Calling all "Fighters", a new debate series.

reply to post by Pinke


I think that perhaps you are psychic !

I had already a good base prepared for my second post and you hit the nail right on the head when talking about filming !!

I will tell you that I enjoy this a lot ! I knew that you DO KNOW what you are talking about regarding moon landings as I perused threads here and there about it. I find it an honor to be contesting your views.

Regarding the three posts, I also find it extremely hard. And 5000 characters per post...not even funny !

But this is one of the greatest experiences I have lived on ATS thus far and do learn a great deal from it !!!

Will say more after I conclude. Hey, Pinke..

reply to post by SonoftheSun

Regarding the three posts, I also find it extremely hard.

I am advocating a 4 post debate, and the staff had set a 3 post limit, so we go with 3.

In my own debate, I've run through my opening, and main, and the next posting will be my closing. The 3 post limit restricts your "linking" and "quoting" ability, and likewise, I've refrained. (Minimal example. I'm running the lean end.)

I'm reading the others as well, and see the challenge 3 posts present.

Is it too restricting? I honestly don't know yet.

There seems to be a surge of 4-5 debates that spring up, and run, then resolve, which is a far cry better than having 1 debate from Jan to Jun. Any activity is a plus, aye?

I'm confident the staff will work things out. That said......

I have a new suggestion.

Emphasis on SUGGESTION.

Make the debate forum a monthly contest like the SS forum.

The winner of each debate wins ?

Logistics: Many.

Members toss in ideas for debates for the month, and mods pick a list of ten. Members pair, debate, get judged, then get to join another. You get a whole month to gather points/flags. Monthly total decides.

Yeah, I am suggestion prone, but I just wanted to toss those ideas out. A monthly comp is easier to keep track of, aye? It would probably give a bit more structure, given the rules. Ideas, Ideas.

Just ideas.

Originally posted by Druid42
I have a new suggestion.

Emphasis on SUGGESTION.

Make the debate forum a monthly contest like the SS forum.

I like that, though the most obvious question is whether we can do a tournament type debate series every month. Unlike the Short Story judging, a lot of the merit in a debate is based on one's opponent, so it would have to be a "tiered" format, with multiple wins needed to take the monthly crown, and that takes time.

One alternative might be:

1) Moderator announces the topic for the monthly contest
2) Any "Fighter" can respond, in either the positive or negative, with one post, 5,000 character limit, which is PM'd to the moderator
3) When the time is up, moderator posts all submissions, and voting decides the top "pro" and top "con".

The winner of each debate wins ?

Bragging rights, I suppose, unless a custom title (along the lines of "Fighter") could be arranged.

Originally posted by Druid42
I am advocating a 4 post debate, and the staff had set a 3 post limit, so we go with 3.

In my own debate, I've run through my opening, and main, and the next posting will be my closing. The 3 post limit restricts your "linking" and "quoting" ability, and likewise, I've refrained. (Minimal example. I'm running the lean end.)

I'm reading the others as well, and see the challenge 3 posts present.

Basing post numbers on the particular agreed debate might be an okay idea, or ensuring the topic is narrowed down a bit. It's good to have to think about character count but it can take a long time to strip out a post. It won't put me off too much if it stays at three, since it's a unique challenge anyway.

I find it's just as time consuming though to do three posts since you got ot be *really* tight.

Make the debate forum a monthly contest like the SS forum.

The winner of each debate wins ?

Alternate dumb suggestion ... why not just do it based on seasons? Four to eight month seasons. Each debating person is given a 'rating' based on their win/loss ratio that season. Members with more debates get a leg up over those with less. IE ... two members have a 30% win ratio. The one with more debates is put on top. Two tables, one for season and one for overall rating.

I don't actually like the tournament style since too many persons have real life chaos going on and it puts pressure on everyone. This would mean if people have time for lots of debates, they can do it. Also it means moderators won't be having to moderate large influxes of debates. IE ... tournament time = 16 debates. It will just be a steady number of debates over time as people come and go.

Ok, not all suggestions are good.

If monthly contest equals tourney then we are not ready for that. The staff is tossing the idea of a 8 person tourney, but that's down the road.

Suggestion retracted. Bad idea.

Onwards.

Almost done my debate.

Crazy suggestion! Can we have seperate posts to list references? Some references end up being over 100 characters long ... >.>

Originally posted by Pinke

Can we have seperate posts to list references? Some references end up being over 100 characters long ... >.>

Or being allowed a 2 post opening, a 2 post rebuttal and 1 post for the closing statement. I agree that it would facilitate the debate, putting the count up to 10,000 instead of 5000. Sources, links and pictures do take out some precious character counts, especially when extrapolating on ideas.

I think that Pinke and I would both agree that The Moon Landing Debate could have used those extra characters !

Just my opinion.

Originally posted by Pinke
Almost done my debate.

Crazy suggestion! Can we have seperate posts to list references? Some references end up being over 100 characters long ... >.>

We cut down the size of debates and also limited the character count because we want to encourage more "using your own words/points/rebuttals" than a extreme-linking-contest.

So, for now, the answer is no.

For now Debates are 3 posts each. The main reason the Debate Forum stopped being used and read is because of the size of debates which nobody was that interested in reading.

Originally posted by Skyfloating
We cut down the size of debates and also limited the character count because we want to encourage more "using your own words/points/rebuttals" than a extreme-linking-contest.

So, for now, the answer is no.

Is fair enough. I guess I come from an academic environment which means referencing facts etc etc ...

For me, in this environment, writing off the top of my head would involve producing 'original research' which would require considerbly more space than a couple of pictures and 5000 characters. Most of the references I want to use are concepts, events, or studies. In this instance it's actually difficult to fit my thoughts in between required 'ground work' infos.

I guess in more philosophical debates there would be less desire for referencing.

I just work with it

Side note: my only other real concern is handicapping my opponent by not including enough research sources. I guess we see how it looks when we done.

My braaaaaaaaaaaaaaain ... !?!?!?

Okay I'm done! Good debate SonofSun.

Ahaha and you over exagerate my abilities. I'm just a tiny person.

I did rethink my response regarding referencing though ... I won't argue with the guidelines but I did almost get tempted to host publically available documents on my own server to lower down my url size or cut out information from my referencing to get more characters.

I won't really be offended if a moderator turns around and says 'oh your entire debate is just a copy paste and that's exactly what we're trying to avoid! That's the moderators call. I think debates like this are research heavy. What I will say is I don't think debaters should be punished for trying to reference correctly to give others a chance.

By all means push for more 'correct' referencing etc ... but I'd rather not be punished because the book I'm reading has a long title. >.< I do think the five offered references should be allowed to be seperate but not the quotes.

reply to post by Pinke

Okay I'm done!

And so am I !! This match was great ! I think that no matter what we think, there is overwhelming evidence that we did go to the moon. At the very least...this match shows parts of that evidence.

Thank Goodness we didn't have to debate aliens waiting there !!!!!

It's all for the judges now. Win or lose, this has been a very enjoyable experience, and yes, I am still honored to have debated your opinions on the subject.

All in good Fun !!

Thank you druid for having put up this thread. I have now created an OFFICIAL one and hereby close this one.

Please continue there.