Masonry is not Real Enlightenment

reply to post by PnezakYahakotima


Exactly, as far as I have seen.

Fair enough.

Have you ever read this book? Written by a Mason.... and no it's not anti-masonic. I found it to be very enlightening back in my day.

www.amazon.com...

I can not say that I have.

Though I do like old book, thank you for sharing.

It's a good one. Check it out.

I should warn you beforehand, that is a very potent book, from my experience...

Let me know what you think of it.

reply to post by PnezakYahakotima


Sure will.

Thanks again for the suggestion.

You know what? I'm going to re-read some of my masonic literature in the mean-time to re-fresh my intellect, and I'll come back and hopefully have some more interesting bits to add on this subject...

I'll try to be more impartial...

reply to post by PnezakYahakotima


I read about the Space Shuttle once. I still don't think I could fly it.

I hope you do return a bit more impartial. Or not at all.

reply to post by OutonaLimb

Yeah, that's not how it works in Freemasonry. We don't blackmail to our members in line. Our ways are not deceptive, diabolical, or sinister.

Originally posted by PnezakYahakotima
Yes, the OTO is the exact same thing as masonry, although a bit more blatant.

Your opinion.

reply to post by PnezakYahakotima

A movie, not necessarily reality.

reply to post by PnezakYahakotima


congrats on your first thread! Interesting reading, thx

enjoyed reading all of the replies actually, good discussion going on

Originally posted by PnezakYahakotima

The central theme of your signature seems to be one of mistrust.

I don't mistrust the person. I don't trust their claims.

Two men say they're the one sent by God to give his message on earth. Each of them claims that their word is right. Which of the following applies:

1) One of them must be wrong.
2) Both of them might be right.
3) There is no way of telling which of the above two are correct.

Perhaps the following statement is a generalization, but it is based on my experiences. Personally, I find that the majority of those who choose answer #1 are afraid to question their beliefs. I cannot trust someone claiming that they are the only one who knows the absolute truth, especially if they have not even examined the alternatives because they are scared of what they might find.

I've trusted a lot of horrible people, and will probably continue to do so.
Why? Because I'm gullible, maybe.... or perhaps I want to see the best in people.
Gullible is probably the same thing. But lies are silly. I trust horrible people because they are silly.

I agree with you on this. You may get hurt once or twice in life, but if you never trust anyone, your life becomes hell to live.

"There is no lie or relative truth which will bring about the most important changes."

Consider the following poem...

At the Muezzin's call for prayer
The kneeling faithful thronged the square;
Amid a monastery's weeds,
An old Franciscan told his beads,

While on Pushkara's lofty height
A dark priest chanted Brahma's might,
While to the synagogue there came
A Jew, to praise Jehovah's Name.

The One Great God looked down and smiled
And counted each His loving child;
For Turk and Brahmin, monk and Jew
Has reached Him through the gods they knew.

[Author Unknown]

Each of the characters in the poem above believe something different, yet every one of them has found the truth.

Why do you not trust someone who claims the truth?

Because 10000 people all claim the truth, each telling a different story. Perhaps all of them are right. I won't trust one who claims that they are the only one who is right.

"Do you want to stay in a world ordered by chaos?"

It is the world that God put me in.

If he wanted us to be 100% sure, he would put a big sign of fire in the sky saying "I am God" so that everybody would be absolutely sure.

There is a reason why God hasn't made it crystal clear, I believe that our search for truth is part of the reason why we are here on earth.

You've heard of Hegelian dialectic before, right?
That's one of the principles of Freemasonry.

The checkered floor meaning the interplay between light and darkness.

It has occurred to me that this seeming dialectic, light versus dark presided over by a metaphorical worshipful master, the principle of three..... is a contrived one. Mimicking God, but not actually God.... and that's why the dialectic falls apart into pure chaos at the end. That's why there's always a limit, and then it all destroys itself. It's not eternal. It is entirely mortal, afraid of its own limits, entirely blind to its own demise, and therefore cannot be capable of being a rational system of ordered living.

Freemasonry is a contrived dialectic. That's what I'm saying.

The Rituals of Freemasonry were designed by man to provoke thought. Through reason and thought, we are able to see which virtues are the most important in life, and which ones we should subscribe to.

There is no dogma in Freemasonry. No enlightenment. We never claimed that there was. But it gives us a tool to discover for ourselves which path is the right one for us. And perhaps there is a different 'right path' for each person, as illustrated in the poem above.

reply to post by KSigMason


Not my opinion at all. What masons do you talk to, anyway?

The "safe" ones?

reply to post by Thurisaz


When you have 7 billion people all believing something different, that is pure anarchy.... and that is what is being sold to the world.

Anarchy isn't a good thing. Especially when it is paraded as "freedom".

The proof is in the pudding. Obviously not everyone's pudding, but the collective pudding.

It's worth it to step back and look at the general picture, the "whole"... and not get lost in tiny details.

I remember that poem you quoted... where was that from again?

OH WOOPS wrong poster.... I meant to quote Saurus!

reply to post by Thurisaz


Thank you. There are similar threads like this....

A lot gets lost in specific names and specific outer manifestations of concepts which have a common origin.

I believe that is where the confusion lies....

In masonry, I feel that it just feeds that confusion and for a certain few it infuses that confusion with a sort of semi-transcendental insanity, which is dangerous.

Although.... I went through it. There's no reasons why others can't come to a similar consensus.

We live on one planet and we are one species. If there are 300 million people living in the United States, and each has a completely different perspective on everything... we're headed for nothing but ruin.

A House divided against itself cannot stand.

The republicans should be working in tandem with the democrats, and not fighting with them.

That is one killer metaphor right there, for anyone who gets it.

reply to post by PnezakYahakotima


It just tickles me to see you say things like "in masonry" when you have no friggin clue what happens "in masonry". You have never been a mason. You were not initiated, passed, or raised. You have never been in an open lodge. How is it that you so arrogantly claim to know about masonry? Oh yea, because you read Crowley. Well, you are apparently at the same level he was in masonry, which is zero. He was not a member of a regular lodge. Clandestine. So what he learned may or may not have been anything like what real masonry is.

I think it's cool that you love Jesus and all. Just don't turn into a religious nut job like some of the loons you talk to here. Those guys are Waaaaaaay out there.

Good thread OP, despite the hard skeptics railing you on the specifics about Masonry (what with the smoking monkeys on ATS anyways? are they a cult?), whatever. Good discussions regardless and you write in a way that makes one think, I don't believe all that you say but I'll ponder it for a second.

My basic concerns about Masonry are simple. They are a huge secret organization based on knowledge, rituals, symbology, and ancient gnosticism (if I understand correctly)... and most you can actually look up in published material now (I'm reading Book of Azrael right now, and it's all about reincarnation so far, and is Freemason reading material), it's no longer a secret, but it sounds CRAZY. Like Scientology crazy. Most of the supposed claimed illuminati messages out there are also heavy on the ancient gnosticism, which is why I suspect you always see people heavily versed in christian prophecy speak out.

Again, my main concern is at the highest level of this kooky secret society they claim to give you the ultimate knowledge of creation and such, yet most of this countries highest leaders and ruling elite are masons and look at the state of affairs! If they know some ultimate reality yet they create this hell for us, then what do they know? Or are they crazier even still for believing in this extremely bizarre sounding mysticism? Their LAW that seems to keep coming up in this thread is knowledge, but it is not shared for the good of humanity and their fellow animals. It is used to extend posterity and other selfish means.

You take a look at some of our close animal relatives, the Bonobo chimps, and they solve everything with the law of LOVE. They a bit promiscuous sure, but more relaxed and motivated than their cousins the regular "smoking" chimps which have turned to murder and cannibalism. I don't think chimps have secret societies do they?

reply to post by PnezakYahakotima

It is your opinion and I know many Masons, too many to list.

reply to post by Aliquandro

Freemasonry isn't crazy or kooky.

Also, name the leaders who are Masons and what Lodge they belong to.

reply to post by network dude


I'm going to just say that there are outer masons and there are inner masons. I've been a mason for incalculable amounts of time.

I think masonry should find its roots, is all.... not be fooled by the outward signs or the inward imposters...

"The road to Hell was paved by good intentions."

Tell the Founding Fathers that one.

reply to post by Aliquandro


Well you can break down unfiltered undiluted undeceived masonry down to this phrase right here:

Om Tat Sat.

In eternity, no stone shall go unturned.

Everyone is a mason by their very existence.

reply to post by Aliquandro


The thing about the state of masonry now and for some time now is that it is presided over by a false god.

The word of the aeon is this:

"desperation"

This false god is not eternal, and has for some reason disassociated itself from its eternal source, and in doing so.... it has disintegrated and become nothing more than living death. A crazed zombie. An insatiable robot. A glorified beast.

As it stands now, masonry is presided over by a dead god.

Which is why this mock "raising" from death to life is so deceptive...

You're only raised as far as this entity wants you to be raised. You are still in darkness, even in this mock "light".