UK Independent party: "amicable" divorce from the European Union.

Originally posted by citizenoftheworld

Voters are turning to the UK Independence Party as it is the only party with alternative policies, its leader Nigel Farage has told activists.

At UKIP's spring conference, Mr Farage dismissed claims his party's success in recent by-elections was a protest vote.
He said people felt betrayed by a political class who were more interested in their own careers than national interest.

He also called for an "amicable" divorce from the European Union.

"There is a wholesale rejection of the career, political, professional class in this country going on. We have had enough of them," he told the conference in Exeter.

UKIP 'Only Westminster alternative'

I think he is the only man out there to speak the truth, I do think the UK is better off divorcing the EU and go back to a normal trade agreement

Me too mate.

Voted for them just lately.

Came within a gnats whisker of winning too...the GE is the one to watch, i think UKIP are going to be a MAJOR upset to the traditional 3 parties at the next general election.

reply to post by TruthxIsxInxThexMist


Theres a reason the coastguard is being savagely cut, that customs and excise, border control and immigration staff are losing their jobs. There is a pattern of giving an amnesty to illegal immigrants every few years when the documents and waiting lists get to high to cope with.

Not only do government not care, they actually encourage it. It serves the system to have this massive amount of immigration. Wages come down, expenses for us go up and everybody turns on those not like themselves. It's a recipe for societal collapse and rampant criminality just as a means to survive. I read somewhere a few days ago, and worked out from their figures that so far the bankers bailouts and QE in the UK already amount to £17,000 for each and every man woman and child in the country legal or illegal. And all for what? To give the banksters bonuses, to be a welfare mechanism for the markets (who already get great returns for taking risks) and to esave everyone in a collective fake debt. Now imagine what kind of booming economy would be created if that had been given to the people and they had been ordered to spend a certain percentage of it.

Why does the Bank of Engand charge the people to pull money out of thin air and create debt equal to it, rather than have the treasury create it for free?

reply to post by TruthxIsxInxThexMist


I could be wrong but I believe the figures shown at this link dispel the idea than non-EU immigration is much higher than EU migration.

www.ons.gov.uk...

So as far as I'm concerned the EU migrants situation is far more dire than non-EU. I also believe that non-EU immigrants tend to benefit the economy more than EU migrants who often come and claim welfare benefits way before they start working, and even then more of their income goes back to their home states.

As for people using the terms white as a synonym for English/British I totally agree with you.

The best waves of immigration we ever had were those from the indian subcontinent and the afro-carribeans, after the war. They came to Britain because we needed them and they cherished our British ideals and they really made an effort to integrate and adopt our way of things. It's sad but true that EU migrants often come here for a free lunch and free healthcare.

reply to post by citizenoftheworld


There has always been the probllem that UKIP have been branded with the same brush as the BNP, but i don't think this to be the case. I'm 31, so most of my voting life was labour, so i know just how crap they are, so i actully voted in this governnment. i believed in government cuts to save money, I knew that labour had bankrupted us and thought that any other government could do no worse. I was wrong. I now realise that they are both 2 sides of the same coin. The lib dems are pointless, so UKIP is actually the only choice left. Also, I've always believed that the UK was better off outside the EU. To still be part of the EEC, but be apart from it. Tghe best decision we ever made was to not join up to the Euro. Just look at Eire for proof of that!.

reply to post by merkins

I bet you didn't campaign for the rights of people who live in the same circumstances but with private/commercial landlords where the benefit restriction, that's right, benefit restriction, not tax, has been in existence for the last couple of decades.
I feel sympathy for your situation but as someone who has never had the luxury of cheap council housing rents on the back of mortgage payers or market price commercial renters, my sympathy only goes so far. If you are campaigning for everyone to have the same advantage of full housing benefit for excess rooms then I'm happy and will support your argument. If you are just bleating that you now fall into the same situation as non-council/social rent tenants then you should look at fairness for all.

Back on topic, I don't see UKIP providing these benefits to social/council housing tenants either. It is not a tax, and you know it, it's a reduction of preferential benefits for tenants who rent from the state and are subsidised by the state with cheap accommodation.
Tax is something you take from people who pay in, benefit cuts are reductions from the people who do not.

reply to post by merkins


I think that you hit the nail on the head when you said ''integration''. The Indians and the West Indians integrated into society, whereas the people coming into the county now refuse to integrate, apart from the Poles, who at least try to integrate and work for their money and work hard for it.

Originally posted by merkins
reply to post by TruthxIsxInxThexMist

 

I could be wrong but I believe the figures shown at this link dispel the idea than non-EU immigration is much higher than EU migration.

www.ons.gov.uk...

So as far as I'm concerned the EU migrants situation is far more dire than non-EU. I also believe that non-EU immigrants tend to benefit the economy more than EU migrants who often come and claim welfare benefits way before they start working, and even then more of their income goes back to their home states.

As for people using the terms white as a synonym for English/British I totally agree with you.

The best waves of immigration we ever had were those from the indian subcontinent and the afro-carribeans, after the war. They came to Britain because we needed them and they cherished our British ideals and they really made an effort to integrate and adopt our way of things. It's sad but true that EU migrants often come here for a free lunch and free healthcare.

Totally disagree with this.

As someone who has front line public service experience for well over ten years, actually the immigrants of the 50's and 60's did benefit the UK, what we have seen from the last ten years, at least, is nothing like back then.

Now I will say Eastern European criminal gangs are the most violent and ruthless that I have ever encountered, but many Eastern Europeans themselves are hard workers and have more in common with us culturally than many non-EU immigrants, will integrate and will learn the language.

Many non-EU immigrants that I have encountered across London, do not want to integrate, they don't even want to learn the language, they feel that they are owed a life of luxury from Britain and they don't care about Britain or about the British way of life.

The only non-EU people that I have known, on the whole, to integrate, are Indians, they integrate and they are hard workers, as well as bringing up their kids with the same ethics. Unfortunately, I can't say the same generally for Carribeans, you could have second and third generation born British and they will still class themselves as [insert Carribean nationality], the men have a real need to be macho as well as an attitude that they have a right to everything, regardless and the young males will almost always be involved to some degree, in crime. Those from Africa vary, but are mostly quite strict and hard working, however, Nigerians and Somalians seem to have this need to commit crime, fraud/theft for Nigerians, everything else for Somalians and Somalians will treat properties and areas like a landfill and are so verbally abusive towards people that I can't believe how they are allowed to get away with it.

Then you have the drug cartel Vietmanese, I have yet to encounter one that isn't involved in growing weed and wrecking a property in doing so. However I will say for them and Chinese (actually most South East Asian), they never claim benefits.

Turks and Kurds will try to integrate, will try to work but usually while killing each other.

Many Asians, out side of India, are notorious in getting only one member of a 50 member household to learn English.

Now all this may seem like rantings of a racist bigot etc etc, but this is my experience and pretty much every one I know throughout various sections of front line public services experiences. I'm not saying the English are great, look at the benefit class long term unemployed/never been employed. However, that was a class created by Labour to allow for uncontrolled immigration and now we have young kids who want to be like mummy, have kids, get a council property and live off of benefits. I don't blame them at all, they are products of a corrupt and ruthless government.

Immigration can benefit a country, but it must be minimal and beneficial, at present it is neither and when you are out there, as I am, it becomes very apparent as to just how destructive it is, EU and Non-EU. The country is swamped, public services are failing and falling apart, we can't take anymore because if we do, we nail the coffin lid shut on this country.

This country needs to do a lot to get back on track, now this is just my opinion of course, but I would stop immigration now and go through the country with a fine tooth comb getting out those who shouldn't be here, if they can't be indentified and won't release such information, detain them until it can be established as to where exactly they are from. Once this is done allow immigration to resume, but only for those who have a job here already and are sponsored by established companies in positions that have not been filled by those already here, once the job ends, the company (not just employee) has a responsibility to inform Immigration and unless the individual has another role following the same criteria, he/she is to return to their place of origin.

Get our own out to work, raising minimum wage to at least £8 an hour and handing benefits out only to those households where at least one member of working age is in full time employment. Priority to social housing should only be given to those who have contributed tax for at least five years. Invest massively in infrastructure, roads, railway (getting the companies running the trains to hand over at least 50% profit to getting the railway up to scratch) getting the million vacant homes that are just left to rot back up to scratch and in to social housing. Private rent sector needs to be regulated, you can only rent a property if it has been paid up and only up to a capped rate.

Further privitisation should only be done so using British companies based on them employing British residents (except where position cannot be filled, refer to immigration). Bonuses at the top end of banks should be capped with top level execs bonuses halved and all money of which to be invested in to community projects. Making sure that companies who take in hundreds of millions, if not billions in profit, no longer get away with paying no tax whatsoever. Withdrawing powers from the BOE that Labour gave to them such as setting interest rates and making the BOE far more transparent, if they refuse to do so, then do so by force. Nationalising Water, Electricity and Gas so that the essentials do not become a weapon wielded for profit by greedy share holders. Pull out our troops from all non-British territories, the only reason a British unit could be still based in a foreign territory would be to be paid for by private companies for the use of security on operations that directly benefit Britain and only within that complex or the immediate area. The only wars that Britain should get involved in are those that either directly threaten Britain, British territories or Commonwealth nations.

Dump the EU and return to just having the Commonwealth, we did just fine when it was just the Commonwealth before we were sold down the EC river.

Obviously this is all just a rough outline, but the bottom line is Britain needs to be British again. People who say the world is smaller and there are no borders etc are usually the same people that endorse policies based of the destruction of national identity while at the same time do not live anywhere near where the effects of such policies are truly felt. As I have said before, UKIP may well end up being the same as the others, but the others have already had a chance, except the Lib dems, but nobody would be suicidal enough to give them a chance. For me an ex Conservative, for my wife a hardened ex Labour and for many I know, ex all sorts of political parties, we have all mentioned along the way that we will be voting UKIP, now that is something, but its people like us, who see what exactly is happening to the country and the direction it is heading in, that thinks UKIP is quite possibly the only option left.

Cameron is scared, hence his recent hard line talk on immigration, but I'm seeing nothing, we are seeing nothing but words on a news article. UKIP are a viable vote and if you're British, especially English, I honestly don't see who else there is to vote for.

reply to post by merkins


Describing it as a tax is totally misleading and no one seems to have cared for the private renters who have had their benefit reduced for having extra bedrooms. It isn't a tax at all, it is a reduction in the money they get from the state to pay for their home.

Consider this, why should the taxpayer subsidise someone to have a larger house than required, be they in social or private accommodation? I could really do with an extra bedroom (3 kids but only a 3 bed house) but as I am a private renter and don't claim benefits, I am not able to afford it.

I have little sympathy for those who do have an extra bedroom and are in receipt of state help to pay for their home.

If they want state help, they should live within their means, not have a larger house than me who gets no help at all.

Originally posted by stumason
reply to post by merkins

 

Describing it as a tax is totally misleading and no one seems to have cared for the private renters who have had their benefit reduced for having extra bedrooms. It isn't a tax at all, it is a reduction in the money they get from the state to pay for their home.

Consider this, why should the taxpayer subsidise someone to have a larger house than required, be they in social or private accommodation? I could really do with an extra bedroom (3 kids but only a 3 bed house) but as I am a private renter and don't claim benefits, I am not able to afford it.

I have little sympathy for those who do have an extra bedroom and are in receipt of state help to pay for their home.

If they want state help, they should live within their means, not have a larger house than me who gets no help at all.

I used to private rent and I can absolutely say without a shadow of a doubt that private renting families are by far the most worse off all occupancy types. I know people of all financial conditions and I have said it for years that unemployed families in social housing are second to only owners who own property outright when it comes to how better off people are. A 3 bed social house will be approx 600 a month where I live, the same type house in private renting is approx 1200 a month, that's double. What people then don't take in to account is that if you're unemployed, you don't pay council tax, the private tenant has council tax on top of that, the amount of work that council do on a property is incredible, the private tenant will be lucky if a landlord fixes a hole in the roof, let alone anything else. On top of that, where are the pay rises? I haven't had a pay rise in about five years! Yet people who I know living off of benefits aer always saying each year how it all goes up.

What gets on my nerves about people in council housing, but in particular those who don't work in council housing, is that they really honestly can't see how good they got it. Benefits are an absolute privilege, not a right! Yet honestly they really can't see it. It's the same with the bedroom tax or whatever it's being called. They can't see that if one person is living in a 3/4 bed house, why should they be taxed? They can't see that it's not their house! It truly blows my mind. I saved up and worked my b****x off to get on the property ladder, because I was sick of private renting, had I been council renting I wouldn't have bothered.

Many friends I know in council housing have that attitude, sit in their mod con decked out 3 bed new build, paying 600 a month (which the state pays because they don't work), lovely garden, flat screen tv, kids get the latest clothes, latest consoles, money in the pocket day and night, haven't worked a day in about ten years and yet they say to me when I say I'm saving up for our first family holiday in years "Well it's alright for some init, wish I could go on holiday to some place other than Spain"...You just couldn't make it up!

Just to add, did anyone watch that thing on BBC3 last night about four couples who were teenagers or something or other living in the same block in London? I watched half of it. It was unreal, these flats are absolutely mint, yet the council had put these families in there, fair enough, but I mean inside everything was brand new. Now fair play to the blokes, as I think they all worked, but this one woman or girl with red hair, she didn't give a f**k. She kept telling her boyfriend to give up working and stay at home, poor bloke trying to do the right thing, she wouldn't have it and she wouldn't have it because she knows full well if he didn't work they would be no worse off, actually they could be better off depending on how much he earns. These flats though, to rent them where they were would cost privately probably about 1500 a month, if not more. It's an absolute joke, another example of people in social housing not realising just how good they have it, I don't know anyone who has private rented and gone straight in to a brand new fitted out property, you're lucky if the ceiling isn't on the floor! If the government are going to continue to allow this then regulate the damn private renting sector!!

reply to post by SecretFace


I missed that - I may watch it on iPlayer later...

You have hit the nail on the head though - these whiners about this "bedroom tax" fail to realism they are getting money from the State to pay for their housing, which in many cases means they pay no rent at all, whereas I claim no benefits and could really do with an extra bedroom, but when my current house costs £1000/month I cannot afford the jump to £1500 a month for the extra bedroom..

The really galling thing is I am stuck renting, despite earning a decent salary, because house prices are so damned high I cannot save for a deposit. The most I could save is £150 a month, which means it would take me 133 months to save for the smallest deposit required..

The really big kick in the nuts is under this new Government scheme to help first time buyers, if I missus gets the job she is going for today then that would tip us over the threshold for qualification, yet still leave us unable to save for a deposit in any meaningful timescale....

I am one of those people being squeezed in the middle who no one ever protests in the street about....

reply to post by SecretFace


Yes... most Council Properties have now been done up to Spectacular levels but you have to want to live in one of these Tower Blocks!! I had the opportunity but turned the Apartment down due to it being a Tower Block and also filled with people from Pakistan, Bangladesh and other Muslim Cultures, not to mention Africans... I wouldn't have liked it there as probably would have only been about 2 other English people in the block!!

I decided to wait and now have a Flat in Massionette which is much better for my well-being although I still want to move from this Area!

I'm from the States, but I watch this "thing" called the EU from the interest from the outside.

What a disaster.

I predict the next world war will be in Europe, as individual nations turn on the EU, Brussels and each other in some cases. The masses will realize how much they have been hoodwinked. Governments will tire of some pompous bankers/career politicians sitting in some hall telling them how to run their country.

I would say 2-3 years, but I think it will be even sooner.

I don't know, maybe that was their goal from the get go. There is a lot of money in war.