"When I Get These Cuffs Off You I'm Going to Kick the Piss Out of You"

Originally posted by DerekJR321
Another pig on a power trip.

Newsflash to all the cops out there. There is no law that says we have to treat you with respect. You treat US with respect and you will get some in return.

This is what it comes down to.
An Ego Trip.
$$$Powered$$$ by a Fascist Government that wants a well equipped military police force.
They want you to submit or else.

In the olden days, if you had a muffler out or illegal mufflers, you were giving a fix it ticket.
If you were belligerent or disputed the ticket with the cops, the cop threw it in your face and went on his merry way.
Pay the fine or not, the cop did not care, that is between you and the state.

Now many of them are to the point where they are no longer serving the citizens but the state and
even if you are not doing anything wrong, you better submit to them or else.

reply to post by Helious


Good Post.
I have never had any problems with the cops either and in every instance I have been friendly with them and they have been friendly back. But we cannot deny that there is a subset that is causing a lot of problems for a lot of people in this country and this needs to be reined in.

Originally posted by roadgravel
No much choice about not getting out of your vehicle...

The U.S. Supreme Court decided many years ago, in a case

That says it all right there folks.
Follow the chain of command up the ladder to see who has been implementing these policies via hiring, laws and military gear to see where the problem lies.

I just had to post this from the youtube page, one of the comments:

News: Today a man has plead not guilty to a count of cause i said so, more after the break!

As an avid defender of police officers and hopeful future officer, I will admit that the choice of words this officer used were poor. He did, indeed, come off as a very power hungry cop.

My question is what do we know about the events leading up to the start of the video? Why was the officer asking the guy to step out of his vehicle? Is that the first thing the officer asked? Was the officer asking after the guy was being rude? What happened? This information is important.

If an officer pulls you over, bring your car to a stop, shut off your engine, if at night turn on your cab light, stay in the car, roll down your window, and most importantly don't be a jerk. Be polite and 95% of the time, the officer will return the same. If the officer asks you to step put of your vehicle, do it. He/she has a reason for it, but regardless, it's in your best interest to do as asked lest you have that one officer who is looking for trouble. Remember that the officer must obtain your permission to search your vehicle unless you are put under arrest. If the officer decides to arrest you for BS, don't resist. Then he has something on you. If that officer places you under arrest for false charges, the court will find out and that officer will be punished harshly. I've seen it.

There are officers out there that have serious issues. I can admit that because to think otherwise is just foolish. I sincerely wish there was an easier way to oust them and get rid of them, but it's not as easy as it seems. Unfortunately, good officers can come off as bad ones when put in a situation such as seen from a video that only has half of the altercation (not particularly this one, this officer exhibited the wrong attitude).

Originally posted by minesweeper

Originally posted by DaTroof
reply to post by Helious

 

That's internet smart, son. Now let me tell you what's really gonna happen. This kid is going to be charged with a noise violation, obstruction of justice and resisting arrest. If he can afford a lawyer, he MIGHT get the resist dropped. Welcome to America. Don't start **** with Johnny Law.

wow are you really cheerleading tyranny, sheep will be sheep it seems.

Only if it is Democrat tyranny. Bet the government apologists in this thread would be up in arms if a Republican was in charge.

Yes, the kid was being an annoying little prick (yes I am making that assumption - usually when you hear those kinds of statements you are trying to prove a point to the officer) but still you are an officer, you have to hold a higher standard - you don't threaten the person you are talking to for being annoying.

reply to post by DaTroof

ill tell you what will happen... this will go viral.... then, all charges will be dropped. he will get an apology from the police dept. and that officer will have to go to sensitivity training.

Datroof is a cop on a power trip probably comes here while bored looking for speeders

Originally posted by DaTroof
So if a loud muffler at night isn't a crime, I can bump my stereo outside your house, right? Right? You guys like M.O.P.?

And I would hope the cops treat you the same way, da.

I can agree with you that a citation should be sufficient, but much like the referee who only sees the retaliation and not the initial cheap shot, we only have this boy's video and not the whole story. I'd like to see the police dashcam for this stop, because I imagine little innocent Billy here ain't so innocent or respectful.

Of course he is innocent of any other crime, if he was simply being arrested for a loud muffler. And where did you get the idea that you have to be 'respectful' to a law enforcement officer? YOU pay them to protect you and serve the population. To protect and SERVE. They are LAW enforcement officers. Not nannies who are responsible for your gutter mouth.

I recall a video where an officer was ticketing some guy for speeding. The entire time, the guy was raging. Yelling, cussing, pissed off. The cop never raised his voice, did not ask him to get out the car, did not arrest him. He gave him his citation, told him to have a nice day, and went back to his car. The commensurate professional. I am not saying I agree someone should yell, cuss, or be rude to a cop. I've always been respectful when talking to them.

But it's not against the LAW to do so. They are there to uphold the law. You are the sort of person the government loves for the record. The only time they should arrest or act as they do is if they feel the kid would be a threat to them or others, or there is a legitimate suspicion of something else going on. Don't be such a willing sheep. I've always upheld police (I think they get way too much bad press and not enough kudos for their jobs), and will continue to do so. I don't think a few bad ones really represent the majority. But you are crazy if you think everyone should subserviently say "yes officer.. whatever you say officer.. yes sir!"

Originally posted by DaTroof
reply to post by DocHolidaze

 

LOL, I chose that track because it's what I was listening to. Ouch, spittin hate on mah boys!

I like the song you posted. So silly.

Anyway, my point was that loud mufflers are annoying, and many users here find hip-hop being played loudly from vehicles VERY annoying. Just saying the 2 are the same. If we're gonna defend this kid and his muffler, let's defend kids getting rolled for loud music.

Except, no one is defending the loud muffler. That's not an arrestable offense however. It's something you get a ticket for and can then argue in court (and lose, because the police officers word is worth more than your proof). The cop had no right to order the guy out of the car, and when the guy questioned why, the officers response was now you're being arrested, again the guy questioned why and was told "because I said so". There's only a legal obligation to obey reasonable requests from cops and "because I said so" or getting out of a car that's been turned off aren't reasonable requests.

What this basically comes down to, is that we train cops to always be in control of a situation and having someone compliant is a basic premise of being in control. So the cop is trained to make someone comply, even when their request isn't something the person has to do. If the person says no, the cop becomes combative and if the person says yes they have to deal with a rights violation to prevent upsetting the cop. It's a no win situation.

The cop is only human, put yourself in his shoes.

When someone starts off being uncooperative the cop may at worst think he is a threat or at best think he going to waste his time with his youtube law education.

Whether the cop is in the right or not, you should always be polite and comply with their demands. If they have acted outside their powers then you can deal with that later if you wish.

Originally posted by Echo3Foxtrot
As an avid defender of police officers and hopeful future officer, I will admit that the choice of words this officer used were poor. He did, indeed, come off as a very power hungry cop.

My question is what do we know about the events leading up to the start of the video? Why was the officer asking the guy to step out of his vehicle? Is that the first thing the officer asked? Was the officer asking after the guy was being rude? What happened? This information is important.

If an officer pulls you over, bring your car to a stop, shut off your engine, if at night turn on your cab light, stay in the car, roll down your window, and most importantly don't be a jerk. Be polite and 95% of the time, the officer will return the same. If the officer asks you to step put of your vehicle, do it. He/she has a reason for it, but regardless, it's in your best interest to do as asked lest you have that one officer who is looking for trouble. Remember that the officer must obtain your permission to search your vehicle unless you are put under arrest. If the officer decides to arrest you for BS, don't resist. Then he has something on you. If that officer places you under arrest for false charges, the court will find out and that officer will be punished harshly. I've seen it.

There are officers out there that have serious issues. I can admit that because to think otherwise is just foolish. I sincerely wish there was an easier way to oust them and get rid of them, but it's not as easy as it seems. Unfortunately, good officers can come off as bad ones when put in a situation such as seen from a video that only has half of the altercation (not particularly this one, this officer exhibited the wrong attitude).

I've heard two family stories from "back in the day". one was from my father who was a ranger in Nam, told the story about an arrogant 2nd luey who wouldn't listen to the Sgt, and would get the men killed, and they knew it.

So, the 2nd luey suffered a severe case of "friendly fire".

my uncle told me a similar story, this one involving cops. there was one in particular who would often beat his wife. (She'd often come in with a black eye, etc) After a few friendly conversations, they (his colleagues) took him to a stairwell, and threw him down the stairs, then they beat him. they said next time this happens to your wife, we finish this in an alley.

I tell you these two extreme examples, for one simple purpose: The idea that "oh well, # happens, there's bad apples, don't blame the good guys, he may be looking for a fight...

is complete BULL#.

Ppl handled their business years ago, both in the PD's & the military. Now they just don't care b/c they can get away with murder and they KNOW it.

Back then there was no erasable line that kept being redone further & further back. now there is. everyone says "Let them arrest you & if its false, sue."

Why?!

If someone is willing to betray their OATH. If someone is willing to sacrifice my freedom b/c they "had a bad day" or something similar, why should WE AS A SOCIETY let it go to court? Doesn't common law say I have a right to defend myself? And if the "courts" say otherwise, do I have to follow THAT law that is against common decency & common sense?

With all due respect (seriously) I'm tired of hearing these piss poor excuses from former/current/future cops. You guys handled your own, years ago, not so much any more. How much longer do you expect the public to put up with it, as a whole?

Originally posted by Helious
If I had your address, I'd mail you a check for 5 bucks so you could buy a clue.

edit on 1-8-2013 by Helious because: (no reason given)

they cost that much now?

last I change checked, they cost but one SHILLing...

on the real though, that cop was completely out of line...."because I said so"? you gotta be f**king kidding me...

To clear up some confusion:

When you are stopped by an officer on a traffic stop you are technically detained. You may not leave. Everything you do is under the lawful command of the officer who's duty is to investigate the traffic violation. If you obstruct the officer in any capacity you can be subject to arrest for Obstruction/Resisting an Officer without Violence. In fact if an officer observes anything he suspects as furtive movements he may immediately put handcuffs on you for the interest of his safety and later take the cuffs off. By furtive movements I mean digging under the seat or reaching around areas that he can not see.

I will elaborate further on what I mean by a traffic violation investigation and what their rights and duties are on the investigation. In order for the officer to identify the driver he may use photo identification, drivers license, social security, thumb print, facial recognition, etc. He may ask questions pertaining to the violation. He may direct you to move the vehicle for many reasons to include the interest of safety of persons and property or traffic flow. He may ask you to turn off the vehicle or radio if it interferes with any part of the investigation or to check the equipment for safety. He may ask you to step out of the vehicle for multiple reasons to include: if he suspects DUI, for his personal safety, for the safety of the driver, to further identify the driver, etc.

Basically anything he asks you to do in the interest of safety or his investigation is a lawful command.

Personally, Ive been in situations where guns were involved. For instance I pulled over a car for a tail light violation not knowing that the three occupants had just committed two armed home invasions. Luckily I felt something not right about their behavior and called for another unit. I noticed one of the subjects continually lean to one side and try to prevent me from seeing something near the bottom of the door while I peered into the vehicle. Based on those movements I developed reasonable suspicion and had everyone step out of the vehicle. Once I opened the door out fell a sawed off shotgun. Further search yielded more guns, drugs, and evidence of the articles stolen in the home invasions.

By showing strong officer command presence I was able to control the situation. I have encountered several of these situations in my 6 year tenure and if I let my guard down on one stop then I let it down on all of them.

It is unreasonable to judge this officer if you do not understand the law concerning the incident and how serious an officer takes his personal safety.

I do not condone what the officer said, but this know-it-all kid needs a dose of reality and learn how to respect authority.

Everyone always wants to test the limits of the law and those who enforce them. Why? I will tell you why. It is because they grew up in a soft padded life where they never found the boundaries of trouble. They never experienced violence or degradation and they think its a fad. But its not. Its horrible.

I spent my first six hours of my shift tonight investigating a rich sixty year old man who sexually molested a two and a half year old girl. Booking info We go to these calls then have to go to something as petty as a dispute over a fence line right afterward.

You don't understand the punishment this job takes on your mind. If an officer is cold its not because he chooses to be. Its because the world is a sick, disgusting, and vile place that changes him- or at least only the parts he has to work in.

I know noise pollution is a terrible crime and I was thinking about this the other day as an annoying ice cream truck was rolling around my neighborhood.

I was thinking whether the ice cream truck, who was blasting its repetitive nonsense, was violating noise codes or if they were allowed to do it because of some business permit or something.

Now obviously I'm not an expert on the subject, but I thought that if they were allowed to be in blatant violation of whatever noise laws my be in place, could anyone purchase an ice cream vendors license and use that as a carte blanche to be as loud and annoying as they please. All in the name of capitalism of course.

Sorry for posting off topic, but reading this thread made me think of this and I figured who better to ask than the insightful members of ATS.

Originally posted by Dynamike


Basically anything he asks you to do in the interest of safety or his investigation is a lawful command.

OK. Now as I have already said, I believe the kid was pushing the guy's buttons and I do think cops deserve respect.

HOWEVER....

Think about what you have just said. "A lawful command".

It just sounds creepy when you word it like that. People should voluntarily respect one another but really, I don't think I can agree with penalizing people for a failure to show respect. If the kid wasn't breaking any major laws, "Obstructing an officer" is a BS charge that is obviously can be easily abused by cops to simply harass people randomly without having any real reason. Which is awfully close to police state tyranny if you ask me.

Again, I have had encounters with cops who were doing exactly this. I won't bore you with a bunch of stories but cops are human. If you give them an easy excuse to abuse their authority, some of them absolutely will.

I don't personally like to see good cops just trying to do their jobs getting attacked but I also worry about any human being having this much power. A lot of boundaries start to get really blurry.

Originally posted by DaTroof
reply to post by DocHolidaze

 

LOL, I chose that track because it's what I was listening to. Ouch, spittin hate on mah boys!

I like the song you posted. So silly.

Anyway, my point was that loud mufflers are annoying, and many users here find hip-hop being played loudly from vehicles VERY annoying. Just saying the 2 are the same. If we're gonna defend this kid and his muffler, let's defend kids getting rolled for loud music.

"What you in for homes?"
"Murder. Killed a sumbitch. You?"
"Oh I was annoying."

Right on man, aint dat da troof..

Oo

It's becoming quite clear that for every 3 mth a cop in a busy criminal environment works, they then need a 3 mth spell petting fluffy kittens or doing something more personally rewarding with their time. If your only personal reward is nailing bad guys, you're doing it wrong.

Just my opinion but this is some nice 2 minutes piece of anti cop propaganda...

Was the officer showing unrespectful authority? Perhaps but the thing is, we only see a glimpse of what actually happened. Nothing whatsoever from before they started taping...

The video mentions that he was stopped because of his muffler. But is it all it was?

This kid was anything but cooperative. What actually happened before they started taping? Was he cooperative then? I doubt it.

On tape.

“I’m not coming out of the car sir...”

The kid not being cooperative didn't help his case. Acting nervous and obstructive would warrant having him take a step out if only to see if he was under the influence, alcohol or drugs...

The kid had no respect for authority. They decided to arrest him because he wasn't complying.

“i’m a police officer, when I tell you to step out of the car, you step out...”

“No...I don’t have to...”

Bet this kid had fun with his teachers in school...

The title of this thread is based on words that are written in the video but we don't hear him say that...what we hear him say is:

“You’re going to kick the piss out of me? You’re on tape...”

To which the officer replies...THREE times:

“Stop trying to fight me...stop trying to fight me...stop trying to fight me...”

Which, of course, doesn't show on tape...

The final words of this kid:

"“it’s all on tape officer, it’s all on tape...”

What is ???

That this kid had no manners? That he was uncooperative and obstructive?

Give me a break.

The officer was only as respectful as this kid was. The kid escalated the situation with his behaviour.

Dissapointed that this 2 minute video might go viral and further more, dissapointed to see it hit the front page, for ALL the wrong reasons.

But that's just me.