US Army has no mountain warfare or airborne divisions anymore?

A friend today told me that the US Army's 10th Mountain Division is just a normal light infantry division and they have no actual mountain warfare capability akin to the German Gibrigsjagers, Italian Alpini, French Chassuers Alpins, etc. Basically the "Mountain" name is retained for historic/ceremonial purposes. I have also found out that the same situation applies to the 82nd & 101st Airborne Divisions - certain units have jump training but the majority of personnel are not airborne qualified.

Is this true? Why in the world did we give up large scale airborne assets and our entire mountain warfare capability? I mean we are fighting a war in Afghanistan - one of the most mountainous terrain in the world

reply to post by ChrisF231


The 10th was used during WWII. After that it wasn't needed for fighting in the mountains of Italy/
The 10th Mountain Division was reactivated in 1985 and kept the "mountain" designation for historical purposes but has been a light infantry division since 1985.

First of all, stop believing your "friend" because he is most certainly misleading you. Special Forces obtains 'Mountain training' during their Q-course just as Rangers and Spec Ops receive swamp training in Florida

101st and 82nd are still very active Airborne Divisions. I was a member of the 101 for 5 years up until a year ago.. we have Air Assault 82nd has Airborne. Air Assault is repelling out of helicopters (black hawk), and Airborne is para troops that deploy around 800 ft in the air via parachutes out of a C-17 or C-130.

In fact, SOME 82nd detachments at 101st conduct Airborne activities there. Seen it with my own eyes.

We are still a very capable military, believe you me.

31B

reply to post by ChrisF231


It depends on the individuals really... Mountain training, jump school, etc. are things your usually ASKED to do.

When a person displays the potential to be elite they will be asked if they want to go to specialized training. It doesn't necessarily have to do with the division their in.

Live here in NC and have frequently traveled past Ft Bragg in Fayetville, NC... also known as "Fayet Nam" and believe you me... they still jump out of big ol' C-130s by the hundreds just like the movies.

Also travel past Blackstone, Va and the Army Post there... they do para training there... every week see a big ol' C-130 lumbering around in a circle... and then a series of parachutes pop open and drift slowly down across the countryside.

I was recently in the 82nd. Have you ever jumped out of a C-130 at 0200 to start a three week FTX? "Hint, hint" When you hit the ground in the middle of darkness and you here someone crying out or see a red chemlight, that person needs medical attention. I have, and that was actually not too long ago....... Multiple times.As a side note, the 101'st is not a true airborne division. Yes they use the moniker of airborne and plenty of guys are airborne qualified, but they don't really conduct true airborne operations.

reply to post by GD21D

As a side note, the 101'st is not a true airborne division. Yes they use the moniker of airborne and plenty of guys are airborne qualified, but they don't really conduct true airborne operations.

Really? What would you classify Air Assault missions then? Hover Borne?

Air Assault is more effective to date since Air Borne Soldiers are barely used. That is a fact. Last time para troops were used was in 2003 and it wasn't even a real combat jump. They were used more in the Gulf War, however, Air Assault is still used in places in Afghanistan.

United States Combat Jumps

Well, I see it's already been covered, but just to reiterate the point, your friend is simply wrong. I am former 82d Airborne Division, and every single individual in the 82d (with the exception of warrant officer aviators) are REQUIRED to be on jump status. If you get injured and are permanently taken off jump status, they will force you to change units.

Also as mentioned, the 101st Airborne is Air Assault, which is an airborne insertion, but done out of helicopters using ropes.

Lastly, the 10th Mountain definitely does mountain ops and training. When I was at West Point and we conducted our mountain training, the 10th came down to conduct that training, and those guys were intense, top notch mountaineers.

So, rest assured, the republic is well protected by some very well trained and hard corps mountain and airborne trained individuals.

OP: Not sure exactly what you are looking for, or trying to research, but it would help if you let us know the scope of what you need to find out.

I have very recently been cadre at the Army Mountain Warfare School, and I still reside just outside the gate, literally.

You should research the 86th IBCT, part of the VTARNG. The history of the unit is rich in and of itself, however you may find the more recent things the unit has done to be of particular interest to you. I am not sure what is public information, so I will refrain from saying much more and give you something to research.

Originally posted by 31Bravo
reply to post by GD21D

 

As a side note, the 101'st is not a true airborne division. Yes they use the moniker of airborne and plenty of guys are airborne qualified, but they don't really conduct true airborne operations.

Really? What would you classify Air Assault missions then? Hover Borne?

Air Assault is more effective to date since Air Borne Soldiers are barely used. That is a fact. Last time para troops were used was in 2003 and it wasn't even a real combat jump. They were used more in the Gulf War, however, Air Assault is still used in places in Afghanistan.

United States Combat Jumps

edit on 24-8-2012 by 31Bravo because: (no reason given)

Taken offense so easily? I assume you think I was taking a dig at the 101stPersonally I don't really care about division rivalries. Also, if I would have chosen to extend active duty time I would have definitely had the Air Assault course in my contract. Seeing how come time to be promoted to senior leadership qualifications take more and more precedence.My point was more directly referred to the OP in regards to Spec Ops not being in use by the American military currently. And yes Air Assault may be more effective in the current type of combat we're engaged in, but if there comes time to invade a competent country you would definitely see airborne ops used to seize an airfield and set up insertion points.

reply to post by GD21D

No.. sorry if my response seemed standoffish.. Goes to show how reading can be misconstrued as offensive

Originally posted by ChrisF231
A friend today told me that the US Army's 10th Mountain Division is just a normal light infantry division and they have no actual mountain warfare capability akin to the German Gibrigsjagers, Italian Alpini, French Chassuers Alpins, etc. Basically the "Mountain" name is retained for historic/ceremonial purposes. I have also found out that the same situation applies to the 82nd & 101st Airborne Divisions - certain units have jump training but the majority of personnel are not airborne qualified.

Is this true? Why in the world did we give up large scale airborne assets and our entire mountain warfare capability? I mean we are fighting a war in Afghanistan - one of the most mountainous terrain in the world

In addition to all the responses, the Marine Corps has it Mountain Warfare training in Bridgeport Ca that it cycles it's deploying units through.

BS on your friend.

The 10th mountain division still has mountain training.

And we have several airborne units.

the 101st ABN is an Air Assault helicopter fast rope type of unit.

The 82'd and 75th Ranger are airborne and are trained in mountain warfare.

All SF units are airborne.