Mysterious creature attacks animals in Shelby County, Kentucky

Originally posted by Tazkven
reply to post by Xquizit

 

I said these were big cat prints but after researching this awhile I believe that not to be true anymore. Was reading that all cats retract their claws while walking, Is this not true? That would make the prints canine then, right? Either the predator is a big dog or these could simply be prints of a dog someone saw close by one of the slaughtered animal's ...

The print in the OP is not a cougar print, it is the print of a domesticated cat. And if the prints are being confused with cougar prints, then I would say that it was quite a large kitty.

The only time a feline leaves claw marks in its print is when its running, otherwise, feline prints will typically not show any claw marks.

In the OP's photo, the triangular shape of the toes and their placement are feline. The middle pad of the print is the visual demarcation point between cougar and domesticated cat. A cougar would have a triple bulge in the lower portion, making the middle pad much wider. The domesticated cat has more of a double bulge in the lower portion, making the middle pad appear more like a rounded upside-down V.

The only other animal this might possibly be is some sort of fox. But like I said, if the prints are being mistaken for a cougar, then that's a pretty big-ass fox.

www.bear-tracker.com...

I've lived in the Wichita Mountains in Oklahoma all my life. I've seen 1 cougar. They are heavily populated out here. I've seen one. If you have a small breeding population, you'll probably never see one. Very well could be a cougar.

I spent a lot of time in the woods of Kentucky when I was younger and (thankfully) never saw a cougar when out there. Heck, I never even saw a deer, though I did catch a glimpse of a coyote once.

However, I vividly remember being on a school bus on a field trip and as we rode down a major highway, I saw a very large, tan-colored animal laying on the side of the road. At first, because of the color, I assumed it was another deer roadkill, but then I saw the large paws. I could barely see the head, but I knew instantly when I saw those huge paws, there was no mistake, it was a big cat. I am 100% certain that what I saw was a large dead cougar on the roadside. I remember finding it so odd because I was always told that big cats didn't live in Kentucky, and I remember trying to point it out to other people on the bus as we drove by but no one else saw it. I looked for it on the way back but I didn't know the area at all and didn't see it again.

In more recent years I've heard tales from local hunters and land owners who swear they saw a big cat on their property. I remember a story from one guy who said he was out on his property when he saw what he thought was a very large black house cat at the edge of his property, but once he saw it jump up into a tree, he knew it was no house cat because of it's size. He claimed he sighted it with his gun and realized it was some kind of big cat, and he took a shot at it to scare it off, but accidentally hit it and killed it. He was afraid that he had done something illegal by shooting it, so he left the remains where they were and didn't tell anyone. I urged the person who he told the story to to try and have the guy go find the remains and send them in to be identified because it could potentially be a new species (you always hear about the large black cats), but it apparently happened several years ago and the remains may be long gone (I wish I knew for sure!).

That looks more like a canid track to me.. any wolf sightings in the area?

U P D A T E

Ten animals have been viciously attacked in Shelby County, Kentucky but experts say they may know who the culprit might be -- and the answer may surprise you.

WADDY, Ky. (WDRB) Dec 13, 2012 5:22 PM EST -

Kevin Cox's three donkeys have impressive built-in alarm systems, but unfortunately, they have not kept a predator from attacking a white calf and others a few weeks ago.

"I noticed it was covered in blood. Then the other two come up, and I noticed that their ears were shredded," said Cox.

"This one was the worst one," Cox pointed out, "(it) tore his ears up pretty good. I'm lucky that's all it did."
Days later, Cox says the animal came back for more. His daughter's goat was mauled.

"It tore its ear off completely," Cox explained.

His neighbor's goats were not so lucky.

"They was pretty bad off," he said. "It just literally tore the faces off of them."

Those goats had to be put down. Altogether, six goats and four calves have been attacked -- and soon, there will be an extremely vulnerable target on his farm.

"This heifer right here, she's about to have a baby next month," said Cox.

So Cox has set out to try and trap the animal -- or at least catch it on camera.

Whatever it is, it is vicious.

But what is it? Kentucky Fish and Wildlife experts say it's likely not a wolf, big cat, or some sort of "mythical" creature.

and here I was hoping for more of the chupacabra angle, hey I am not on ATS for the comradery

"That's indicative to a canine dog, a coyote is more of an oblong round," said Sgt. Doug Detherege, examining one of the tracks left by the animal. "If it was a big cat, it wouldn't show any toenail marks at all."

And they think the dog is domestic, and likely has been contained by its owner, since the last attack was over a week ago.

"A wild animal is out to either feed, or defend itself," said Detherege.

Source

They seem to be leaning towards a domesticated dog, seems logical I suppose considering there have been no attacks in over a week now and the animals are being mauled and not eaten. Maybe, someone noticed how bloody their dog was and heard of the attacks and chained the animal up or put it down to avoid being liable for damages.

That or whatever it was has moved out of the area ...

Originally posted by Starcrossd
That looks more like a canid track to me.. any wolf sightings in the area?

Not that I have read, I do not live in that area so I honestly do not know. The story did make local news here in Louisville though WDRB.

Cougar


Jauguar

Yes, these are Jaguar paw prints. (minus the actual Jaguar thankgoodness!) We were hiking at Mayflower state park in Belize earlier this month when we spotted these prints. We actually saw quite a few paw prints during the hike. I guess it only makes sense that the Jaguar would choose to walk on a trail just like humans do. And get a load of the huge claw marks.

I love this stuff -

It's not nice for the animals injured or killed - or the owners. But how amazing is it to think that they might be moving back into their old territories?

They'll all be hunted down and killed probably - so I probably shouldn't be so excited by this - but still...

for comparison, Wolf

Originally posted by Spiramirabilis

I guess it only makes sense that the Jaguar would choose to walk on a trail just like humans do. And get a load of the huge claw marks.

This reminded me of the story of the big cat stalking a well used trail and killing hikers. Is a dangerous situation when animals no longer fear humans.

Knowing that and with live stock being killed, like you, I believe these animals will be hunted and killed. One thing for sure is there are no lack of guns in rural Kentucky.

reply to post by Tazkven


Absolutely - it's one reason they aren't really in the states anymore to begin with - they weren't tolerated by the ranchers and were hunted to near extinction

What a gorgeous animal - would give anything to see one in the wild

Even if the wild in this case includes rural Kentucky

:-)

Heck guys thats not a cat track in the photo. It is 100% canine. Notice the nail marks. Cats dont have those. Also check out the center pad. It has three lobes to it. Two in the bottom and one on top. Thats a canine. Cats have three lobes on the bottom and one large roundish one on the top of the pad indentation.

This was on our local news last week and a hunter spotted the culprit..it is actually 2 wild dogs. A shephard mix and a rottweiler/dane mix. Sorry it is nothing more exciting than that. I live close by. That is the only reason I know.

I don't know what might be killing those animals, and I certainly think there are still cougars (and maybe some other big cats...) in the Eastern states, but that track doesn't look like that of a cat. Looks like a dog track, on every detail. Here are a couple of links you can use to see how to tell them apart:

dog, cat, cougar, bobcat, and coyote tracks

dog vs. cat tracks

The animals simply being killed would seem, also, to indicate a dog. Some feral dogs will do that sort of thing.

Now, all that aside, I have a cousin in Kentucky that assures me cougars are NOT extinct there! I don't know why the wildlife people want to make that claim, but too many people see them, in too many Eastern states, for it to be true.

I just watched a special on NatGeo, with a couple of guys tracking cougars in the wild, and talking about how very hard it is to actually SEE one, that isn't captive. It's not easy, and that would certainly explain why some states have no official numbers for them. I could understand them stating they don't have any "official sightings" (as though their eyes are any better than anyone else's...), but claiming they are extinct there is going too far.

reply to post by Spiramirabilis


No, not jaguar, either (though I do think those are a LOT more widespread than the authorities admit to) - NatGeo video - look about a minute on and after

Its the wolfman..

reply to post by LadyGreenEyes

The interesting thing about tracks is it depends on how big an animal, what kind of course - front paw/back paw - and what the conditions are where they were walking - wet or dry

Nail marks are present on the jaguar print I posted - and the print posted in the OP is at an angle - there's also nothing to show us size of course - so we're all just guessing

:-)

but as long as we're just guessing - I'm gonna guess big - and wild
www.unexplained-mysteries.com...
kyprp.blogspot.com...
www.sfgate.com...
www.mtpioneer.com...
www.conservation.alabama.gov...
Now - I realize that a lot of this veers away from the scientific and rational...but people see things - and then try to make sense of what they've seen. People tend to guess mountain lion because here in the states we have mountain lions - they're not exotic and it makes sense

Quite a few sightings report black cats. Jaguars are more often melanistic - there aren't any credible reports of black cougars. Jaguars could easily be here in the states - there's a lot of stuff out there saying they have been - and they are. They're actually worried the border fences along the southern border will mess up their ability to migrate

A black panther is typically a melanistic color variant of any of several species of larger cat. In the Americas, wild 'black panthers' may be black jaguars (Panthera onca), while in Asia and Africa, black leopards (Panthera pardus); in Asia, possibly the very rare black tigers (Panthera tigris). Smaller wild cats, like jaguarundi, may also be black.

en.wikipedia.org...
Now - I grew up in a rural area where there were a handful of mystery cattle maulings and deaths that they couldn't quite figure out

Turned out to be the 4 Irish wolfhounds that lived down the road from me - and - nicer dogs you've never met - I loved those dogs. Especially one in particular that had a kind of crush on my Irish Setter - sweetest dog in the world

Also - a known cow killer :-)

Who knows what this is - but like I said - gonna guess wild until they prove otherwise because the idea of Jaguars in Kentucky is too fun to let go of

reply to post by Spiramirabilis


Oh, I am right there with you on there being big cats in a LOT more locations than they admit to! Not just cougars, but jaguars, as well. There is NO reason they could not spread out all over the United State, and they are, after all, very stealthy hunters. Even the cougar is hard to locate in the wold, in places where people LOOK for them. If they (the official folks) are not looking, well, they aren't going to find any save by sheer dumb luck.

Fact is, there is a pretty good chance we have jaguars where we live, too. "Middle America" area. My younger son said he saw a really big cat (and he's VERY familiar with all sizes of domesticated cats, and even bobcats) in a tree across the street from us. Now, there are supposed to be cougars hereabouts, but this cat, he said, was spotted. Now, I know what he sounds like if he's making something up, and what he sounds like when simply reporting something he saw. This wasn't some made up story. Looking at pics online, he said the spots looked closest to jaguars. I know, too, one night when the teen and I were walking the dogs (two large ones we had at the time), something was stalking us around the neighborhood. The dogs were both acting very antsy, and we could feel something watching. I am talking a predator here. So, yeah, I can fully accept that these cats are around! Too many people have seen them, we have pictures and video that are verified to be way larger than domestic cats, and livestock taken out by them.

This track, though, I still think is that of a canine. it isn't just the claws, because those can, on occasion, show with a cat. it's more the pad shape behind the toes. If you check those two links I posted, you can see that with cats, you have two lobes near the toes, and three at the back of the "heel". The track found around those killings doesn't have but one near the toes, like a dog, and two at the back, also like a dog. Plus, it looks just like the prints our old Rottie mix used to leave. Didn't someone post that they found two wild dogs roaming around there, too?

Still, I would not give up the idea of cougars, and maybe even jaguars, in those parts! Just because this track, and maybe this case, weren't caused by them doesn't mean they aren't there. As I said before, I have a cousin in Kentucky that says she and others she knows have seen cougars. I have been following the large black cat sightings for a long time as well. They are real, and they are NOT all mistaken house cats! Not even most, is my bet. I think there are spotted ones about too.

When I was in high school, we lived in San Antonio. Visiting the Witte Museum there, one favorite room of mine was one they had set up (don't know if they still do or not) as a large "diorama" of sorts. Trees, plants, etc, and stuffed real animals here and there all through the place. Local animals, all. Birds, small mammals, javalinas, and even a jaguar. Walking through ,the challenge was to see if you could spot all of them. At the end, they had a little diagram showing where they were. The jaguar, virtually NO ONE spotted walking through. Even looking at the diagram, it was hard, and this was a stuffed one. When you did spot it, you would get a real chill, because that sucker was maybe three feet from the "trail", behind only some low bushes. Very good camouflage! I think the fish and game people don't want to admit they are there, because then they would have to take on more responsibilities. I do find it very interesting that, when some rancher reports one of these large black cats, they tell him there aren't any there. Then, when the same guy says, so if it comes back, I can shoot it, right? Since it isn't real? Then, they tell him, no, he can't, because they are protected. Non-existent cats get protection?

Originally posted by k21968
This was on our local news last week and a hunter spotted the culprit..it is actually 2 wild dogs. A shephard mix and a rottweiler/dane mix. Sorry it is nothing more exciting than that. I live close by. That is the only reason I know.

Thanks for the update, I live close too .. In Louisville and is how I caught the story.

After reading your post I went and checked and here is a link to the News Story you may have saw from local news ...

WDRB news story

No need to apologize although I was hoping it was a chupacabra

reply to post by LadyGreenEyes

When I was in high school, we lived in San Antonio. Visiting the Witte Museum there, one favorite room of mine was one they had set up (don't know if they still do or not) as a large "diorama" of sorts. Trees, plants, etc, and stuffed real animals here and there all through the place. Local animals, all. Birds, small mammals, javalinas, and even a jaguar. Walking through ,the challenge was to see if you could spot all of them. At the end, they had a little diagram showing where they were. The jaguar, virtually NO ONE spotted walking through.

the fact that you have a favorite room tells me you're a museum geek - and a natural history museum geek at that :-)

so am I - nice to meet you

I think the fish and game people don't want to admit they are there, because then they would have to take on more responsibilities. I do find it very interesting that, when some rancher reports one of these large black cats, they tell him there aren't any there. Then, when the same guy says, so if it comes back, I can shoot it, right? Since it isn't real? Then, they tell him, no, he can't, because they are protected. Non-existent cats get protection?

lol - and that sounds exactly right - hilarious those guys. But they have their reasons :-)

edit to add - you just know this is going to turn out to be a dog - but who knows - maybe we'll be surprised

reply to post by Spiramirabilis


I do love natural history museums. Anthropology, too (though I don't always agree with the mainstream consensus on some things).

I think this was the dogs someone said they found, but I still think it's only a matter of time before one of those cats kills a person (like cougars do in western states), and the whole thing blows wide open.

I know that cougars are making a comeback here in West Virginia. I was camping last fall, walking around in the woods at nite and we heard a "cat" like growl, but it wasn't. Took my flashlight and looked up in the trees and spotted a cougar! We high tailed out of the area! So cougars are not extinct like the "experts" says.