A (legal) immigrant, American by choice, eloquently speaks on Gun Violence Prevention

I came across this video today as it is being passed around Facebook.
My commentary is this: I agree.

Especially with his quote,

"The 2nd Amendment is a Dooms Day prevision. One designed only for those exceptionally rare circumstances when all other rights have failed. A free people can only afford to make this mistake once."

I also ask those in favor of gun control, to ask yourself this:
Who do the politicians care about more: You and Your Family or Themselves and Their Power?

Politicians and legislators are not trying to 'help you.' They are never trying to 'help you.' They are only doing what is necessary to remain in power above you. But they are also masters at social manipulation and psychology. They will make you think it's your idea. They will make you think it's for your safety. They will make you think you need them to protect you. But don't believe any of it.



Here is his opening as well:

"My name is Henson Ong. Forgive me, English is not my first language. I am a legal immigrant and I am an American by choice. Thank you for giving me this opportunity to express my opinion and to give my testimony in opposition to the majority of the proposed bills which do nothing to deter future crimes.
Gun control does not work.
Your own history is replete with high school rifle teams, Boy Scout marksmanship merit badges, you could buy rifles at hardware stores, you could order them - mail order - delivered to your home, your country was awash in readily available firearms and ammunition. And yet in your past you did not have mass school shootings. Other people have already expressed the question, 'What changed?' It was not the availability of guns suddenly exploded or increased, it actually was decreased. What was changed was societal decay." - Henson Ong, Testimony before the Gun Violence Prevention Working Group Public Hearing, Hartford, CT

My problem with the doomsday prevention amendment is that why are people in favour, not over throwing government RIGHT NOW?

is it because they still rely on them?
is it because "they are not too bad yet"?
is it maybe because not everyone(like majority) wants to overthrow government?

Why no action but just words? go over to the white house and drag out the president.

reply to post by luciddream


How does an honest man fight a corrupt war?

Originally posted by luciddream
My problem with the doomsday prevention amendment is that why are people in favour, not over throwing government RIGHT NOW?

is it because they still rely on them?
is it because "they are not too bad yet"?
is it maybe because not everyone(like majority) wants to overthrow government?

Why no action but just words? go over to the white house and drag out the president.

Depends on your definition of 'action.'

Being a Gun Owner does not mean you are radical and violent. As the quote said, it is only after ALL other rights have failed. So far, we still have other means of tackling this situation. Yes, it is tricky. Yes, the deck is stacked. Yes, 'They' are playing dirty. But now, more than ever, people are waking up to what is happening. People are getting fed up with the lies and the violence.
There are other, more creative, ways change a government.
We just need to watch where we spend our money.
Every dollar is a vote.
Pay attention to who your city elects - City Council, Mayor, Sheriff, etc.
The States still have power, we need to work within the legal framework.
We can still vote out the majority of DC.
We can raise our voices against social atrocities and bring about a new public dialogue.

Change starts within the heart, not in the streets.

reply to post by eleven44


Believe it or not, soon as a new president comes(or from a new political party), people will calm down, then rage again.

Country is divided by far end of the spectrum. Government won't come down until people come together.

Its never ending.

In our past, we didn't have school shootings?

This is just from 1996. Not all shootings listed are in the US,but still. DENY IGNORANCE

Originally posted by luciddream
reply to post by eleven44

 

Believe it or not, soon as a new president comes(or from a new political party), people will calm down, then rage again.

Country is divided by far end of the spectrum. Government won't come down until people come together.

Its never ending.

I completely agree that the Government will not come down until people come together.
So lets start promoting people coming together. Let's take action in that sense. Let's make sure open dialogue and mature conversation is prevalent and abundant.

However, I will 'not believe' it that people will continue to calm down every time a president is elected. We are learning. My generation (I am 24) especially. And definitely the generation behind mine. Times are changing. The older generation is still in control. But, they can't stick around forever.

Originally posted by DaTroof
In our past, we didn't have school shootings?

This is just from 1996. Not all shootings listed are in the US,but still. DENY IGNORANCE

I'm pretty sure he was speaking more in the past than 1996.

More like the 1800's through the mid 1900's. This was a time when gun safety was taught in schools as well as in the household. The gun was a tool, not a mass killing weapon. There were accidents and a few isolated fatalities, but hardly the mass shootings and massacres that we see today.

And 'DENY IGNORANCE.'
I agree. But isn't it kind of ignorant to assume that 'the past' started in 1996? How old are you?

reply to post by eleven44

The older generation is still in control..

The problem.

lets start promoting people coming together.
Let's take action in that sense.
Let's make sure open dialogue and mature conversation is prevalent and abundant

If these happen we would have already won.

Our generation(im 26) and ones a bit head of us and those behind us is the only key.

There is no way to change what is happening now in a mature manner, people are already brought up in hardcore mentality, they have already pledged their allegiance to a party and their ideals whether they favor it or not.

I will be open to suggesting, you think my grandfather who was brought up in such mentality would? they would react the same way when i brought my first friend with different color home(he isn't racist, he is just not used to it) .

reply to post by luciddream


Keep faith. People can surprise you.
My family has come leaps and bounds in accepting the type of people that I bring home and the lifestyle that I choose to live.
They wouldn't even listen to me when I first started talking about the 9/11 conspiracy about 6 years ago. But now my mom is completely fed up with the government, their lies, the way they manipulate the economy, etc, and is ready to kick them all out. They are pretty 'republican,' but they are becoming more and more 'libertarian' and constitutional, and they do not blindly stick by the republican pulpit.

Other people I know are constantly surprising me with how open they are becoming to 'alternative' ideas.

I'm not saying it's easy. I'm not saying it's not a process.

I'm just saying "Don't give up yet."

Things like this post still give me hope that we can work within the system.

reply to post by luciddream


why not do it yourself if you feel that way?

Here is the real deal. Democrats and Republicans are two criminal enterprises who band together in Washington to scam, defraud, and extort money from the American citizen and taxpayer. We have to clean house of ALL the criminal conspirators and start clean. Democrats and Republicans only care about power and money.

We need to start electing leaders and representatives who can stand on their own two feet and think for themselves without being propped up by massive criminal enterprises.

We need to start electing leaders and representatives who love America more than they love power and money.

We need to decouple corporate campaign contributions from the electoral process. The way to do that is to make all campaign contributions ANONYMOUS and distribute them equally among all the candidates running.

We need to make lobbying a CAPITAL CRIME.

We need to make accepting money or gifts by a person in an elected position a CAPITAL CRIME.

We need to take these serious measures to ensure that our Government does not get hijacked by criminals ever again.

We also need to disband the CIA. It was started with NAZIS and has been tainted ever since.

Originally posted by eleven44

Originally posted by DaTroof
In our past, we didn't have school shootings?

This is just from 1996. Not all shootings listed are in the US,but still. DENY IGNORANCE

I'm pretty sure he was speaking more in the past than 1996.

More like the 1800's through the mid 1900's. This was a time when gun safety was taught in schools as well as in the household. The gun was a tool, not a mass killing weapon. There were accidents and a few isolated fatalities, but hardly the mass shootings and massacres that we see today.

And 'DENY IGNORANCE.'
I agree. But isn't it kind of ignorant to assume that 'the past' started in 1996? How old are you?

edit on 31-1-2013 by eleven44 because: (no reason given)

edit on 31-1-2013 by eleven44 because: (no reason given)

I'm in my 30s.

The point is, there have been school shootings forever. Even back in the 1800s. My link proves that as far back as 1996. Further information requires further research.


EDIT: Also, who gives a **** about crime stats from hundreds of years ago? This is 2013.

Originally posted by DaTroof

Originally posted by eleven44

Originally posted by DaTroof
In our past, we didn't have school shootings?

This is just from 1996. Not all shootings listed are in the US,but still. DENY IGNORANCE

I'm pretty sure he was speaking more in the past than 1996.

More like the 1800's through the mid 1900's. This was a time when gun safety was taught in schools as well as in the household. The gun was a tool, not a mass killing weapon. There were accidents and a few isolated fatalities, but hardly the mass shootings and massacres that we see today.

And 'DENY IGNORANCE.'
I agree. But isn't it kind of ignorant to assume that 'the past' started in 1996? How old are you?

edit on 31-1-2013 by eleven44 because: (no reason given)

edit on 31-1-2013 by eleven44 because: (no reason given)

I'm in my 30s.

The point is, there have been school shootings forever. Even back in the 1800s. My link proves that as far back as 1996. Further information requires further research.


EDIT: Also, who gives a **** about crime stats from hundreds of years ago? This is 2013.

edit on 31-1-2013 by DaTroof because: (no reason given)

Could you please provide a link that shows there have been 'school shootings forever?'

THIS is the best source I have found so far.

As far as I can find, the first 'mass' killing event to take place at a school was in 1927 in Michigan. It wasn't a student (kid) who killed people, nor did the person use a gun. He used a homemade bomb.

The next school mass killing was in Houston in 1959. It was also by an older man and was done with a bomb, not a gun.

After that, the next one I can find was the UT Campus shooting in Austin in 1966. 16 people were sniped from the top of the UT Tower. But, did you know the ground was full of local citizens with their own private firearms ready to defend themselves and help even before the police showed up?

Then there was the Kent State Shooting. You know, the one where our Government killed our students.

Eleven days after Kent State was the Jackson State Killings where the National Guard again killed 4 students who were protesting the war.

In fact, (as far as I have yet found) the first full on 'mass shooting' that happened inside a school and was the result of a gun was in 1976.

But it wasn't really until about 1996 that there was an onslaught of mass school shootings akin to the ones we are still seeing.

There have been a few isolated cases of shootings occurring on school campuses, but the majority of these were accidental gun discharges and the rest seem to involve one student being killed in a one-on-one dispute, which is still horrible, but far from the same thing as a massacre.

And

Also, who gives a **** about crime stats from hundreds of years ago? This is 2013

^^That is coming from the same person who screams "DENY IGNORANCE?"
Really?

Ever heard the phrase 'Those who ignore history are doomed to repeat it.'

If you wanna see crime stats from hundreds of years ago that you care about, I'd recommend looking at the MILLIONS AND MILLIONS of people that governments have killed over the last few hundred years.

Also, our history gives great insight into the human mind and social behaviors. Guns didn't change. Society changed. If we look back at our history perhaps we can determine what has changed, where, when and why.

Deny ignorance.

reply to post by eleven44



www.examiner.com...

Here's the info about pre-1996 shootings.

I love the title to this thread, especially the way the OP felt a need to write “A (legal) immigrant”, it’s just such a right wing thing to do.

My apologise to the OP as I know this was probably not the intended impression but it’s the one I got and it did kind of make me laugh.

reply to post by OtherSideOfTheCoin


The man himself made it a point to declare he was a legal immigrant. I did, however, expect someone to comment about that, simply because I know how ATS works.

And I'm not a right wing guy.

Nor am I a left wing guy.

Originally posted by DaTroof
reply to post by eleven44

 

www.examiner.com...

Here's the info about pre-1996 shootings.

A few things from the link you posted:

For example, there was a shooting in 1906, 1907, two in 1908, and one in 1909. Most of these were not mass shootings but rather involved only one or two people.

One or two people killed is a completely different scenario than a mass shooting. The motive is massively different. The mindset of the killer is massively different. Guns just so happened to be a convenient way for them to get settle their dispute. Had they not had a gun I guarantee you it would have been some other kind of inanimate object used as a weapon.

even though there is no consensus of the effectiveness of [gun control legislation.] For example, "During the years in which the D.C. handgun ban and trigger lock law was in effect" (1976-2007), "the Washington, D.C. murder rate averaged 73% higher than it was at the outset of the law, while the U.S. murder rate averaged 11% lower"

and

At the end of the day, I believe that some people will always do things that do not make sense to the rest of us. If they can't have a legal firearm, they will find illegal ones. If they cannot get an illegal firearm, they will make bombs or find some other way to cause chaos and injury. It's more of a human nature and cultural issue than it is a firearm issue

One or two people killed is a completely different scenario than a mass shooting. The motive is massively different. The mindset of the killer is massively different. Guns just so happened to be a convenient way for them to get settle their dispute. Had they not had a gun I guarantee you it would have been some other kind of inanimate object used as a weapon.

You're right that one or two people does not make a mass shooting. What was being discussed was the existence of SCHOOL shootings for the entire history of the country. And do you want to know why only one or two people were killed? Because the shooters weren't armed with high-capacity semi-auto assault rifles. They likely had single barrel rifles or shotguns.

even though there is no consensus of the effectiveness of [gun control legislation.] For example, "During the years in which the D.C. handgun ban and trigger lock law was in effect" (1976-2007), "the Washington, D.C. murder rate averaged 73% higher than it was at the outset of the law, while the U.S. murder rate averaged 11% lower"

and

At the end of the day, I believe that some people will always do things that do not make sense to the rest of us. If they can't have a legal firearm, they will find illegal ones. If they cannot get an illegal firearm, they will make bombs or find some other way to cause chaos and injury. It's more of a human nature and cultural issue than it is a firearm issue

The facts of the DC murder rate I cannot refute, but the other quote is the opinion of the author.

I am bumping this thread, cause I found it in ATS search when I came across this tremendous video other places.

This guy makes some seriously good points, much to the dismay of those who infiltrate this board trying to intimidate, deflect, and lessen impact. I highly recommend everyone watch this video, and spit in the faces of the infiltrators, even if silently.