Amnesty International weighs in on Snowden

reply to post by FlyersFan


So it is a martyr you wanted because if he had stuck around that is what he would have become.

Originally posted by crazyewok
George washington was a American and a British officer. He saw how bad the goverment was and turned on it basicaly tossing his british citizenship away and alinging with the french. Is he a evil traitor?

He was a traitor to England. He was a patriot to America.
So you are saying that Snowden is a patriot to China and a traitor to America?
By comparing Snowden and Washington, that is exactly what you are saying.

I have acknowledged that my thoughts on this case are speculation. However, I've not said or speculated anything about what he has with him.

reply to post by Heliophant


That's the thing, no-one knows what secrets he had uploaded to his drives, now in Russian hands.

Originally posted by Todzer
So it is a martyr you wanted because if he had stuck around that is what he would have become.

How, exactly, would he have been a martyr if he left the country and at the same time didn't
tell China or Russia state secrets that weakened the USA? Explain that to me.
He could have done that. But he didn't.

Originally posted by Tykonos
That's the thing, no-one knows what secrets he had uploaded to his drives,

Agreed!

now in Russian hands.

Speculation.

Originally posted by Heliophant
As far as we know, he has no information on human assests in the field.

Snowden has information on field assets. He has spilled the beans on a lot of classified information. Just the fact that we have that information could easily be enough to tell the Chinese and Russians indirectly how we got it. And the fact that Snowden is blabbing and blabbing without restraint tells us that he easily could have directly told state secrets. He feels no compunction to keep quiet.

We're just debating the issue.

So far .. it's all good.

Originally posted by FlyersFan

Originally posted by crazyewok
George washington was a American and a British officer. He saw how bad the goverment was and turned on it basicaly tossing his british citizenship away and alinging with the french. Is he a evil traitor?

He was a traitor to England. He was a patriot to America.
So you are saying that Snowden is a patriot to China and a traitor to America?
By comparing Snowden and Washington, that is exactly what you are saying.

Im saying if you want to get ride of your biggest enemy (your goverment) you may need help of lesser enemys and thats a choice and risk your forefathers had to make.

Yes france helped but only to weaken britain/america so it could gain more power.
Like if china or russia were to help.

Originally posted by FlyersFan
How, exactly, would he have been a martyr if he left the country and at the same time didn't
tell China or Russia state secrets that weakened the USA?

More speculation. We don't know that he gave anything to those governments. So far, all indication is that he is only talking to the press.

Again, you might be right! But you can't state that as fact.

We're just debating the issue.

So far .. it's all good.

Thanks for noting that! Agreed, healthy debate to this point.

Originally posted by cartenz
The rhetoric from those supporting the status quo is abhorrent. Shame on you; Is that the world you want future generations to inherit?

Shame on YOU. Where exactly do you see people supporting 'the status quo'?? No where.
I think people here have been very clear ...

- Most all of us support that Snowden told the American people about the NSA spying on them.
- A few of us have stated that we do not support that Snowden went further and told China and Russia our national security secrets and is threatening to tell many more.

Originally posted by cartenz
reply to post by Tykonos

 

No it isn't. If you had no problem with what he did they you would accept that he had to flee for his own safety. You mask your intent with what ifs, in the hope to divide those on the fence from those who are awake to the lies.

By saying you are against him seeking shelter in a foreign nation, you are effectively stating that you wish death upon him, and for the whole matter to conveniently disappear. Yeah, your agenda is obvious.

My agenda?

My point is very straight forward. Yes, he was right and rightly so should be commended for blowing the whistle.

Yes he indeed had to flee or go into hiding for his own safety!

His own actions took him to HK aka (China) and is now in Russia. It doesn't sit well with me that an American citizen hands over State secrets to an adversary. (OR Brit)

reply to post by FlyersFan


Do you think that the nsa are beyond making him disappear for throwing spanner in the works for them? He could have gone to another country but been extradited back straight away or had an "accident" . He had to have some way to guarantee his safety and being in America ain't one of them. The only unpatriotic ones here are the ones spying on their own countrymen.

Originally posted by Wrabbit2000
I can only watch his actions....and they aren't those of a whistle blower at this point. .

Exactly. He is no longer the hero whistle blower. Now he's just dumping national security secrets to China and Russia .. who are lapping it up. China and Russia want a weak America. Looks like Snowden must also, otherwise he wouldn't be blabbing to them. He started out in hero status for me ... but now he's just a liability.

Originally posted by FlyersFan
- A few of us have stated that we do not support that Snowden went further and told China and Russia our national security secrets and is threatening to tell many more.

This point is my continuing gripe: It's speculation! We don't know that he's told anything to any other government. So far, everything that we know Snowden has said has been to the Press.

Originally posted by resoe26
He did tell the American people about the NSA spying..........
and of COURSE he would flee the country..

But he didn't have to blab national defense state secrets to China and Russia.
He did that because he wanted to. Or because he's been working for China all along.
Either way ... he went too far and has damaged the security of this country and our safety.

Originally posted by FlyersFan




- Most all of us support that Snowden told the American people about the NSA spying on them.
- A few of us have stated that we do not support that Snowden went further and told China and Russia our national security secrets and is threatening to tell many more.

Can you please explain, all the national security secrets he has told them? I keep seeing you use those 3 words, and am curious as to how we are in danger. Is it hacking? Computer coding can be changed quite quickly you know. 0's and 1's. Thats it.............................

Originally posted by FlyersFan
But he didn't have to blab national defense state secrets to China and Russia.

...Speculation. Is there any proof that he has met with anyone from one of these governments AND that he told them anything?

This point is my continuing gripe: It's speculation! We don't know that he's told anything to any other government. So far, everything that we know Snowden has said has been to the Press.

reply to post by Heliophant



Can you honestly see Russia not attempting to access those files? Seriously?

China and Russia aren't going to help America.
They will do everything they can to weaken America.

Good. I have been waiting my whole life to see the evil empire burn like Rome. My only hope is that none of its worst elements are allowed to survive the inferno.

The world has held their breath too long, hoping that the collectively cognitive impaired state known as Umerrka matures to be a competent world citizen--you have had your chance; Its time to take that lame horse to the glue factory.

I mean that in the most contemptuous way.

Originally posted by FlyersFan

Originally posted by resoe26
He did tell the American people about the NSA spying..........
and of COURSE he would flee the country..

But he didn't have to blab national defense state secrets to China and Russia.
He did that because he wanted to. Or because he's been working for China all along.
Either way ... he went too far and has damaged the security of this country and our safety.

Where is your source for your claim that he told China or Russia anything that would benefit them??
-And how did he damage our security??
We have GUNS yo....
And I know damn well that the majority of American people are gangster enough to fight on our soil with any other country that wants a ass kicking.

---"They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety. "
Franklin.

reply to post by Todzer

His actions state that he is not a patriot. His actions of handing secrets over to China and Russia state that he does not have Americas interests at heart but instead his own.

Ever see the movie that the South Park people put out ... Team America? (good movie!)
The Americans come swooping in to kill one bad guy .. but end up totally destroying a city.
They say 'yahoo, we got the bad guy!' .... but look at the damage done .

Snowden is starting to look like that to me.
He helped slay the big NSA Spying on Americans bad guy.
But in the process, he's giving away national security secrets to enemies.