Edward Snowden: the whistleblower behind revelations of NSA surveillance

Originally posted by Indigo5
reply to post by beezzer

 

It just occured to me...FB, Google, Apple etc. have issued hedged and vague public statements as to if/how thye have given government access to thier servers etc.

Has anyone asked ATS and SO to make a statement to members as to whether or not they volountarily share thier membership data etc.?

edit on 10-6-2013 by Indigo5 because: (no reason given)

Would it be through the servers on ATS?

Or say, if you had Comcast as your ISP, their doings?

Originally posted by supremecommander
A hero doesn't abide by the laws of tyrants and criminals.

That's great when you are trying to sell a bumper sticker or a shirt but doesn't change the facts any.

He is a hero that broke the law.

reply to post by beanandginger


star for that statement
we need whistleblowers.
its obvious that governments are distrustful of the people they govern, if it were not for whistleblowers we would have no idea the extent to which govt. goes in its unconstitutional actions, not the we do now but at least we have a chance....

unfortunately, until governments decide to be forthcoming in thier actions people will distrust them, and the cycle continues...

Originally posted by opethPA

Originally posted by supremecommander
A hero doesn't abide by the laws of tyrants and criminals.

That's great when you are trying to sell a bumper sticker or a shirt but doesn't change the facts any.

He is a hero that broke the law.

And? Do you want him punished for telling you that you are viewed by the people in power as an enemy?

That's fine and good. Cling to the government all you want. They won't be there for you in the end.

Originally posted by opethPA

He is a hero that broke the law.

A law that was protecting treason.

Originally posted by beezzer

Originally posted by KyrieEleison
reply to post by beezzer

 

That's right, beez!

That is the bigger picture.

I've said it before in this thread, Snowden has only confirmed what Obama admitted to last week.

The whole lot of pols in DC are dirty. Any politician that still backs the Patriot Act after this (R or D) is liable for treason in my book.

Originally posted by beezzer

Originally posted by Indigo5
reply to post by beezzer

 

It just occured to me...FB, Google, Apple etc. have issued hedged and vague public statements as to if/how thye have given government access to thier servers etc.

Has anyone asked ATS and SO to make a statement to members as to whether or not they volountarily share thier membership data etc.?

edit on 10-6-2013 by Indigo5 because: (no reason given)

Would it be through the servers on ATS?

Or say, if you had Comcast as your ISP, their doings?

Not sure. I think a "comcast" would show traffic and views...the pipe to ATS, but I think they would need ATS Servers to decode/identify specific logged on posters and who-is-who via registered email addys to screen-names? Without being able identify posters the "comcast"/ISP traffick would be less useful and larger/non-specific and show maybe jsut a website "visit".

Not sure though...An opinion from an IT expert wwould help.

reply to post by crazyewok


Yep!

Back on page 12 I knew the "law" argument was going to keep surfacing.

Originally posted by Indigo5
Has anyone asked ATS and SO to make a statement to members as to whether or not they volountarily share thier membership data etc.?

We don't. ATS Privacy Policy.

Click here for more information.

Originally posted by supremecommander
And? Do you want him punished for telling you that you are viewed by the people in power as an enemy?

That's fine and good. Cling to the government all you want. They won't be there for you in the end.

Actually yes..Equal treatment for everyone is something we should all strive for.

If I would have broken my NDA when I was in that industry I would have been arrested and lost my job.
In my current industry if I do that I would lose my job and possibly be arrested depending on what was talked about.
If I do that before a contract is signed that contract can be thrown out.

It has nothing to do with clinging to the govt but solely deals with the the fact that i think Snowden is a hero that broke the law. Please tell me which of those two things is false.

Originally posted by opethPA

Originally posted by supremecommander
And? Do you want him punished for telling you that you are viewed by the people in power as an enemy?

That's fine and good. Cling to the government all you want. They won't be there for you in the end.

Actually yes..Equal treatment for everyone is something we should all strive for.

If I would have broken my NDA when I was in that industry I would have been arrested and lost my job.
In my current industry if I do that I would lose my job and possibly be arrested depending on what was talked about.
If I do that before a contract is signed that contract can be thrown out.

It has nothing to do with clinging to the govt but solely deals with the the fact that i think Snowden is a hero that broke the law. Please tell me which of those two things is false.

edit on 10-6-2013 by opethPA because: (no reason given)

But was your job breaking the the law in a major way?

If not then no you should keep by your NDA .


But if ask to break the law especialy if its in such a serouis way such as treason then no the NDA is void as the people that made you sign it should not be asking you to break the law!

reply to post by opethPA


An NDA should never silence an individual who is reporting a crime.

Apparently our current administration and their ilk disagree.

What's right is right, right?

Originally posted by intrepid

Originally posted by Indigo5
Has anyone asked ATS and SO to make a statement to members as to whether or not they volountarily share thier membership data etc.?

We don't. ATS Privacy Policy.

Thanks Intrepid. Not to go all legalese and parse statements, but....

A FISA warrant has as one of it's components a requirement that providers of info. don't disclose that they are providing the information.

So if a FISA warrant is in place they (Apple, Googlge etc) can not tell the public or they break the law.

But...if no warrant is in place, they can say...no warrant is in place. Cuz they are under no such restriction.

So let me ask this specific question. Does ATS have any "Active" warrants in place (not specific to past investigations)...that would allow the government "ongoing" access to membership information.

Apologies for the paranoia, but Apple, Google, FB etc. really did some fancy footwork with thier public statements and I just want to be clear.

I am pretty sure this deserves to become a thread discussion of it's own. Not that I'm posting anything of great detail or research. It's just what my conclusion is regarding this event.

To me it's pretty clear there is a massive war taking place within the hallways of our government All along my thoughts were that because of his age and other circumstances, things weren't adding up. How did he get such high clearance at a young age and with no higher education degree? Not recounting all of the career moves he had, but they all see to be very disconnected.

I do believe Snowden is real and that he acted in good conscience. However a few factors I observed, have me believing he didn't act alone here. His demeanor in that video is just too cool for a guy in his position. I know. I went through something similar in my life, but not with the dire consequences he's facing. Now if he was operating with the understanding that he's protected by some entity or agency, well then that could explain things a bit more.

Let's look at who this hurts the most. Obama? His administration all the way from Holder to Napolitano? Does this put a damper on things for them? After all, the NSA falls under his purview. He just named Rice as his advisor for this agency. She's a good soldier. Who better than to get inside and find out what's going down and take the necessary steps to seal things up? Her appointment was rather oddly timed and now in retrospect, it makes more sense.

Look further back now to how many DoD personnel have been effected by this administration. Heck it's already been discussed that Petraeous was probably outed by the use of this system. Look at all of the high level commanders that have been relieved and or "retired." So I postulate here, that this is a sever internal war for control. Not sure there are any good guys here. Probably mostly bad, but these are my thought on this and why it occurred the way it did and when it did.

Something serious is going down inside the halls of the federal government and there are an unusual number of whistleblowers coming forward. I'm sure this angle needs more research and attention than I'm giving it.

Originally posted by KyrieEleison
reply to post by opethPA

 

An NDA should never silence an individual who is reporting a crime.

Apparently our current administration and their ilk disagree.

What's right is right, right?

Except when you get your clearance be it Secret or above you sign on for certain things. Depending on how compartmentalized it is that could include statements like "the unauthorized release of said information can and will be viewed as a federal crime"

Again , as I have said all along I believe he is a hero that broke the law. people can disagree with that all they want, they can tell me I am clinging to the Govt , they can whip themselves up and disperse mob justice on the DoD and it doesn't change either of the two things I said about Snowden.

reply to post by RadicalRebel


This is just the tip of the iceburg. It's a given that we're all being tracked and monitored in every conceivable way every conceivable minute of the day 24/7. But all of you folks out there need to please CONNECT THE DOTS.

The recent IRS activity PROVES that government is not just willing simple to monitor information for potential threats, but instead they are WILLING to USE INFORMATION AS A WEAPON AGAINST THE PEOPLE. And whats worse is - THEY THINK THEY ARE UNTOUCHABLE.

We have crossed a new line - a desperate line. The power and abusiveness of our government is growing exponentially and it is dangerously close to a critical mass were it will overwelm us. We need a game changing event that will swing this thing back in our direction. I'm not talking about the Administration or liberal / conservative or Democrat / Republican. I'm talking about the survival of an ideal that was most perfectly framed in the US Constitution that says all are created equal, that all are free and that all rights are granted not by government but are inalienable - inherant in all at birth. We haven't always lived that idea perfectly as a nation but that doesn't mean the ideal was wrong - just that we need to aspire to it.

I REPEAT ----- TIP OF THE ICEBURG!

Originally posted by Bilk22
How did he get such high clearance at a young age and with no higher education degree? Not recounting all of the career moves he had, but they all see to be very disconnected.

Everything else in your post is good except this quote , i personally know two sharp smart IT guys who dont have higher education degree.

Originally posted by opethPA


He is a hero that broke the law.

And our legal system affords recognition of both.

He needs to be charged and he needs to be pardoned and granted immunity from prosecution.

It seems ridiculous to me that the government grants whistle-blower protections to employees that identify theft, corruption or waste within government, but when someone out's an entire agency actively circumventing the Constituion of the United States of America...eff that guy??

Originally posted by xavi1000

Originally posted by Bilk22
How did he get such high clearance at a young age and with no higher education degree? Not recounting all of the career moves he had, but they all see to be very disconnected.

Everything else in your post is good except this quote , i personally know two sharp smart IT guys who dont have higher education degree.

Agreed, the idea that a higher education degree is a requirement to move forward in your chosen career field went out the door many, many years ago.