The Nazis A warning from history.

I watched this documentary the other night and found it quite chilling. Especially with the way things are going in Europe at the moment, it does seem like we are heading back to the 1930s in many ways. There has been a rise of right wing groups throughout Europe due to the political and financial crisis.

What I found most disturbing, was the way in which, good normal citizens could turn on sections f their community and perform the most awful acts. I'm sure we all like to think we would never be swayed into behaving like the Germans and others during ww2 . That maybe we would have stood up for those being persecuted and tried to help.. Or would we have been complicity given our own prejudices and the circumstances?

Watch it, and let me know your thoughts.

Arguably one of the most important documentary series ever made, The Nazis: A Warning from History sets out to show that, far from being a uniquely German aberration, Nazism fed upon and was fostered by the prejudices and lemming-like inclinations of ordinary people. Although culminating with the atrocities of the Holocaust, these programmes are equally good on the motives of otherwise perfectly normal people, who needed only the tacit encouragement of the regime to perpetrate horrors against their enemies, their neighbours, or their own family. When confronted with evidence of their Nazi past, elderly former party members are often unable to find any other justification for their actions than simply that they could get away with it. Far from being a monolithic dictatorship which compelled the citizenry to act in rigidly prescribed ways, the Nazi state just allowed people to give their worst inclinations free reign.

Human cloning researcher, Richard Seed, throws an ugly spin on the subject.

“We are going to become Gods. Period. If you don’t like it, get off. You don’t have to contribute; you don’t have to participate. But if you’re going to interfere with me becoming God, we’re going to have big trouble. Then we’ll have warfare." en.m.wikiquote.org...

Hitler subscribed to the Aryan master race ideology ...that the ancient Aryans were a superior Nordic race from northern Germany who expanded into India, where they established the Vedic religion, the ancestor of Hindu and Buddhist faiths. 

It's no coincidence today that eastern spirituality is pushed in our culture, hidden and disguised in many forms

"ascension"
"spiritual awakening"
"global consciousness"
"spiritual evolution"
"the Christ consciousness"
"evolution of consciousness"
"the divinity within"
"dimensional uplift"
"transhuminism"

....Hinduism, New Age, Freemasonry, Shiite Islam, Buddhism, Mormonism, ufology channeling, Christian cults, the UN  etc etc etc - all promote the idea that they will "ascend" to god hood in some variant. It's a rehash of the Aryan beliefs. All promote within their literature one thing which must happen in order for it to happen;

1) "Fundamentalists" must be eradicated because they will prevent the "ascension" and "enlightenment". 

Gosh - a world stirred by their teachers and leaders to crucify Christ Jesus all over again - a world determined to reach the Heavens on their own terms without their Creator. What was, will be again. Those words are Truth.

reply to post by woodwardjnr


We are heading in this direction again and things seem like they will get worse before they get better
The Nazis hijacked a movement for their own personal gain when people are desperate they will follow anyone who seems to better the way things are.

Nazism had great potential well some of it anyways if the holocaust never happened they would be seen in a very different light after all they did bring a new age of medicine and technology to us, and some of the ideas were great.

At the moment we are seeing movements everywhere on this little blue gem lets hope that things that start off with good intentions does not get hijacked and turned bad by a few evil men though I fear the worst

All of you would be surprised to know that there are several extreme right wing groups here in Japan who are similar to the NAZI`s of the 1930`s and 1940`s. When democracy reaches a point in which it is totally dead locked to the point of not being able to operate in tandem with society, the extreme right wings are usually the first ones to attempt to will the power vacuum in society. If you are lucky, there will also be a strong Socialist or New Left bloc to act as a counter balance to the extreme right. In Germany it appears the socialist actually tried to take over the government to try to fix the dead lock democracy found itself in; but the extreme right had too much support from bitter war lusting troops who fought in World War One.

Now we are a bit removed from the NAZI`s and WW2 but we have conditions here in Japan which are similar. Democracy is still a very new idea of Japan; both culturally and historically. Japanese democracy has always been an odd term considering that Japan has never really had democracy even after the great reform of society that happened after the end of the war. The old guard in Japan simply played it smart with the Americans in order to rebuild the nation. They knew that the empire was over and the days of being a military power would have to be forgotten for several decades; if not longer. So, the emperor, and the military was striped off all government power. The ruling families, non-royals of course, and members of the military government(who did not get sent to gallows) formed a new political party called the Liberal Democratic Party. The LDP was able to form a government and rebuild Japan. It was only recently, 2008, that the LDP finally control of the government to the Democratic Party Japan(DPJ). The DPJ was created by former socialist and former members of the LDP.

Remember the ruling government only changed more than ten years after the economic bubble crash which has caused Japan economy. The change did nothing to improve the situation here in Japan. It has been business as usual. Even after Fukushima, the government is still nothing more than a bureaucratized dictatorship of the ruling class in Japan. If does not matter who you vote for in Japan because the system will remain the same.

The system in Japan has now reached a point of total dead lock. Nothing is getting done and leaders cannot make clear decisions due to massive corruption, ineffective government agencies and conflict of interest across the board. This has lead to the raise of extreme right wing groups in Japan over the past several years. They are very loud and have gotten violent many times. They drive around in black vans, with pro-emperor,anti-socialist and anti-immigration slogans painted on them, screaming out pure hate for anything progressive in Japanese society. They blame all of Japan`s problems on immigration and socialism, This summer they even attacked an old man, who told them they were crazy for wanting to end Japan`s socialized healthcare and national pension program, at one of their rally`s in front of a very busy train station.

Currently, a new political party is being formed by three extreme right wing, and politically power, leaders in Japan in an attempt to take over the government during the next national elections to be held, mostly likely, next year.

An increase in extreme right wing group is cause for concern in any society, The NAZI`s proved what can happen if such elements of society gain control of the government.

reply to post by woodwardjnr

s and f
i have watched about all of the warning from history series and then some.
the one you describe i recall the expressions on the faces in the crowds
when confronted by the actions of the brownshirts/reich followers. i observed
many faces filled with the fear of finding themselves on the business end.
people reported on a whim or old differences/fall-outs seemed to have suddenly
found an outlet. many ordinary germans suffered a snitchers fate whether
innocent or guilty. did it really ever go away?
one comment i read a while ago was a chap who observed the situation and
described it as collective resignation/collective apathy amongst those who
had the capacity to realise where it was headed but were powerless to act.

yesterdays viewing (not too sure it is the same series)was the massacre at malmedy
where 81 american soldiers of the 285th field artillery observation corp were executed
after capture. remember the cockleshell heroes? only two returned. the reich policy
was as brutal to it's native people as it was to commandos/soe/sas. the order for execution
came from dolf himself.

my thoughts are revolving around an incident (warfare) leading to the rise in fascism rather
than the build-up priori war that operated under the guise of national-socialism.
aspects of control and subjugation tactics used by the reich are, it seems at the disposal
of many current governments imo.
f(uk).

S & F...good stuff...seen it before.

I also recommend the documentary "The rise and fall of the Third Reich"...also good stuff. Certain parallels to modern society cannot be ignored.

Originally posted by woodwardjnr
I watched this documentary the other night and found it quite chilling. Especially with the way things are going in Europe at the moment, it does seem like we are heading back to the 1930s in many ways. There has been a rise of right wing groups throughout Europe due to the political and financial crisis.

What I found most disturbing, was the way in which, good normal citizens could turn on sections f their community and perform the most awful acts. I'm sure we all like to think we would never be swayed into behaving like the Germans and others during ww2 . That maybe we would have stood up for those being persecuted and tried to help.. Or would we have been complicity given our own prejudices and the circumstances?

Watch it, and let me know your thoughts.

Arguably one of the most important documentary series ever made, The Nazis: A Warning from History sets out to show that, far from being a uniquely German aberration, Nazism fed upon and was fostered by the prejudices and lemming-like inclinations of ordinary people. Although culminating with the atrocities of the Holocaust, these programmes are equally good on the motives of otherwise perfectly normal people, who needed only the tacit encouragement of the regime to perpetrate horrors against their enemies, their neighbours, or their own family. When confronted with evidence of their Nazi past, elderly former party members are often unable to find any other justification for their actions than simply that they could get away with it. Far from being a monolithic dictatorship which compelled the citizenry to act in rigidly prescribed ways, the Nazi state just allowed people to give their worst inclinations free reign.

edit on 3-11-2012 by woodwardjnr because: (no reason given)

All true and can happen anywhere. One of the many reasons why I find the cult of personality and sheer fanatacism that surrounds our current POTUS a bit frightening. When people worship politicians, bad things tend to happen.

If the Nazis are a warning from history, then it is a warning that even goes ignored in the nation to which the Reich arguably did the most harm. Its own.

www.bbc.co.uk...

It is a warning that even my fellow countrymen cannot seem to heed. We have the BNP and the EDL here in my country, who are mostly just drunken, ignorant scum without a moral fibre to rub together between them, and the more serious Combat 18, who, although less active in the last ten years than they could have been, are still dangerous in thier seats of power in the divided north of England.

Europe in general is a melting pot right now of hate, something which history has PROVED is a bad idea, and can never be a legitimate part of a real political platform.


rt.com...

I can only say this. It is the duty of every free man and woman and child, in every nation, to prevent the rise of right wing extremism, wether it is religiously or politically motivated. If we allow this cancerous muck to infect our societies, we damn ourselves, our children and our childrens children to a hell built on our apathy, a hell that we already know the architecture of.

On a personal note, I will not allow fascism and intolerance to raise its head in my presence. I would rather go to hell, coated in the blood of a thousand fascists, than go to my grave with clean hands, but guilty of appeasing oppression. My grandparents would turn cartwheels in thier graves if they thought they had spawned a family which would not fight just as hard, or harder to prevent the spread of this disease, as they did.

As should read.

"The Money A warning from history"

Every political thought is somehow backed by greenbacks.

-period

reply to post by TrueBrit


This was one of the reasons I made this thread. After reading some comments made about immigrants in the uk. It made me wonder how some of the sentiments expressed in the posts could be manipulated into real life actions under the right circumstances. I just wanted to avoid calling people directly out on it. So I thought maybe a video reminder could be a more subtle approach. Just look what is happening with the Golden Dawn in Greece and like you say the sentiment of the likes of the EDL.

reply to post by TrainDispatcher


It's more concerned with human psychology and how it can be manipulated very easily to do ver bad things.

Originally posted by woodwardjnr
reply to post by TrueBrit

 

This was one of the reasons I made this thread. After reading some comments made about immigrants in the uk. It made me wonder how some of the sentiments expressed in the posts could be manipulated into real life actions under the right circumstances. I just wanted to avoid calling people directly out on it. So I thought maybe a video reminder could be a more subtle approach. Just look what is happening with the Golden Dawn in Greece and like you say the sentiment of the likes of the EDL.

Do you not feel ALL extremes are dangerous? The reason I ask is that I have often seen many condemn one extreme, promising to go down fighting them, while ignoring what the other extremes do, indeed sometimes seemingly to me, making excuses for similar behaviour..

In recent recent years the local March for England has ended up as a battle between supposed left and right.. and the way that happened is that it some supposed Anti-fascists from Bristol thought the March in Brighton (like others) would be racist, and planned to smash these fascist/racist marchers (I know as I, and others who knew Brighton voiced our concerns at the time)

Just happens the march, you know being Brighton (the hotbed of homophobic racism that votes for the evil Greens) was a fun day out for families and kids that usually ended with a picnic on the lawns, bands like the Ghurkas would occasionally join in and March along, then the likes of the EDL hear that there will be supposed anti-fascists at the March and so decided to join themselves...

So what was a pleasant family lark has turned into a left vs right battle, I guess it just replaces the bank holiday battles between Mods, Rockers and Skinheads that I grew up with, but in this instance it was the supposed anti-fascists that created the situation.. I am sure there are plenty of others times where the supposed fascists have created a similar situation..

But I get so furious that some only see the danger in one extreme, when the others are pretty much equal in my eyes. Personally I will fight against all extremes as I see them ALL as dangerous and see them all as at risk of becoming the new brown shirts..

I have to admit that I guess I see myself more as a clubman from the Civil War era, wanting to defend my area, my friends, my family and my home from the ravages of either extreme and will probably get my arse handed to me for that position.. but I honestly can not see any other position to take other than oppose all forms of extremism.


Edit to add:
I DO feel sure that we are heading for a repeat of WW2, the whole landscape is far to similar and scary for my liking, I can't tell how close we are though..It feels like it'll now only take one significant incident and the whole deck of cards will fall.. but who will be seen as the new evil after than I have no idea... but what I do know is that we (as a nation) are equally at risk of becoming the new evil, indeed some already say we are.

reply to post by thoughtsfull


I can understand what your saying, but I think the other reason I was inspired to make the tread was after watching the Newsnight feature on the Golden Dawn in Greece and how the police had started to have supporting members,and how if citizens had problems with immigrants the police would send them to Golden Dawn for help. So it was directed at those with anti immigrant sentiments. But I can see what you are saying about those on the other side too. Those anti fascists who end up being just as fascist in their own methods to silence opposition with group think and violence.

It's interesting how the extreme ideologies take on an attraction at times of economic crisis. Let's just hope we can be a little more sane in the uk. I mean in all honesty neither right wing or left wing extreme groups have much popularity in the UK. For now.

reply to post by woodwardjnr


I certainly wasn't having a dig, just voicing my concerns as I'm more a Clubman than anything else

But it is interesting to note what you saying about Greece, and indeed if you reflect on the partisan groups in Greece during WW2 even they where split left and right, and from what I have read fighting each other as much as they fought the Nazis.

It seems little consolation to know that the strip of water between us and the continent is about all the separates us, but a separation that seems to me ensures things like this move at a lot slower than they do on the continent, the fall of the Templars took a while to get here, While the Witch hunts happened they where more muted, and the British Union of Fascists and British Communists where not nearly as entrenched in society as they where in Europe.

But without a doubt we get to the same place at some point even if in some instances the similar events are a little muted, and we would have got to a similar point as the rest of Europe vis-a-vis communism/fascism if WW2 had not broken out.. Given the global death toll of WW2 I am not sure if that is a consolation or not.

In my opinion the landscapes are strikingly similar, that is as similar as geopolitical, economic, societal, militaristic landscapes can go after seeing 70 years worth of changes, but we certainly seem to living in an equally divisive world that is moving further to the extremes.

the sad thing is that I do honestly think we are verging on another conflict, the expression for me that really sums up the similarities between the then and the now is that we are again at a spot where no one is willing to pay the price for peace, nor are they willing to pay the price for war... and if there ever was a door opener to rip society apart it is that indecisiveness.