Korea : First Strike Capability with Conventional Weapons

I'm pretty sure SK would be able to get a lot of aircraft up once the NK aircraft takes off. The real crux would be if the NK artillery took out the SK runways before the NK air force takes off.

Of course, there are other nearby bases the US can use for aircraft, in addition to a carrier also. (and some of that aircraft will catch the NK planes before they get home)

The bottom line is that NK could really do some damage in an opening salvo if they really chose to do so, and even had an ounce of tactical sense. Of course, the upside is that doing so would pretty much guarantee the demise of the regime, so pretty costly to deliver that bloody nose. I'm not sure Kim is willing to pay that cost.

reply to post by Gazrok


It depends on his thinking.

Lets start with an example. Two Artillery units opposing each other. If NK opens fire first they will likely get in al least two rounds before SK respond. In that scenario NK wins because in all likelihood they have destroyed the SK battery in the opening salvo.

Who fires first with 21,000 artillery guns has a massive advantage.

Now, the US is thundering around the world causing regime change whenever and wherever they want to. They have already told NK they are next! (Axis of evil, war games etc)

If you know they are coming and coming soon would you fire first! They are coming anyway so if the war has to be fought then fight it to your advantage.

IF NK sees it this way, and they well might, then what other option is there. For them, surrender is not an option. Trying to hit the leader and the General staff will be impossible. They will be in impenetrable and very secret bunkers.

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reply to post by pheonix358

They will be in impenetrable and very secret bunkers.

We can use a lot of satellite imaging to see where the tunnels and bunkers are, and we have a lot of new tools that can see even that deep (oddly enough, mostly from the petroleum industry). Also, we have new 30,000lb bunker busters (MOPs) that can go down 41m, a couple of those will reach even the deepest bunkers. They will not be impossible to find and kill, just expensive.

you guys seriously overestimate NK and seriously underestimate the US and its response time..

So what they have 8 million troops in reserve, I mean what are they gonna do swim here? Because any boat or plane or missle that leaves NK is getting blown up

I seriously doubt we would put boots on the ground without a relentless bombing campaign and it's not like we dont know where all there military installations are, and Im sure we allready know where all those bunkers you guys keep talking about are..

Hell we know when they are just moving one missle to their coast, we knew the second they raised it into firing position and the second they put it back down,

We know what they are doing as they are doing it lmao

Sure they might get a couple shots off at SK and people will probably die if they do, but that would be the end of kIimmy

reply to post by goou111


It isn't that they pose a threat to us here in the mainland of USA....but they do pose a great threat to our allies in the region. Should they commence with a full on assault of SK and Japan, thousands will die, and it would greatly hamper our ability to deliver the counter blow. Hamper, but not prevent. We'd still destroy the regime and their ability to make war, but make no mistake, it would be at a pretty high cost in civilian lives...in SK and in Japan.

reply to post by pheonix358

what other option is there.

Compliance with the UN, food for his people, and eventually getting to be part of the world community.

or

Exile in China, after another puppet is installed as a replacement.

Originally posted by Gazrok
reply to post by pheonix358

 

what other option is there.

Compliance with the UN, food for his people, and eventually getting to be part of the world community.

or

Exile in China, after another puppet is installed as a replacement.

I agree just stop trying to develop nukes and he would not have those sanctions.

Originally posted by pheonix358
reply to post by Gazrok

 

It depends on his thinking.

Lets start with an example. Two Artillery units opposing each other. If NK opens fire first they will likely get in al least two rounds before SK respond. In that scenario NK wins because in all likelihood they have destroyed the SK battery in the opening salvo.

Who fires first with 21,000 artillery guns has a massive advantage.

Now, the US is thundering around the world causing regime change whenever and wherever they want to. They have already told NK they are next! (Axis of evil, war games etc)

Fortunately, military are for professionals, highly trained in all aspects of war, and not for the ordinary joes who can pull a trigger will call himself a warrior.

If two artillery units are opposing each other as in your example, it is NOT whomever fires first that will gain an advantage.

Rather, it is WHO knows where those artillery units are that will be the advantage.

NK had been known to camouflage their arti, missile and sam units, but to US and SK whom equally does so AND whom have satellite capability to infra-ray tracked vital installations, that NK doesn't, its a foregone conclusion on who will be wiped out first.

NK's military leadership are stupid, backward, old and senile through years of insane Yuche indoctrination that the Kims are somekind of super beings. Can't they even see the kims cannot even feed that at all, and could not even stop droughts in the land???

May Kim, for once, just be honest, end his delusions. He is only leading his innocent and brainwashed people to unncessary death - by starvation and by his desire to launch thermonuclear war upon our world.

Originally posted by Gazrok
reply to post by pheonix358

 

They will be in impenetrable and very secret bunkers.

We can use a lot of satellite imaging to see where the tunnels and bunkers are, and we have a lot of new tools that can see even that deep (oddly enough, mostly from the petroleum industry). Also, we have new 30,000lb bunker busters (MOPs) that can go down 41m, a couple of those will reach even the deepest bunkers. They will not be impossible to find and kill, just expensive.

These are not I WIN weapons.

Yes they are effective against simple bunkers. But look at the facts.

Look at North Korean tunnel work in Vietnam they build large tunnel networks that would still work even if one part was bombed.

And not tunnel are not impossible to find but pretty bloody hard even now they still have trouble finding NK tunnels under the DMZ and the ones they find are normally bu chance!

Think of possibly thousands of miles of tunnels not just round then DMZ but all in the hills and mountains some way below 200m.

To beat that you will need hundreds of thousands of foot solders scaling the land for them. And when you do find them thousands of your I WIN bunker busters not just a few dozen.

And the Tunnels to deep to bomb well again you will need troops to find the entrances and seal them off. O and you have to do this while snipers and small scale mortar crews will be popping out of secret entrances (like world war 2) and potentially drooping chem weapons on you.


This wont be a war you just walk in and within 3 months its USA USA USA ! and only a few hundred dead.

You wont win it with just bombs. Only with them and thousands of lives be they USA, South Korean, Japanese or any other allies like UK who the USA like to put on the front line and die only to have flag waveing rednecks moan UK dont do enough!

reply to post by crazyewok

To beat that you will need hundreds of thousands of foot solders scaling the land for them. And when you do find them thousands of your I WIN bunker busters not just a few dozen.

Nope.

You just have to control the borders, destroy their ability to wage war, and through months of constant bombing and hunger, running out of ammo and fuel, drive them crazy enough to where they simply surrender.

Putting boots on the ground in NK will be a very big tactical mistake, one I hope our generals don't do.

(You do realize that any "published" numbers of any particular weapon are completely bogus, right?) I remember when we supposedly had only a dozen Nighthawks, and my father was looking at nearly two dozen on the tarmac...and this wasn't even the same location as they were said to be).

Originally posted by Gazrok

You just have to control the borders, destroy their ability to wage war,

Yes and no. Look at the way the Japanese fought in world war 2.

Originally posted by Gazrok
and through months of constant bombing

Bomb what you have to see it first! All the USA problems cant just be sought by Bombs.

Originally posted by Gazrok
and hunger, running out of ammo and fuel,

Yeah you can most likely starve them of fuel but not bullets and Im sure the Millitary have stored food away, that where most the aid goes I bet!

Originally posted by Gazrok
drive them crazy enough to where they simply surrender.

Didnt work in North Korean war 1, Vietnam,Gulfwar 1, Afghanistan or Gulf war 2 doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a diffrent result is insanity!

Originally posted by Gazrok
Putting boots on the ground in NK will be a very big tactical mistake, one I hope our generals don't do.

Most likely will be South Korean Troop they have enough. But someone will have to go in.