Citizens Receiving Food Aid from Federal Gov't Now Outnumber Full-Time Private Sector Workers

Was looking on politifact today and coincidentally came across this: www.politifact.com...

Perhaps some of you could comment on it.

Originally posted by beezzer

Originally posted by HauntWok
reply to post by ElectricUniverse

 

That is a misnomer, as many of those people who are receiving food stamps are actually employed full time. They just are at menial minimum wage jobs and their paycheck doesn't even come close to the cost of living in the US. And employers are all too happy to just replace anyone that asks for a raise with one of the stacks of applicants they receive everyday.

Course bretbart (the king of misleading information) isn't going to say that.

Interesting spin.

So it is the fault of business for not paying people more; that there are so many on food stamps.

Your response would be for the government to step in and raise minimum wage?

edit on 10-7-2013 by beezzer because: (no reason given)

Indeed it would. The income inequality gap in America is ridiculous. Trickle down economics doesn't work when the corporations profiting from their workers production isn't passed back to them in the form of suitable wages.







What are we supposed to do? People require money to live. Corporations are providing just enough to survive, not enough to become wealthy. Savings accounts interest rates are at an all time low. Average Americans must put money into the stock market to make any sort of return, yet know nothing about trading stocks and typically get run on.
The average American can't even figure out if they can afford a mortgage (case in point, housing bubble 2008), yet somehow are expected to invest in stocks and hedge funds just to make a little extra money with the meager wages afforded to them by ridiculously wealthy corporations?

I might be alright with the above if our education system wasn't such a disaster. Our schools fail at every level except the collegiate level, and with Student Loan interest rates recently sky rocketing up, average Americans are 200k+ in debt just to obtain a bachelors degree, then earn crap for the next 10 years because that bachelors degree with no experience is considered "Entry Level".

What can be done? The best solution I've seen is to have the Government force corporations who earn record profits per quarter to compensate their employees who produced those profits at an acceptable margin. The corporations themselves refuse to do it, and so they must be forced to do so.

With our bought and paid for 'Career Politicians' you can pretty much rest assured that will never happen.

reply to post by zeeon


I would agree with you, however coming from a country (Canada) that has mandatory federal minimum wage, I can tell you that it doesn't lead to better paid or people working.

It leads to less positions available as employers, mostly small businesses cannot afford to actually pay those rates while maintaining affordable prices.

What can be done? The best solution I've seen is to have the Government force corporations who earn record profits per quarter to compensate their employees who produced those profits at an acceptable margin. The corporations themselves refuse to do it, and so they must be forced to do so.

Creating a government controlled worker wage program is not the solution. If Walmart for example, was forced to pay it's front line staff let's say minimum, 10$ an hour, they would fire half the staff and raise prices equal to that amount spent on increased wages.

Large corporations will ALWAYS pass down government regulated expenditures to the consumer and their staff.

Usually the staff are the ones who get the shaft the hardest in the form of benefit or hour cuts and even lay offs so that the company can maintain it's current level of profit.

The actual solution is to encourage, via the tax code for corporations to act morally. Incentives for the creating of good paying, high skilled manufacturing and other services would go a long way.

That's very broad I know, but it is what it is.

~Tenth

~Tenth

reply to post by tothetenthpower


The GOP have been trying that approach for over 30 years now (it's called Reaganomics). It hasn't worked. Instead of passing the savings of tax breaks off to the employees, employers just keep them.

@ Cheesefleas

Soooo your answer is to give the government more power? Let them dictate wages?
Thats worked out sooo well, the government has more power than ever, and shockingly, people are getting poorer. "Policies" are why we are in this mess, its not as simple has outsourcing. Ever try to get a patent? Every try to start a business? There are so many regulations and laws, and taxes it hurts the countries growth.
For example, an independent trucker is forced to pay licensing for every state, why? So the government can tax he/she and turn around and buy jets to send to al queda in egypt. He could be doing something with that money here, instead of funding the military/industrial complex.

An influx of unskilled workers will bring down wages for that sector, its supply and demand, common sense.

Take the internet tax, that was solely to get rid of the competition for amazon and walmart, and DIRECTLY hurt their competition. That would mean lost jobs and wages. That is one instance, it happens all the time, in all aspects of business. Raising the wages is just a socialists outcry that will not work in reality. Another robinhood transfer of wealth social idea. The real tyrant is the lawmakers, lobbyist and bank manipulators, not people who make money. The government picks the winners and losers, they would gladly give the people min wage increases because they know nothing will change.

Leftist lawmakers are always proposing it, and will continue to because it keeps the mindless poor feeling like they are getting something, meanwhile they game is rigged for everyone but the politicians. They are pulling up the ladder behind them. In a capitalists society, money equals freedom, and the elite at the top are doing everything they can to get rid of the middle class.

Its funny some people get can mad at the rich, but when the banks lose billions for the poor, the government steals billions more from the poor and no one gets arrested they dont care, or bother to ask why no one is held accountable. Keep blaming the wealthy though, your leaders command it.

reply to post by tothetenthpower


See HauntWok's post above ^^

He hit the nail on the head. That's exactly what Reaganomics was all about - trickle down.
My post above PROVES that Corporations stopped playing that game Tenth.

Further, what more incentives could we offer them? What if they continually take our "Incentives" - then renig on them? So we concede again? Offer even more incentives?
What happens when all of our 'incentives' are gone?

No - Incentives aren't the answer either.
And I understand the Canadian model. My wife's Canadian I'm not suggesting a flat increase, I'm suggesting passing a law that sets a Margin or Formula based on success / production.
You work for a corporation that produces well (in turn raking in profits) then those employees should be compensated fairly in proportion to their productivity.

reply to post by peck420
I believe it is the Government then Walmart and then Kelly services(top 3 employers). Like I always say I believe in helping the poor but not the lazy. But then again it doesn't really matter when you can print money of your own free will, backed by nothing.Hell why don't they just print us all a couple million a piece and call it good.

Originally posted by beezzer

Originally posted by HauntWok
reply to post by ElectricUniverse

 

That is a misnomer, as many of those people who are receiving food stamps are actually employed full time. They just are at menial minimum wage jobs and their paycheck doesn't even come close to the cost of living in the US. And employers are all too happy to just replace anyone that asks for a raise with one of the stacks of applicants they receive everyday.

Course bretbart (the king of misleading information) isn't going to say that.

Interesting spin.

So it is the fault of business for not paying people more; that there are so many on food stamps.

Your response would be for the government to step in and raise minimum wage?

edit on 10-7-2013 by beezzer because: (no reason given)

well if you want to involve the government.. the government should set a maximum wage. maybe then more will be invested into bringing the customer a better service or product.... since you have a max wage cap and whatever exceeds the cap needs to go back into the business.

I am tired of year after year watching our infrastructure rot, and the work force being streamlined to bare bones. .. not to mention the cuts to benefits and wages....

meanwhile execs and ceos are getting massive bonuses and raises.

people get fired and the ceo buys some property.. wonder where the money came from.

You know, I have to tell you from experience that as a food stamp recipient who works full time at minimum wage, it is extremely difficult at times to keep the lights on and pay all my bills when they become due, AND my old lady works as well, and we are raising a child. We have to make sacrifices often in the form of "what are we gonna not pay this month" to keep on living (and living poorly) on the outskirts of Eugene Oregon. We aren't swimming in "living wage" jobs around here unless your a computer guy or something out here. Just about everyone I know has stamps or has two jobs around my neck of the woods and that's just how it is. You know they say "youre wasting tax money" or something like it and than in the same sentence say "If you want a better job you need to go to school." So you want me to go to school and go through sally mae's tax money instead of the food programs. Every graduate I know is in debt to their eyeballs for the next twenty years because of college. I think the answer lies in better paying jobs myself.

Originally posted by Tarzan the apeman.
[They] can print money of their own free will, backed by nothing. Hell why don't they just print us all a couple million a piece and call it good.

I don't know what's more sad.....the fact that it would work or the fact that it wouldn't make any difference anyway. The game is rigged and you're on the losing team. Welcome to Vegas baby.

It's a brave new people, don't look to America if you want a good life. It's a good place to live, but don't depend on this country for your bread and butter. Unless that's ALL you want.

if corporations paid better,

PEOPLE WOULDNT NEED THE GOV TO BUY FOOD!

3 out of 4 on foodstamps have jobs!

Conservatives/TEA Party people have been brainwashed by FOX News to believe that if they kiss enough rich people booty, then somehow, some way, the rich people will bestow blessings and generosity upon them that serve them faithfully.

It's just not the case. Rich people didn't get to be rich by giving away money. They got rich by taking advantage of poorer people whenever possible.

Now, they have you fighting other poor people for them. They already have powerful lobby groups buying your elected officials, even to the point they turned corporations into people.

You know what would make these guys pay more and hire more people? Raising taxes to 90%. They would still have the desire to make money, that's not going to go away no matter how much you tax them. They still are going to want to make money. Raising taxes to 90% is just going to force them to do MORE BUSINESS to make up for their supposed losses.

Yes, some businesses would close, and guess what? Other businesses would take their place. And people would get jobs because the corporations would have to do so much more business just to try and get back to that level they are now.

reply to post by HauntWok


I agree with you 100%, the trickle down the ladder (Reganonmics) only help get the corporate power stronger and the elite behind richer while the hard working class keep losing as usual.

No wonder is more working class poor in need of government assistance this day than in any other time in history.

Originally posted by Cheesefleas


Clearly it's a problem that there are so many people who are not working, but I do not think the solution is cutting off people who are unemployed and cannot find work. Do you think havin half the country hungry or homeless is a good way to quell a collapse??? Now I am not for people who abuse the system and I am also not for people who use the abuse as a rhetorical tool either.

It is not the job of the Govt to provide for people.
I work to provide for MY family and myself, not for others.
Maybe MORE people doing the same, instead of looking for handouts from the Govt would put the US back in a better place.

Originally posted by Cheesefleas

My problem is turning my back on my fellow Americans who are out if work, period. I think it is idiotic to think you can solve economic problems by supporting mass destitution as a solution.

Then by all means, go ahead and work to support them.
And why are they out of work???? Hmmm. Seems that businesses aren't really hiring because of what the Govt is doing to business.
So, let's get this straight.
Business creates jobs.
Govt restricts business
Govt taxes business
Business lets people go
People depend on Govt
Govt further restricts business
Govt further taxes business
Business lets more people go
More people depend on Govt

Funny how those things seem to work out.

Originally posted by Cheesefleas

You are applying your own callous mentality to that, I support such policies and it is out if compassion. You cannot tell me where the hundred million people will go, because you don't care, this is why makes your position extreme and sociopathic.

Oh, because I don't enjoy theft of my earnings like you enjoy theft of my earnings?? How very obtuse of you.

Originally posted by Cheesefleas

Wrong, I think drug test are completely fair. As long as they are trying to work, they are fed and not on the streets.

How very uncompassionate you are of the downtrodden.

reply to post by DiscreteParticle


Oh good hell. The Corporations are working within the confines of the law. The same law instituted by the Govt. he same Gov that people here seem to gush over, because 0bama is in office.

Meh I say to you.

reply to post by macman


Congress has passed tax breaks after tax breaks after tax breaks for companies to spur economic growth, they have shot interest rates to 0% for YEARS to spur economic growth.


www.cbpp.org...

What have corporations done in response? Give CEO's millions in bonuses for a job well done. Instead of investing back in their business and hiring more people and creating more jobs, and doing more business, they are instead downsizing companies, making employees do more work for the same or less money and keeping the profits for themselves.

How can you sit there and tell us that companies are doing the right thing and that the government is keeping them back with too many regulations?

How can you turn a blind eye to your fellow countrymen and defend corporations moving manufacturing and other jobs overseas?

It's WE the People, not YOU the Person. The problem with worshiping the Oligarchs is that they don't really care about you unless you are making them a profit.

reply to post by HauntWok


Yes, the monster Corporations, like GE, Apple and such are benefiting just fine from these tax breaks. And funny thing is, who does this companies support most???? Dems.

Now, take my company for instance. I am bogged down with such ridiculous regulations, a 10% excise tax, 0bamacare should I hire someone and numerous other moronic requirements. I will never hire anyone full time. It will cost too much. I will either contract the work out, or maybe hire part-time. Say thanks to the wonderful Govt for that.

I never, not once stated that I backed what the Republicans are doing, so you best stow that crap right now.

Now, if a company wants to move offshore, that is their right. If they want to pay their CEO a bazillion dollars, that is their right. I don't go through life thinking I get to say what a company does in that respect. YOU do!!
Businesses and Companies are created to make money for the owner(s), not to provide jobs.

reply to post by macman


Have you thought about doing more business? Instead of begging the government for handouts via tax breaks and small business grants?

That's the problem business owners don't want to actually do business. They just want a free ride. And don't give me that garbage about you paying for your employees health care coverage, we all know that business owners are just going to deduct those costs out of their employees paychecks and cut their wages to cover any additional costs.

Businesses aren't doing BUSINESS anymore, they are just trying to skate by.

Maybe, if all these poor impoverished business owners actually made an investment in this economy by hiring two people full time at decent salaries we would see something happen within a year, more business for companies, less deficits due to increased tax revenue, and more competition as more people would be able to afford products and services from American companies.

But no, support sending jobs overseas, support companies offshoring income to avoid paying taxes, support businesses hiring part time people at slave wages so that they can pocket more money for themselves and screw over America and push it further down the line to being a 3rd world nation.

I worked for a small business owner who ran a restaurant, he had a business philosophy that if you paid your employees well, took care of them, and streamlined your menu, you would succeed. He did just that. We had a two page menu, everyone was paid well, the waitstaff was paid minimum wage plus their tips, I was paid $15 an hour, plus everyone got an end of the season bonus of over $1000 and in January we got $1000 in an IRA.

Due to his business model, the employees were much more productive, the business flourished (we were happy to work there, we worked hard and made sure that everything was done excellently and we never got a mark off on any health inspection, and the owner cleared over a million dollars a year in profit. He retired after 20 years with this business model citing that now his money could work for him.

But that's not how it's done anymore. Now the philosophy is screw the employees as much as possible while the business owner pockets as much as he can while working the employees to death.

The only reason that employers want to deregulate everything isn't so they can do more business without the government's boot on their neck, it's so they can further enslave their workforce, with longer hours, worse working conditions, no hope for raises or advancement, and the ability to fire long term employees with impunity for no reason and without having to pay that dreaded unemployment. Paving the way to hire new employees at even worse wages, working under worse conditions, without any recourse when the employer abuses their position.

Yea, maybe the current business model for employers isn't working out well for anyone. And it won't work in the long run. Looking to government for your solutions instead of investing in this economy is just going to lead to a worse and worse economy with no hope for recovery..

reply to post by HauntWok


Wait, at what point did you read me state I was looking for a handout from Govt??
You truly got a lot of balls to accuse me of this, since I have never once stated that is what I want, or need.
I am sure you working on the Progressive mentality that the money earned is not really mine, and it belongs to the Govt in the form of taxes.
Lets get one thing straight here. Taxes are theft anywhere else in life, except when it comes to Govt.
My company does not receive welfare, handouts, foodstamps, housing assistance or anything else. Nor does it use the public roads or services anymore then anyone else. So.....why is MY company required to pay MORE??? Because the Govt is greedy, has promised free crap to people to continue to get elected. All at the expense of me the tax payer.

I do love your statement that I should just do more business. Now that is funny. Geez, I never thought of that. It is just so simple. I shall click my heels together, wiggle my nose and rub the all magical lamp to get those things going.

Just like the Govt....People with no clue as to how a business runs telling those that do it, how to do it.

reply to post by macman

I am sure you working on the Progressive mentality that the money earned is not really mine, and it belongs to the Govt in the form of taxes.

Actually I'm working on the mentality that paying your employees enough so that they don't have to get food stamps and other government assistance will help the economy.

Not exactly you per se (Cause honestly I don't know how well or poorly you treat anyone employed by you) But if companies with employees actually paid them a living wage, a lot of problems with the deficit and taxes would ease up.

But hey, why not just hire part time employees, and replace them every 5 months 29 days so that they don't qualify for unemployment insurance and you can keep hiring people for less and less and less. See how well that works out of the economy.