The Language of Vampyr

originally posted by: Bybyots
metaheuristic

Yummiest word in a day of yummy words.

a reply to: Bybyots

Alternatively, one could design it to specifically deal with all information in the same way. It would focus on refining its own processes rather than depending on what is or is not known.

I suspect that places like CERN will continue to find any pattern they seek, given enough time. They'll eventually get that +5 vorpal.

a reply to: Anaana

You were laughing at me, not with me, weren't you?

Oh no, I was laughing at me, wondering to myself how SA ever made enough sense to me to post about it in the first place.

It's not you, it's me

Oh no, it's me. For sure.

Because I have almost always had to have myself worked up in to a fit of something in order to stay focused long enough to make any sense out of it for myself.

There had always been two driving factors involved in that: avoidance of schoolwork, and the need (there's that word again) to deconstruct FLs line of Bull#.

The first one works well, because I would already be all warm and loose from my STEM curriculum. The other, well, that's a problem.

'Member I asked Direne if he knew who Bybyots was? Bybyots is a fictional charcter created by Stanislav Szukalski. Bybyots is an immortal being, but only as long as there are newer and better stories for him to tell. If the stories dry up, so does Bybyots.

I knew a couple of months ago, when chasing Adamantine in the depths of my Dwarf Fortress became more interesting than this thread, that Bybyots' days were numbered. Then came that weird cra-cra post from Direne that sounded like it was written by some degenerate 16 year old whom had just discovered pot, nitrous and goth music all in the same night...

...and "poof!" I was transformed once again in to some dude with a common Christian name and a keyboard.

I don't know nuthin' about no simulated annealing.

a reply to: Anaana

Really, there are limits to what I am capable of understanding,

Oh yeah, me too.

Yeah, I guess we could look at it as a sort of "immune response".

The SA metaheuristic teaches itself to develop and then refer to it's own internal global optimum for solutions.

Again, I don't know...

...but one thing that seems interesting to me about SA is that it can become "greedy". If it finds feedback that keeps telling it that it is "right" it stops searching as hard for "rightness" until it eventually gets stuck.

Pretty good analogy for the problems that the Giselians must be facing, I am thinking.

But I dunno.

I love this thread, and have been keeping up with it since it's inception. I was just watching a program called weird or what; it was an episode about mind control. They had a very interesting device called a piezoelectric sensor that let's you communicate audio or sound through little metal magnets placed anywhere on the skin. It reminded me of one of the goals of fl, to communicate without sound. Like telepathy.
en.m.wikipedia.org...
The subject in the tv show could hear Beethoven playing in his mind when both sensors were applied to his face.
I thought it was really neat, and might be something fl would be highly interested in.
The device is around the 35 minute mark or the program.
m.youtube.com...

My phone won't let me embed the YouTube video.

originally posted by: Bybyots
I knew a couple of months ago, when chasing Adamantine in the depths of my Dwarf Fortress became more interesting than this thread, that Bybyots' days were numbered. Then came that weird cra-cra post from Direne that sounded like it was written by some degenerate 16 year old whom had just discovered pot, nitrous and goth music all in the same night...

...and "poof!" I was transformed once again in to some dude with a common Christian name and a keyboard.

I don't know nuthin' about no simulated annealing.

See, adamantine I could probably learn how to anneal in a few easy steps, as a physical practical process I understand the purpose and the desired outcome...this, what we're talking about here...well...it'll either come to me or it won't...depends upon how necessary it becomes for me to understand it, I suppose.

a reply to: Anaana

it'll either come to me or it won't...depends upon how necessary it becomes for me to understand it, I suppose.

What amazed us all at the beginning of trying to understand FL seemed to be this idea of a language that can be developed that can overcome communication breakdown (I'm not going to post it).

What we discovered from the onset of this beautiful mess of a thread, was that FL was exploring that strange place where languages collide and one or the other just throws in the towel in the face of total failure.

Does SA make any more sense in light of that?

originally posted by: Bybyots
Again, I don't know...

...but one thing that seems interesting to me about SA is that it can become "greedy". If it finds feedback that keeps telling it that it is "right" it stops searching as hard for "rightness" until it eventually gets stuck.

Pretty good analogy for the problems that the Giselians must be facing, I am thinking.

But I dunno.

No, that's actually very good and mirrors, to some extent, the way in which my thinking has been developing over the past few weeks, though, I haven't been framing those thoughts in terms of Giselians and non-Giselians but I am beginning to see how that might be useful.

Hmm? I'm going to come back to this later, I need to ponder a little longer.

a reply to: Anaana

I'm interested in your ponderings. Please include space to ponder the bit where Direne shared with us that the Giselians are us, I'd like to know what you think about that as well.

I should have figured that bit out for myself, the them-being-us bit, but I was slow and lazy, but it made total sense when Direne dropped it. They really do have fine minds for 16 year old degenerate goth rockers.

I mean: that's the "Vampyr" thing, right? A language that can vampirize other languages for their, well, blood really; what makes a language essentially work for the essentials of survival. And speed is a factor, like it's a game.

I dunno.

Bybyots has left the building.

Much thanks for Ashe's Atlas which shrinks this thread considerably.

In other words...

originally posted by: Bybyots
a reply to: Anaana

I'm interested in your ponderings. Please include space to ponder the bit where Direne shared with us that the Giselians are us, I'd like to know what you think about that as well.

Not a lot, then or now. Short answer. I don't usually feel any obligation to accept definitions imposed upon me by others, but I will give it a re-applied thought or two as I didn't really think much about it at the time. Still not sure that I do.

For what it's worth I'd like to share a few observations.

The other day after reading the more recent updates my mind began drifting. Here are a couple things I can't get past and perhaps I simply lack the mental prowess to see deeper than surface level but I can't help but notice certain parallels.

When offered an explanation of what FL is the response was vague and cookie cutter correct? It is not language but anti-language....apparently. Not to bridge gaps between languages but to ensure a bridge can't be built. If this is already incorrect than I certainly have no business in this thread.

I can think of a few groups who could find this useful. I can also see how a group can find useful the attempts of brilliant minds trying to reverse engineer the modus operandi. To be honest as curious as this all is two things keep coming to mind when reading this thread, 1.) honey pot; and 2.) Paul Bennewitz. S

It can't be that obvious right? The last post on FL dated 7/29 speaks jibberish concerning: Ukraine (puppets), Russia (puppets), etc.

What gives? Is this about language, or rather anti-language? Or is this politics? 6 days...

Also it was touted that although it is indexed on Google it remains "hidden in plain site" as if government entities wouldn't find some way to infiltrate it if it wasn't already theirs. After reading a few discussions with professional MindWar(ians) via our very own AMA's it's clear a certain skill set needed is a sense of humor (the darker the better).

originally posted by: Rosinitiate
What gives? Is this about language, or rather anti-language? Or is this politics? 6 days...

This time last year, I would have automatically responded to that with "it's all economics", but I have since been taught that that is too reductionist, determinist and certain a position to adopt.

But that too is economics.

Perhaps FL is nothing more than a honeypot, attracting those that understand their material and then "vampirizing" the results that are shared.

Example: Simulated annealing is an inferior process, however, the more effective processes are not available to be found. By using online forums, they have a medium for direct interaction and.. guidance. In this way, the language would be like the "body" and the information/data like the "blood."

How would a multi-temporal entity appear or be perceived? A bootprint doesn't look too much like a boot. How would one be attracted? "Goals" and actions might be significantly different than an entity residing in a strictly linear experience of time.

a reply to: Rosinitiate

I haven't read this thread much so
pardon my ignorance.

Have their been any really juicy
nuggets such as predictions that
have come 'true'?

99% of 'magic' is to captivate the
audience with a magicians wand
while achieving your objective.

I'm monitoring a few websites which
I feel are farming for 'contactees'
of either UFOs or the 'paranormal'
(there is no difference IMHO).

This could be another one alright.

Kev

a reply to: Rosinitiate

Not necessarily a honey pot but perhaps a cattle pen, when 'Direne' re-emerged there was mention of two moon Gods or two moons in Sumerian tradition in a series of posts such as this, an odd tangent to go off on.

While i didn't agree they had any interest in two moons or two moon Gods there was the son of the moon God Nanna namely Ningublaga, "The incantation priest of opposed languages who put clouds in the sky, the storm which roars in the sky, as the sunlight giving …… to the earth"

The son of the moon God is interesting in his association with language and it's magical usage;

Did he understand a variety of languages? Or does this unusual capacity refer to his understanding of the language of magic or the silent language of animals and nature? In a further enumeration of his uncanny powers, he is able to pull the clouds around in the sky and cause storms and even sunlight to fall to the earth. While Ningublam is not a well-known deity, he may have held more prominence as Nanna's son and as a divine incantation priest than the sparse records show

Primarily he was in charge of Nanna's cattle, a herding Deity, unlike say a shepherd and his sheeple a herder drives cattle forward often through inducing alarm, a relationship built more on fear than trust, you don't need much linguistic skill to get through to cows but of course they can also be seen as representing peoples or nations in a symbolic sense.

Anyway a cattle herder will drive the cows into a cattle pen, O house teeming with unblemished bulls whose king stands on precious stones, a towering trap, crown of the princely son its finest oil is pure preserving its sweetness, O Gabura pure cattle pen

Ningublaga is very obscure, but as i discussed with Direne the numerics of the cult of Nanna and his cows were the basis for Hebrew Apocalyptic numerology from the time of the Book of Daniel, scholars can relate the promises made to the Hebrew patriarch Joseph in Genesis chapter 49 to the praise hymn for Ningublaga, your prince great wild bull horned wild bull exulting in vigor wild cow growing horns basking in his radiant horns, so any Hebrew scholar can trace the influence and continuing importance in different guise.

The case then that can be made is that through usage of language and inducing fear and alarm you can drive peoples to exactly were you want them and do with them as you will.

a reply to: Kantzveldt

That's interesting.

Do you think someone is trying to herd up and put into
a 'pen' master mythologists?

Now this isn't a direct correlation, but in the tradition
I spent 30 years studying (in a manner of speaking),
there is talk of Vak goddess of speech, who in
traditional Hinduism is part of an all female trinity
(now that's a great idea - an 'old girls club!'.)

Now in some secret oral traditions, Vak is also associated
with the so-called Kundalini, as one of the first things
that happens upon arousal, is that a person becomes
a raving loon (various posts on ATS seem related),
but at a later time, if the process becomes
more mature, the person might become a true
genius and polymath, or at least one heck of
a writer.. even in modern times some people
have written several hundred page books in
under 24 hours in perfect verse, when before
they could hardly write their name.. now
this could be attributed to some form of
savant syndrome.. some people have gained
a photograhic memory by being struck in
the head with a rock. I'm just passing along
the 'secret verbal tradition here'.

I bring this up, because referencing a mythical
linguist may have deeper connotations than
is first obvious.

If this is a 'cattle pen' it might be of a slightly
different nature than first assumed.

Kev

a reply to: KellyPrettyBear

I don't think they'd see this place as any sort of particular cattle pen, we're just part of the general herd were the greater task is to drive the whole of humanity forward to wherever suits purpose, alright you can gain insight from whatever the cows around here happen to be mooing about but that's as far as it goes

This might seem an odd way of looking at things but to the people who spend centuries pondering the deeper implications of biblical verse it's what passes for wisdom, to the Freemasons the tradition of the House of Joseph, the bull whose horns drive the nations forward is of huge significance, the New World Order according to this scenario isn't so bad, if you're an unblemished bull.

Ningublam's temple in Kiabrig is lauded as "house / teeming with unblemished bulls," é.gu4.du7.šár, Egudushar. Unblemished bulls are unaltered bulls, those that have not been castrated. Ningublam is the "great wild bull" himself, "exulting in his vigor," "basking in his radiant horns." Obscure though he may be, Ningublam comes alive in the force of the poet's voice. The dominance of the bull alongside his herd of docile cows strolling among the juniper evokes a scene of placid order. Bounty and fecundity rest in the hands of the gods.

a reply to: KellyPrettyBear
Hey Kelly:

This has me right intrigued:

If this is a 'cattle pen' it might be of a slightly
different nature than first assumed.

There are different kinds of cattle pens? So, the tag on my ear may put me in a different pen, or what? as for words like annealing, trimming, so to speak ,and metaheuristic……which, Bbyots, is a truly great addition……well. So glad KellyPrettyBear showed up, just in time…..
tet