Mass Killings: Why American Men Are "Going Postal"

Originally posted by stuncrazy

Originally posted by WaterBottle
reply to post by burdman30ott6

 

Fix the American family and you fix America, bottom line.

Not really. The family is only one part of it, poverty and access to decent paying jobs is another.

love this. i would only like to add is that fixing poverty and access to better paying jobs would fix the american family. bottom line.

Yup. The majority of the people with messed up families are the poor and lower middle classes.

Thanks for all the responses. I was curious as to the types of responses this article would receive and it's about what I expected.

There seems to be this idea that self-responsibility and self-reliance will fix everything that I find incredibly naive. Those are ideas that are, in fact, fantasy. There is no such thing as the self-made man we all rely on others in all areas of our lives. I've spoken to many who hold this belief and find them defensive, afraid and close-minded and wonder how they got that way. There is no way to discuss even the possiblity of other concepts and hence pointless to talk to them about anything other then their particular 'things'.

I heard interesting things here. The breakdown of the family probably is a cause in these cases. Obama is called a cause but this started way before him (interesting how Obama is the boogey man and Reagan, God though it's a FACT that Reagan did start this steep civil decline we are in).

Everything has a cause and an effect. I enjoy listening to people's ideas and conclusions about things. I like reasoned arguments not angry knee-jerk ones and this thread has produced both. I miss William Buckley, his logic was flawless though I disagreed with many of his conclusions (thought his premises in error) I learned a lot from that man's retoric.

Again thank you all for responding.

Originally posted by FyreByrd


I hope that you will take the time to read this article. It has some valid points on why this phenomenon is taking place in the US.

The author cites four fundamental causes:

1) Decline of good wage earner jobs (Union Jobs)
2) Militarism (Military Industrial Complex)
3) No real social safety net
4) Distain towards Metal Health.

I offer additional links for depth:



truth-out.org
(visit the link for the full news article)

After reading the points, I refuse to even click that liberal propaganda.... Seriously, all these excuses are RIGHT out of the communist handbook.... NOT EVEN JOKING!

Here's the real problem.... we have 336 Million people living in this country.... 1 out of 10 million seem to go on a spree... thats like lotto magic...

also, we have parents not taking care of kids, DOPING THEM UP WITH DRUGS, and then of course, our government PRODS them with racism... Race baiting etc.

(look at what our president has done to divide this country over the last 5 years)

I love the underlying message here..."White men are unstable, they go crazy and kill innocents"..."It's all their fault"

What about gangs "of color" that routinely kill untold numbers of innocent bystander every year in this country and in Mexico?

Sure, they are trying to put blame on this or that but the intent is to make the "white male" look like the lunatic that's always right on the edge of popping.

How about the pharmaceuticals with a list of side effects longer than your arm?

How about the slow and deliberate dismantling of our rights?

How about the manipulation of economy so that it is impossible for the average wage earner to raise a family on a single income thus both parents must work? ...if there are two parents that is...

What happens when a person looks around at the state of our country and our society and realizes that the corruption is so deep and entrenched that there is absolutely no way to fix it?

How does a person act when the only apparent remedy is cataclysm and destruction?

These are the types of things that make people snap...along with job and peer pressure.

I am not defending what any of these loony tunes do by any means...people are responsible for their own decisions. I do not appreciate the picture this type of propaganda paints when the "between the lines" is considered.

reply to post by Jeremiah65


Or how about the Liberal dense cities (IE chicago and Las Angeles, DC, Detroit) are the WORST in the nation for Violent Crime... The more dense the democrat population the more dangerous the city

Heres an article that refutes peoples notion that mass killings are happening more regularly-

reason.com...

I think its just being bombarded with sensationalism 24-7 where people feel like they are happening more and more...

If they are happening more and more however, I would look at the rise of social media, I think as social media becomes more powerful and more in depth, those people who feel that they are different will feel even more different and alienated because the more powerful social media is the easier it is to seperate people into differentiating groups.

Men are not "going postal" in this country. Crimes rates are falling it's just that with the rise in 24 hour news and everyone being connected to smartphones/media we are more likely to notice it.

want to know the real problem? click on the link below and start looking at the information and stats starting on page 11.

bjs.ojp.usdoj.gov...

reply to post by shivaX



You're either joking or you're one of the insane "postal" people they're talking about. Tyrannical rule? Give me a break, c'mon.

Originally posted by JibbyJedi
How the Hell does the Reagen era or job losses, "going postal era", explain why "white males" are taking it out on innocent civilians?

I would say that the possible reason why they are "going postal" is because of perceived complacency. If you look around, you'll see a very common theme of people being "sheeple", "asleep", "brainwashed" and more v. "awake". If society appears to be complacent to the perceived injustices that are victimizing the individual, then, through that lens, society could be considered a target, itself.

Its to easy to blame everything else other than the idiots doing the killings.

Originally posted by shivaX
Hmm the citizens are angry because of the tyrannical rule of Barack 'Hussein' Obama.

They are also enraged because 3000 US citizens were sent to Allah by Islamic terrorists in 9/11.

See, that's the thing. I do wonder how some petty terrorists can hijack a plane on US soil and then manage successfully to fly over one of the United States' most prestigious and iconic cities and crash such planes into one of the most iconic towers of the NYC and the US. And yet, a country like Iran or North Korea haven't struck against such a country as weak as that? If it was so easy to crash two planes into the Twin Towers, I do wonder why more acts of terrorism weren't performed against the weak country of the US - after all, who allows one of the most iconic cities to be attacked, not by an army, but by some 'Islamic' terrorists - you know, those backward guys with AK47s fighting in deserts...

Originally posted by stuncrazy

Originally posted by WaterBottle
reply to post by burdman30ott6

 

Fix the American family and you fix America, bottom line.

Not really. The family is only one part of it, poverty and access to decent paying jobs is another.

love this. i would only like to add is that fixing poverty and access to better paying jobs would fix the american family. bottom line.

WRONG

You don't need a lot of money to have inspiration, creativity, LOVE, stability emotionally, and much more

Our culture leads us to say things like JOBS and material issues but realistically that's Bull kaka

when we were at our best you came home and tossed a ball with Dad... The mental stability doesn't come from if it's a 350.00 xbox set up or a .99 cent spalding, the mental stability comes from companionship and attitude and love

You have parents or you don't

your learning life from other kids nonexistent values or adults

America was built on poverty with strong family units...just like China is today

I'd quote the movie social network "At Harvard we don't seek Jobs we invent them"

That was once every Americans thought on the subject, families worked together and built businesses, Money doesn't mean squat.... a productive Family with life centered around goals does, that invents Money from nothing

Mom convinced by Dr phil to seek out Orgasms and Dad out of the picture is a Money Vacuum

The economy? What economy when dads disposable income is used NOT for lawnmowers and vacations but for child support? Mom pays rent and bills nothing goes back to the private sector it is of course almost never enough for a life by itself 2 households one income Good Luck....So mom can avoid work via welfare, mom doesn't pay taxes she gets a refund for having kids... she takes food stamps and health care... s Dad spends NOTHING into economy, Mom draws from economy and whole time the kids have no parents

No Family = No Economy

Too bad more of these lunatics don't tell us why they snapped. Remember Thomas Ball? He was the man that set himself on fire outside a court house. I think this is the type of person we are dealing with, not everyone ends up on a shooting spree. Anyway he did leave a message. A manifesto. A link is below. His anger was toward the circumvention of constitutional laws, and the corruption in the system. Both of which apparently really messed him over.

He paid the ultimate price to get his message out. That was enough for me to hear what he had to say.

link

Anyway. My take is that people are mostly just sick of being stepped on. This is a new feeling for WASPs that have traditionally been in the privileged group.

reply to post by jtma508


Ban assault rifles and the mass killings will not be as devastating! There will always be maniacs who go and shoot innocent people and always have been, however, since they started using assault rifles the casualty count has gone up.

reply to post by Waldy


You can't take effect and make it the cause.

What happens when everyone has access to a 3d printer and a schematic for an electric railgun. We ban 3d printers of course. I'm sure big business would love that. Maybe that is the plan to begin with...

Obama said their were 900 shootings in december. Dramatic, yes? The billboard at my bus stop says 7000 kids drop out of school every day. How many lose jobs or houses in december I don't know, but I would put money on it being well over 900.

You can't take the effect and make it the cause.

(Thanks Jack Black)

reply to post by Waldy


Oh that's just so incorrect. That's what the MSM likes to offer-up and people, in turn, lap it up. The fact is, if the shooter at Sandy Hook had entered that school with a shotgun the devastation would have been geometrically higher. Every shell, depending on load, would have sprayed numerous projectiles into a lethal kill radius. It would have been like firing a machine gun. Standard HD loads would fire from 9 to 16 lethal pellets per shell. Imagine that in a close environment like the school? This has nothung to do with 'assault weapons'. Check the statistics. Assault weapons are used in a tiny fraction of firearm homicides.

reply to post by FyreByrd


Glad you appreciated William F. Buckleys logic. Sorry you missed the obvious logic in your own post. The common linkage of violence, as presented by your own links , is a sense of victimization on the part of the offender, whether real or imagined.
Those with serious mental problems are more highly reactive to the victimization belief or perception and account for most of the mass killings recently if you believe the "official" versions
But the rampage of violence seen in some of our major cities is also directly related to the victimization mentality. Crime statistic's show that blacks compose about 13% of the population but account for 51% of all murders and 91% of those victims were black. Ask the majority of blacks if they consider themselves to be "victims" of whatever and the answer will be yes.
Now, where is this concept of victimization most espoused. You guessed it. The ultra liberal left's MSM and the leftist leaning politicians. It's a tactic that has been projected by the left for more than a hundred years and literally perfected by today.s globalist politicians.
The current administration has used this time tested method to completely polarize the nation, and paralyze "our" congress, to justify it's disregard of the constitution and the stripping away of personal guaranteed rights and liberties.
As proof, I would direct you to the last presidential election, where class warfare, discrimination against women, minorities, gays ,union vs, non-union etc., etc..was the predominate theme of the lefts campaign.
In summery, your subtle insinuations of who or what is the cause of violent crime falls far short of logic.
Logic would suggest that the perpetuation of a victimization status is the real reason for violent crimes and assuming personal responsibility for one's actions and condition in life is the solution.
But if that philosophy was actually part of the national discourse, we wouldn't need such a bloated bankrupt government to tell us all how to run our lives, would we? No, the left could not allow that to happen could they.

reply to post by jtma508


No you are wrong and either blind or a troll!

Originally posted by WaterBottle
I think it is just because America is not a friendly place. It's an all for yourself country.

You have a ton of people with this sort of mindset...

Literally about half the country thinks like this. And the other half is only slightly better..slightly.

edit on 1-2-2013 by WaterBottle because: (no reason given)

I guess those three people in the video is supposed to...do what for us exactly?

Also, i am sure you could find three people holding signs and throwing money at each other in most any country. I love news and videos from other countries. Language is a problem because the little subtitles on the bottom give you two choices - read the subtitle or watch the video. All foreign videos should contain an embedded text file that opens with the video.

there is something in these mass murders that is not normal. You can see it in there eyes. It seems society some how or another has brought these men to madness, or they are just mad to begin with. Depending on how many lawyers or senators or congress men you, have depends on what you can blame.

I think it has mainly to do with parenting actually, people teaching these people right from wrong, or putting them into a position to avoid trauma, I dunno the right answer. Yet it is apparently obvious the last few mass killings these men or kids were crazy....

Period...

I think it is utterly stupid, and not solving the problem either by chopping down or trying to redefine the 2nd amendment.. Its a stupid thought, and if anything a easy way out, not to mention against the principals of what this country was founded on, we are Independent citizens it is not my fault nor the fault of other independents you do not want to be...

In a Country that has over 300 million people in it, lets face it, bad crap is going to happen...

Especially with the corrosion of the morals and principals that was once a strong fabric in our anthem....

You want a better place teach your children right from wrong, love them tell them that every single day, and teach them things good things etc. etc.

Anyhow that is my opinion..