Liberals Believe That Voter Fraud Doesn't Exist:

The sides are polarized once again on the issue of voter fraud and the ##SNIPPED## believe that it doesn't exist.

They call racism and targeting minorities as a sign that the republicans are trying to stop democrats from voting. Hold on here for a moment. Don't most young people have IDs? And two if that. One to get into clubs illegally and drink and party with friends? Second why would minorities be targeted if they have to show an ID to vote? YOU NEED AN ID FOR EVERYTHING!!!!

I just cannot believe how many people can think that voter fraud does not exist...

Fraud? 1099 Felons won by 302 ballots

Cases of Voter Fraud "Virtually" Non-existent

Hannity Yells at Democrat for Calling Racist Card/Saying Voter Fraud Doesn't Exist

Laywers Stunned After Lead Plaintiff in ID Case Gets ID Anyway

Come on liberals. Wake up and smell the coffee!

reply to post by jjf3rd77


I take offense to this. Once again, ATSers are painting a whole category with a broad brush because a few members of that group, or a few people who identify themselves with it, have made an ill-informed statement or voiced an opinion in an area.

Leave the liberals out of this. And stop labeling people! Every time you label someone, you have created "divide and conquer".

Give me a break.

reply to post by jjf3rd77

They call racism and targeting minorities as a sign that the republicans are trying to stop democrats from voting. Hold on here for a moment. Don't most young people have IDs? And two if that. One to get into clubs illegally and drink and party with friends? Second why would minorities be targeted if they have to show an ID to vote? YOU NEED AN ID FOR EVERYTHING!!!!

Did you REALLY just blanket statement all liberas as underage drinkers out partying? Did you really just justify voter suppression by saying that?

Are you kidding?

The GOP have passed these Vtoer ID laws for the simple fact that MOST new voters in the last election were democrats. It's a political game.

But my god..your assertions are just down right hillarious.

Btw I'm neither replican, nor democrat, I'm a canadian...but your complete and utter lack of respect towards peopel who don't agree with you is astounding.

~Tenth

reply to post by jjf3rd77


Yes, there are a lot of fake IDs out there. So to ostracize hundreds of thousands of Americans over a miniscule amount of voter fraud, and demand that they use the highly counterfeited IDS, just show how dumb the right really is.

Oh, and their agenda....

Voter ID, which is going to allow Governor Romney to win the state of Pennsylvania, done," he said to applause at a Republican State Committee this weekend,

OUt of the mouth of Mike Turzai, the Pennsylvania GOP House majority leader.

The only people committing voter fraud here are the Republicans.

Well the post is false because I do believe voter fraud exists, and I am democrat .. but lets be more specific ... there are two specific categories of voter fraud.. in person voter fraud and everything else...


Republicans are asking that a photo id be required to vote because of IN PERSON voter fraud..in other words, someone voting as someone else.. Do you know how many times this has actually happened? . there have been 5 cases of in person voter fraud.. The other type of voter fraud is fraud that happens after the votes are cast.. miscounting.. etc

So lets look closer at this.. what does requiring a photo id to vote do? .. it mostly effects the lower class..those people who can't even afford a car and therefore just never got their photo ID .. or someone like my mother who's elderly and can't drive so hasn't bothered to renew her license in years..

To put it bluntly.. the requirement directly impacts the democratic base... the republican base tends to be the wealthier lot, they are almost certainly not going to be impacted by this requirement...

But lets put this back to perspective.. the republicans are trying to put in a rule based on something that has happened a grand total of 5 times.. out of the entire population that voted... 5 times... it's an absurd thing..

They are suggesting a fix for something that isn't even broken... only happened 5 times!

Show one example of voter fraud effecting the outcome of an election. If it is so rampant as the GOP would like us to believe then one example shouldn't be hard to prove.

reply to post by nixie_nox

The only people committing voter fraud here are the Republicans.

What did I just say in my last post? Labeling = divide and conquer. Besides, laying blame isn't even CLOSE to the first step of finding a solution...that's what we want, right? A solution? Or are we all content to point fingers and scream about who's more at fault?

:bnghd:

reply to post by AfterInfinity


It is only Republican states that are enacting voter ID. ANd name one Democrat official that supports it.

The solution here is to eliminate Voter ID and stop letting the Republicans use the Constituion to wipe their butts.

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by nixie_nox

 

The only people committing voter fraud here are the Republicans.

What did I just say in my last post? Labeling = divide and conquer. Besides, laying blame isn't even CLOSE to the first step of finding a solution...that's what we want, right? A solution? Or are we all content to point fingers and scream about who's more at fault?

:bnghd:

No solution is needed in this case.. as I said, only 5 instances of in person voter fraud in the entire country were found when they looked into it .. so this photo id thing is absolutely un-necessary.. the only thing it will do is prevent some people from voting.. it will mean my mother can't vote for example.. elderly who don't drive, the poor who can't afford a car... folks that tend to be the democratic base..

This move is a calculated move, it will help Romney.. it's strategic.. there's no other way to explain it because you simply don't inact rules like this for 5 cases out of millions of voters..

I'm a liberal and I believe that voter fraud exists. So I guess you thread is about as valid as me saying that all Conservatives make unfounded and outrageous claims.

Both are gross generalizations and are therefore fallacious.

~Heff

Another study that went back all the way to the year 2000 found only 10 cases of in person voter fraud.. 10 cases in over a decade...

articles.philly.com...

A new nationwide analysis of more than 2,000 cases of alleged election fraud over the last dozen years shows that in-person voter impersonation on Election Day was virtually nonexistent.

The analysis of 2,068 reported fraud cases by News21, a Carnegie-Knight investigative-reporting project, found 10 cases of alleged in-person voter impersonation since 2000.

With 146 million registered voters in the United States, those represent about one for every 15 million prospective voters.

Yep.. one out of every 15 million... ERMAHGERD .... FRAUD! .. the voter id thing is nonsense.

The analysis found that there was more alleged fraud in absentee ballots and voter registration than in any of the other categories. The analysis shows 491 cases of alleged absentee-ballot fraud and 400 cases involving registration fraud. Requiring voters to show identification at the polls - the crux of most of the new legislation - would not have prevented those cases.

So the new id requirement wouldn't have prevented the worst cases .. it would have done practically nothing

Another "free thinker" plays the us vs. them card.

reply to post by jjf3rd77


Any law, that even risk the chance that one person who is legally able to vote would not be able to is bad.

Is it so hard to imagine people that perhaps did not take the time to renew their state ID's due to the fees involved?

If one person who is allowed to vote can't, than these laws are bad.

If they where to say, give out voter ID's free every time a citizen register to vote, while thats a different story, but none of these laws do that.

Originally posted by buster2010
Show one example of voter fraud effecting the outcome of an election. If it is so rampant as the GOP would like us to believe then one example shouldn't be hard to prove.

Since 2000 there have been less than a thousand total cases of fraud.. including absentee ballots and everything else.. that is the sum total of every election since 2000, so the number is actually smaller when you break it out per election..

So even if they fixed all of those issues it still wouldn't have had any effect.. at all

The only effect this will have is preventing those who are legally allowed to vote but are without an id, from voting.

reply to post by benrl


THANK YOU!

Anything, that prevents one citizen from voting, is an unconstituional law. I don't care how much fraud there is.

But the fact that the party that screams patriotism and the members who cry that their rights, especially gun rights, are being taken away, are the ones standing in line, trying to keep Americans from voting.

This is beyond disturbing.

Not quite the chorus of high-fives and easy stars and flags you had hoped this thread to be, eh OP? lulz. McKayla says it all for me.

reply to post by nixie_nox

Its bad enough that only 30% of eligible voters turn up to vote, we don't need more laws shrinking that amount, when 30% vote its only the extremist of both parties that come out.

And people wonder why America is the way it is, when both have to cater to the extreme left and right of their parties that vote.

This is beyond disturbing.

The only interest of either of the two parties is holding what they perceive as power. Neither have a vested interest in the truth or whats good for Americans.

Meanwhile you get a ruling like Citizen untied which pretty much guarantees that the two party's have to pander to the rich and corporate interest on top of all of it.

reply to post by jjf3rd77

TextLiberals Believe That Voter Fraud Doesn't Exist:,

Because it doesn’t, it’s just another program for the 'Muppet puppet sheeple to believe', as the herder understands that they can say what they want to say, as the little sheeple will come running with eyes wide-open, bushy tail and all ,with ears ready to listen to what they are being told to believe.

‘Sad and pathetic’…but very funny.

reply to post by jjf3rd77


Yet you don't believe the massive voter fraud the GOP commited to keep Ron Paul as far away from the nomination as possible. Oh the hipochracy.

I ask, how many people do not have ID? And cannot get one?

We have to have an ID for everything these days, to drive or any kind of public travel, to write checks or use credit cards, to obtain any kind of federal or state benefits, and so on. Why not to vote?

I also ask, how anyone can determine a conclusive number of fradulent votes without any identification of voters? Any number presented by the left to justify their argument of 'no voter fraud' is suspect, simply because they cannot substantially prove it.

And...I think the OP meant to represent all liberals that are trying to retain office....as I know several hard-core liberals that have no problem with voter ID. However most of the public discussion from elected liberals are in opposition to it.

Now those that oppose it and make accusations that it is 'disenfranchising' voters - if a citizen cannot make the effort to secure an ID to vote, they are too lazy. It's not that hard to get an ID. Note the person that recently travelled to DC to testify about the difficulty of her being able to travel across her own city to get an ID??? What a crock. Why should we make it easy for lazy and uninformed citizens, that do not participate in our society, to vote on the direction of our society? No WONDER our government is so screwed up.

If it was me, I would REQUIRE more than voter ID, I would DEMAND proof that the citizen is informed and casting a vote based on issues and concerns....not celebrity status and popularity. Of course, that will never happen since it could be abused to shut out citizens. Voter ID is the best we can do.

How many countries allow voting without ID? Certainly few of the developed countries, and even some of the third-world countries prevent it.

And finally, who will be disenfranchised by this? The poor? If they get any kind of gov't. benefits they have ID. The elderly? Yes, some, this may be the most affected group...., and a lot of those are Republican.

It is utterly STUPID to support the opposition against voter ID. There is no reason not to support it, no one can prove or disprove the amount of fraud....until voter ID is instituted everywhere and the effect is noted.

Finally, anyone that cannot get motivated enough to get an ID is not participating in our society, probably not working, and not receiving benefits, probably not keeping up with the issues, and therefore are simply too ignorant to be allowed to participate in the direction of our country.

Too lazy to get ID? Too stupid to vote.