At the hospital, dieing family member, are we really doing the right thing?

I'm at the hospital typing this while my grandmother is sleeping across the room from me. So I've been observing this process for a few months now and I've watched my grandmother go from fairly happy to miserable in the course of a few weeks. So they are keeping her alive and I probably know her better then anybody. She pretty much raised me. I can see it in her face and her actions that she wants to go. I can't stand seeing her like this. Drives me crazy and I'm on the fence here. They are constantly putting needles in her, she has a catheter in, and just going back and forth between the ER, operations everything.

I believe in a higher form of existence, a heaven lets it. So I think she should be aloud to move on and it's not easy for me to say this. I love her more then anything in this universe. Is this really better then letting nature take its course? Is this all we have to offer?

Interested in hearing your experiences.

Oh I put this in social issues for what may be obvious reasons.

My mum goes to a spiritualist church and since my dad died she's had several messages from him and some do say that he's happier now that he's not in 24x7 pain, its a fine balance between keeping someone on this plane of existence when they need to still be here and the time you know they are ready for whats beyond

The main question you need to ask yourself is would i do the same thing to myself if i was in the same position and savour the time you get with them as it'll go so soon

reply to post by Maxatoria


That's a tough question to answer. I strongly believe in an afterlife. So part of me says it's ok. I know for certain she is old school Roman Catholic and believe in heaven. So I don't know but watching her be miserable and suffer isn't easy either.

I have also been in your situation on 3 occasions in my life. On each occasion I feel the time spent keeping them alive was disrespectful and I witnessed the dignity being drained from 2 of those who eventually died during the process.

We are encouraged to let our old faithful canine friends go when the time comes and just last week I lost a dog to old age. She went to the bottom of the garden, well away from us, lay down and passed away. It was dignified, peaceful and felt very natural.

I think we know when the time is right to go, just as in the animal world. I cant imagine how frustrating it would be if a family member knew their time was right but had to suffer a prolonged death due to doctors, operations, chemicals and drugs.

I feel for you in this your time of trouble.

Respects

My father loved to camp, hunt and fish, fix things, and drink coffee with friends and relatives. Very outdoors kind of person. He got brain Cancer and they took out a big chunk of his brain. He lived, but he only survived being doped up for the next nine months...a silly smile on his face and a feeling of shame in his eyes because he knew he was not right. I think that was nine months of hell. I would have rather died myself. Can't communicate and stuck in bed or a wheelchair all the time, using a bedpan constantly and relying on others to take care of you. The doctors did not do this man a favor.

Maybe someone who has lost their mind to alzheimer disease should be allowed to stay in their home, maybe they will fall and die the way that we used to. Nobody is going to get me into a nursing home if something happens later on. I do not want to be a burden on my family or society. The medical field and nursing homes are playing us. I do not want everything I worked my life for going to a nursing home, I want it to go to my kids so they can have a little less stress in their lives.

I feel for you onequestion. In January, my wife and I were faced with the fact that her father would not be long for this world. We watched as he endured treatments for his desease, and it was hard to see. He knew he was no going to live much longer. In one of my last conversations with him, he explained that he was tired and was ready for nature to take its course. He was not afraid, but was ready. After being constantly in pain, woken in the middle of the night for labs and more meds, he had enough. He was fortunately able to still communicate his final wish to go into hospice. He was a tough guy, a cop for 26 years, and greatly loved his grandkids. When he was moved to hospice, and was made comfortable, the man I knew returned. It was this comfort which helped all of us. It was his choice to go to hospice. It was for the better. He lasted several days, but they were quality days. In the early morning of January 8th, he slipped into enternity, calm and peaceful, without pain. We sorely miss him, life has not been the same without him. But, he passed in comfort with dignity.

It is a heartbreaking descision, but one must ask oneself, "What would I want if I was in their shoes?" I firmly believe in live after death. I look forward to see all of my love ones when my time comes. I wish both you and your grandmother peace.

What have her doctors said? Is there any remote chance that she can make at least a partial recovery? Is there nothing else that can be done?

If she's just asleep with needles and tubes coming out of her, then I think the decision of letting nature take its course would be the most reasonable choice at this stage. In my opinion I wouldn't see the point of keeping me alive in a comatose state.

I think you and your family should let her go with dignity.

reply to post by muse7


They just put a pacemaker in and she literally got 10x worse when they did. I have been hitting them with serious questions about why with no answer. I plan on having an answer soon or raising hell. She has alheizmers and when i see her she is barely ever awake.

reply to post by onequestion


I had a similar experience with my grandmother four years ago. It was particularly difficult because she was the only grandparent I had ever known. Grandma was almost 96 years old. Her major health problems included life-long hypertension. Towards the later years her blood pressure would occasionally become uncontrolled, this led to several small, but re-occuring strokes. In her later years grandma's hearing had decreased to the point where, despite her hearing aids, it was difficult to communicate with her. She also suffered from chronic urinary tract infections.

Well, the short story is she developed a pretty severe UTI and double lung pneumonia. Ultimately, she became septic from the multiple infections. She was in pretty bad shape. Being a nurse I gave my mother and uncle some recommendations. We agreed to give her one night in the ICU then re-evaluate the next day. She didn't do too well that night and failed to make a marked improvement. As difficult as it was, I recommended we begin comfort care, get her on a morphine drip to make and keep her comfortable. I knew the aggressive treatment for sepsis and septic shock would ultimately kill her, so the best treatment was to keep her pain free and comfortable. She spent Tuesday night in the ICU, was placed on the morphine drip on Wednesday, and passed away around noon on Saturday. She did not want heroic treatments to keep her alive. In addition to keeping her pain free and comfortable, were obeyed her wishes, which was important to her and all of us.

Listen closely, this part is most important for you. Do your best to honor her wishes. As long as you do that, any decisions you make should reflect this. However you decide to treat her, no matter the end result, as long as you keep her comfortable and obey her wishes, you'll have the most optimal outcome. You need to remember that some treatments, depending on how aggressive, can be just as harmful as the disease. If you want to know anything, or have specific questions please don't be afraid to message me. God bless and good luck!

-Cosmic

reply to post by Cosmic911

Listen closely, this part is most important for you. Do your best to honor her wishes. As long as you do that, any decisions you make should reflect this. However you decide to treat her, no matter the end result, as long as you keep her comfortable and obey her wishes, you'll have the most optimal outcome. You need to remember that some treatments, depending on how aggressive, can be just as harmful as the disease. If you want to know anything, or have specific questions please don't be afraid to message me. God bless and good luck!

I agree with you. Thats good thing to keep in the back of my mind.

Do you think that doctors often push procedures for financial gain, such as, her getting the pace maker was suggested by the doc to make money?

reply to post by onequestion


I have no answers and I am sorry you both have to go through this.

I am sorry she suffers. I haven't had to face this like you have. Watching and being with a few pets as they died was hard enough.

Not saying this for any reason other than I do believe in the power of prayer. I will pray for her right now.

Peace.

reply to post by onequestion


I have no doubt that does occur in the healthcare industry. However, what I believe may have happened in your case is that doctors are taught to "fix things." When a patient dies, many times the physician looks at that as a failure. Surgeons experience these feelings much more than other doctors. Surgeons are taught to cut to heal; to remove whatever it is making the person sick. In medical school, physician-instructors never learn how to let patients die, how to say goodbye to them, to treat them and their family with respect, while at the same time letting them die. Nurses do a much better job at this.

I'm so sorry your Grandmother is suffering. It is clear how much you love her and wish her the best. I can only offer my prayers for you both. Much love to you sweetie.

reply to post by onequestion

Is this really better then letting nature take its course? Is this all we have to offer?

Sorry, you're going through this, Onequestion. Before the onset of Alzheimers did your grandmother ever voice her concerns? I've made it quite well known that I do not want to be kept alive or resuscitated if I am no longer able to make my own decisions (living will, word of mouth, emails...). Have you looked around your grandmother's place for a living will?

When we are prolonging a miserable life, with no hope of returning to a functioning brain, we need to stop everything beyond just comfort care.

Pacemaker placement in a terminal Alzheimers patient should not have been allowed by whoever has POA. IMO.

reply to post by MuzzleBreak


Thats a good point. I want to look into that more.