Erasing Death: NPR's Fresh Air addresses NDE's

Its' good to see more main stream shows covering near death experiences.

Dr. Sam Parnia researches the experiences of cardiac arrest patients in the time between when their hearts stop and when they are brought back to life. Parnia thinks of these experiences as actual-death experiences as opposed to near-death experiences.

Hear it here:

Erasing Death

There is also a written summary of the interview here, for those that prefer it: www.npr.org... nces-and-erasing-death

I enjoyed the interview and was glad to hear such a discussion on a mainstream outlet. No major revelations, but I do think I'll check out his book. One thing that he said that I had not heard before was that suicide victims that come back always have a negative experience. Surprising...

Actually, have read the many studies done with NDE's, and the one in particular with cardiac patients.

The majority who don't recall it, are not more brain damaged. They're more drugged. The ones who had less drugs in their system (you know the kind that create so called hallucinations) are less likely to remember a thing. Also this is a look under the veil, in a school, so some will be shown, most will experience, but not remember.

chicagoiands.org...:_scientists_weigh_the_scientific_and_spiritual_facets_of_ndes

OK, this says the drugs make no difference, but that is not true, and read in depth on the actual Dutch study. But I can't find that link and plus that was years ago. Will add it if I find it, as long as it doesnt take ages on the search.

But there are also many reports and studies on patients who are dementia, alheimers, strokes, mental illness, and confusion, but near death, they clear up completely. Often experiencing loved ones who have passed over. Sometimes Nurses and medical staff also have seen what the patient sees. However, it is most odd, for the skeptics who think that brain is everything and these conditions are being caused by lack of O2, or flooding of brain chemicals to cause delusion, OR taking some of the drugged type medications.

Whereas in reality, true near death experiences are more lucid, more conscious, clear, people clear right up and become aware and almost super conscious. Its nothing like what the skeptics imagine.

www.horizonresearch.org...

This goes into cognitive quite well. And also::

Two other studies of NDE in cardiac arrest were
published from the US. One study of 1595 people
who had been admitted to a cardiac unit over a 30-
month period, also found that the incidence of NDE
increased with the severity of the cardiac disease:
only 1% of those admitted with stable cardiac disease
reported NDEs, this increased to 10% of those
with cardiac arrest. Those who had had an NDE
were no different from those who had not in terms
of social or demographic variables, cognitive function
or degree of heart disease.11 Another US study
found that 23% of cardiac arrest survivors had an
NDE and that again those with NDEs became transformed
in a positive manner after 6 months

www.nderf.org...

This is good too, brings up some of the most important parts.

In acute myocardial infarction the duration of cardiac arrest (VF) on the CCU is usually 60-120 seconds, on the cardiac ward 2-5 minutes, and in out-of-hospital arrest it usually exceeds 5-10 minutes. Only during threshold testing of internal defibrillators or during electro physiologic stimulation studies will the duration of cardiac arrest hardly exceed 30-60 seconds.

From these studies we know that in our prospective study of patients that have been clinically dead (VF on the ECG) no electric activity of the cortex of the brain (flat EEG) must have been possible, but also the abolition of brain stem activity like the loss of the corneareflex, fixed dilated pupils and the loss of the gag reflex is a clinical finding in those patients. However, patients with an NDE can report a clear consciousness, in which cognitive functioning, emotion, sense of identity, and memory from early childhood was possible, as well as perception from a position out and above their “dead” body. Because of the sometimes reported and verifiable out-of -body experiences, like the case of the dentures reported in our study, we know that the NDE must happen during the period of unconsciousness, and not in the first or last second of this period.

So we have to conclude that NDE in our study was experienced during a transient functional loss of all functions of the cortex and of the brainstem. It is important to mention that there is a well documented report of a patient with constant registration of the EEG during cerebral surgery for an gigantic cerebral aneurysm at the base of the brain, operated with a body temperature between 10 and 15 degrees, she was put on the heart-lung machine, with VF, with all blood drained from her head, with a flat line EEG, with clicking devices in both ears, with eyes taped shut, and this patient experienced an NDE with an out-of-body experience, and all details she perceived and heard could later be verified. (8)
....

Michael Shermer states that, in reality, all experience is mediated and produced by the brain, and that so-called paranormal phenomena like out-of body experiences are nothing more than neuronal events. The study of patients with NDE, however, clearly shows us that consciousness with memories, cognition, with emotion, self-identity, and perception out and above a life-less body is experienced during a period of a non-functioning brain (transient pancerebral anoxia). And focal functional loss by inhibition of local cortical regions happens by “stimulation” of those regions with electricity (photons) or with magnetic fields (photons), resulting sometimes in out-of-body states.

This is pertaining to the O2.

www.near-death.com...

Clinical research

Our study, done at Seattle Children's Hospital concluded that near-death experiences are in fact the dying experience. We studied 26 critically ill children and found that 24 of them reported being conscious while dying, and having some sort of conscious experience. Typically that involved the perception of a loving light, a "light that had good things in it".

We studied over 100 control children who were also treated with medications, had a lack of oxygen to their brain, were intubated and mechanically ventilated in the scary intensive care unit, and who also thought they were going to death. They, however, were seriously ill and not truly near death. None of these patients reported being conscious while dying or having a spiritual experience.

Lack of oxygen actually decreases the memory recall of having an NDE.

www.medicine.virginia.edu...

Abstract: In this article, we present the results of a literature survey on case
reports of the unexpected return of mental clarity and memory shortly before
death, which we have called “terminal lucidity.” We focus specifically on
terminal lucidity in mental disorders, of which we have found 81 case
references. Of these, we were able to retrieve 49 case reports, most of which
had been recorded before 1849. Thereafter, comparatively few reports of
terminal lucidity have been published. Some more recent publications referred to
terminal lucidity in patients suffering from schizophrenia and dementia. We
draw parallels and distinctions between terminal lucidity and remissions
attributable to febrile illness in neurosyphilis. We recommend in-depth
studies on the psychopathology and neuropathology involved in terminal
lucidity, since they might enable the development of both improved therapies
and a better understanding of unresolved aspects of cognition and memory
processing.
Key Words: Terminal illness, memory, dementia, remission,
schizophrenia.
(J Nerv Ment Dis 2009;197: 942–944)

Clarity. Lucidity. Patients terminal illness, dementia, schizophrenia, often become lucid.

www.rcpsych.ac.uk...

Deathbed visions which are often defined as "take away", bringing comfort. Why would the biological unit be programmed to experience NDE's and take away visions? How is that natural selection?

And these visions have been shared by nursing staff on occasion, and there have been studies done on this.

www.netplaces.com...

Case studies and accounts of deathbed experiences witnessed by others in nursing homes sometimes involve the witness having a vision of the dying person leaving her body. Other times, the witness sees unmistakable spiritually charged transformations taking place over the dying individual just before she passes....

www.netplaces.com...

Hospital staff witnessing and even sharing (to some degree) crossingover experiences of their dying patients may be more common than typically thought. For example, according to Morse, anthropologist D. Lewis “randomly interviewed 100 London nurses and found that 35 percent reported experiences with dead patients, ranging from vague feelings to visual and auditory hallucinations.”

In another example, in The Near-Death Experience: A Reader, Lee Worth Baily and Jenny L. Yates talk about how one nurse reported witnessing a patient cross over and seeing something “as if the patient were surrounded by a bright glow.” She added, “That was a phenomenon she had sometimes observed in the dying.”

Some hospital and emergency room staff are witness to their patients' deathbed visions just as they cross over. Wills-Brandon, tells of one doctor describing an interesting case where one of his patients crossed over and seemed to regress to a childhood age just moments before death, as he seemed to see his own passed-on mother....

It is not uncommon for personnel of medical settings to witness the events surrounding the dying of a patient. It is also not uncommon for them to witness unexplainable phenomena when such events do transpire.

I've been very interested in the hospital staff and actual moments of death, not just when they come back.

If you dissolve ISMS and programming, these are the real deal, when it comes to understanding life more, and why we're here.

reply to post by Unity_99



Thanks so much, Unity!! You rock. I'm excited to have so many great links to follow and read this weekend. The children's study was especially remarkable --- well, they are ALL remarkable, really, and even more so collectively than individually.

NDEs are just fascinating and it really feels like more and more mainstream scientists and clinicians are being open about their findings and experiences. It feels like a very slow cultural shift is happening where NDEs are not automatically dismissed in materialist terms.

ETA:
I do want to add one concern the skeptic in me always has with NDEs. We get very excited (or I do, anyway) when it appears that consciousness is continuing to exist when someone is technically dead. They come back and tell us memories they had that took place when they were brain dead. But my question is, how do when know when, exactly, that experience happened? Might it have occurred in the moments they were newly alive again? Or right before they technically died? How can we know those memories, when they saw they light etc,. actually took place while they were braindead?

Time is a tricky thing. I know I sometimes feel like I've been asleep for hours and hours because I have long and elaborate dreams, but then I'm shocked to open my eyes and see only a matter of minutes have passed on the clock. Or I may feel like my head just hit the pillow and I open my eyes and it's 6 hours later. I know it isn't a great example, comparing a dream state to death, but it's the best I can come up with to illustrate how a sense of time is so easily altered.

Aside from instances when someone has an out of body experience where they hear conversations that happened while they are dead (and I'm not sure of how many well documented cases like this exist... will have to dig) I just don't understand how we can confidently put a timestamp on an NDE. Any thoughts? I hope I made some sense - it's an issue that confuses me so I might not be articulating my concern very well.

Yea, the bit about suicide really affected me. I've known too many who have taken their lives because they just couldn't endure all the bull#. But I wonder if it is like a spiritual warning, not to try it again, or if it is something eternal.

reply to post by kazanoom


Yes, hearing him say that has really haunted me as well. I really hope it is, like you said, intended as a spiritual warning. Suicide is already so tragic and painful to those left behind, the idea that those who take their own lives are in what sounds like some sort of hell on the other side because of it... it is just too heartbreaking to even imagine.

I've seen mediums communicating with those who committed suicide and have never heard a negative message that way... BUT I suppose the validity of mediums could be debated. In my heart, though, I just cannot bring myself to believe that those who kill themselves are damned for all eternity. I just can't.

I knew this kid who was considered the school bully and he picked a couple of fights with me. I knew he was hurting inside, he had abusive foster parents who drank all day/night and beat him up, then he would go to school and take it out on all us other kids. He killed himself, he wasn't born bad. I hate to think he is suffering. He was too young to know any better.

reply to post by VegHead

Mediums never say anything negative. If they said anything negative they wouldn't have any customers, would they?

People go to mediums for the same reason that people go to church, because they want assurance. They are scared to death of their own existence and need somewhere to suck their thumb.

Originally posted by Xaphan
reply to post by VegHead

 

Mediums never say anything negative. If they said anything negative they wouldn't have any customers, would they?

People go to mediums for the same reason that people go to church, because they want assurance. They are scared to death of their own existence and need somewhere to suck their thumb.

I'm not that skeptical yet. A lot of people move away from religion and turn to mediums for evidence. But probably 99% of mediums are flim flam artists. I haven't discounted them all yet.