically, culturally, and internationally by the de facto group in charge that is Al Nusra Front. That's a considerable threat to national security if I've ever encountered one. Al Nusra Front is the Syrian military extension of Al Qaeda. The US and UK are not only destabilizing the entire region by intervening, they are going to support the very terrorists they've been fighting since 2001. And in supporting them threatening their own national security in the long run by doing so.

To top it off, there are pieces of journalism from as early as January this year that the US had not only considered taking steps to intervene in Syria through creating a chemical weapons crisis, but considered them eagerly as not just a possible option, but a favored one. Consider this: Al Nusra Front has access to the same chemical weapons that Assad has ever since they captured facility 111.

Is anyone with me on this? Is anyone willing to stop merely calling them "the rebels" or the "FSA" and instead calling them what they are, Al Nusra Front.

Every conflict zone I have ever been in through my professional career has involved Islam in one shape or form, without exception.

The 8200 unit of the Israeli Defence Forces, which specialises in electronic surveillance, intercepted a conversation between Syrian officials regarding the use of chemical weapons, an unnamed former Mossad official told Focus. The content of the conversation was relayed to the US, the ex-official said.
The 8200 unit collects and analyses electronic data, including wiretapped telephone calls and emails. It is the largest unit in the IDF.

www.theguardian.com...

reply to post by xavi1000


Sarcasm on: If the Israelis say it's so, then it must be so.

Sarcasm off: It's in Israels best interest to keep this conflict going as long as possible. Instead of having a fair and successful nation right next to them, they've got a country suffering from brain drain ( as the civil engineers, scientists, educated class flee the country), fundamental Islam comes, and the country is turned into ruins. Every fundamentalist Muslim nation that doesn't have oil money is literally a 3rd world country. Islam as a complete societal system is a very uncompetitive one. It is in Israel's best interest to see this country go from a relatively peaceful and successful nation to a 3rd world backwater like Pakistan, Afghanistan, Eritrea, Djibouti, Sudan, etc. etc. Syria was an officially secular country where Christians, Jews, Muslims, Kurds and Druze lived together relatively peacefully. Like Lebanon before their civil war in the 70s. Lebanon was supposed to be a fantastic place to visit. I have older family members tell me that Beirut used to be the Paris of the Levant.

Secular and successful to religious extremist and shattered.

I don't believe that anonymous report for an instant. If our guys in intelligence do, then I would call them nonplussed.

Based on my posts, I bet people think I'm pro Assad. This isn't true. I'm anti-Al Nusra Front, I'm anti-saudi/wahhabi, and I'm anti-intervention. If the rebels were syrian nationalists only, and monetarily supported by people other than Al Qaeda, Saudi, Kuwaiti, Yemeni, and other religious fundamentalists, then I would be in favor of the rebels winning. But Kuwaiti, Saudi, and Yemeni money comes with huge religious strings attached. Most mosques being built right now are partial funded by those guys. The strings attached are "if you take the check, then you must least preach Wahhabi ideology, openly or covertly. The same goes for their funding of Al Nusra Front.

reply to post by Galvatron


According to a Article in The Telegraph, it is the Saudis who are doing the pushing and shoving.

Saudi Arabia have even threatening Russia With terrorism.


Saudis offer Russia secret oil deal if it drops Syria

Saudi Arabia has secretly offered Russia a sweeping deal to control the global oil market and safeguard Russia’s gas contracts, if the Kremlin backs away from the Assad regime in Syria.


The revelations come amid high tension in the Middle East, with US, British, and French warship poised for missile strikes in Syria. Iran has threatened to retaliate.


The strategic jitters pushed Brent crude prices to a five-month high of $112 a barrel. “We are only one incident away from a serious oil spike. The market is a lot tighter than people think,” said Chris Skrebowski, editor of Petroleum Review.


Leaked transcripts of a closed-door meeting between Russia’s Vladimir Putin and Saudi Prince Bandar bin Sultan shed an extraordinary light on the hard-nosed Realpolitik of the two sides.

Prince Bandar, head of Saudi intelligence, allegedly confronted the Kremlin with a mix of inducements and threats in a bid to break the deadlock over Syria. “Let us examine how to put together a unified Russian-Saudi strategy on the subject of oil. The aim is to agree on the price of oil and production quantities that keep the price stable in global oil markets,” he said at the four-hour meeting with Mr Putin. They met at Mr Putin’s dacha outside Moscow three weeks ago.

“We understand Russia’s great interest in the oil and gas in the Mediterranean from Israel to Cyprus. And we understand the importance of the Russian gas pipeline to Europe. We are not interested in competing with that. We can cooperate in this area,” he said, purporting to speak with the full backing of the US.

As-Safir said Prince Bandar pledged to safeguard Russia’s naval base in Syria if the Assad regime is toppled, but he also hinted at Chechen terrorist attacks on Russia’s Winter Olympics in Sochi if there is no accord. “I can give you a guarantee to protect the Winter Olympics next year. The Chechen groups that threaten the security of the games are controlled by us,” he allegedly said.

Prince Bandar went on to say that Chechens operating in Syria were a pressure tool that could be switched on an off. “These groups do not scare us. We use them in the face of the Syrian regime but they will have no role in Syria’s political future.”

The Putin-Bandar meeting was stormy, replete with warnings of a “dramatic turn” in Syria. Mr Putin was unmoved by the Saudi offer, though western pressure has escalated since then. “Our stance on Assad will never change. We believe that the Syrian regime is the best speaker on behalf of the Syrian people, and not those liver eaters,” he said, referring to footage showing a Jihadist rebel eating the heart and liver of a Syrian soldier.

Prince Bandar in turn warned that there can be “no escape from the military option” if Russia declines the olive branch. Events are unfolding exactly as he foretold.

Originally posted by Zaphod58
And the plot thickens. A Russian Il-62 (RA-86570) belonging to the Russian Ministry for Emergency Situations came out of Moldova, around Turkish airspace, into Syria last night. It landed at Lattkia around 0005 GMT, dropped some aids off, and picked up a number of people wanting to return to Moscow, and departed again around 0200 GMT.

Zaphod, you are quite knowlegeable about various military planes/weapons/systems and current operations. I take it you served/serve. Are you a former pilot?

reply to post by UnBreakable


I was failed on my physical when I tried to go in (they were slashing numbers) but worked as a civilian on the ramp, after literally growing up and being trained by my father (30 years active duty maintenance, followed by 16 as a civilian contractor for the Air Force) on the ramp.

I've made a few contacts over the years that are willing to keep me in the look when it comes to current operations and plans, and I have a few places to look for weapons improvements. I keep my hand in as much as I can anymore.

reply to post by Zaphod58


I was under the impression the S-300 system was delivered via Ukraine (or one of those former soviet republics).

reply to post by Xcathdra


That's what I had heard as well. But there are a number of reports denying they were delivered. Like I said, the safest course of action is to assume that they are there, and plan for it.