Reaching brain capacity.

I know this sounds like a non issue, but with the advances in genetics, nanotechnology, and pharmaceuticals it is a very real possibility, many say a certainty. That not just people being born now, but you and I could very well live to be 200 - 300 years old 1,000 yrs. Or forever.

Forget all that nonsense about sustainable populations and food and everything else. We're humans, since when did little things like details ever stop us from doing something?

Cambridge University geneticist Aubrey de Grey has famously stated, “The first person to live to be 1,000 years old is certainly alive today …whether they realize it or not, barring accidents and suicide, most people now 40 years or younger can expect to live for centuries.”

Link

"I and many other scientists now believe that in around 20 years we will have the means to reprogram our bodies' stone-age software so we can halt, then reverse, ageing. Then nanotechnology will let us live for ever,"

Link

It sounds kind of crazy, but that's just the way it is. Ready or not, it will happen. And probably sooner rather than later.

The human brain consists of about one billion neurons. Each neuron forms about 1,000 connections to other neurons, amounting to more than a trillion connections. If each neuron could only help store a single memory, running out of space would be a problem. You might have only a few gigabytes of storage space, similar to the space in an iPod or a USB flash drive. Yet neurons combine so that each one helps with many memories at a time, exponentially increasing the brain’s memory storage capacity to something closer to around 2.5 petabytes (or a million gigabytes). For comparison, if your brain worked like a digital video recorder in a television, 2.5 petabytes would be enough to hold three million hours of TV shows. You would have to leave the TV running continuously for more than 300 years to use up all that storage.

Link

So I was thinking, at some point our brains will get full. What happens then?

I don't doubt that at some point we will be able to "defrag" our brains, or download unnecessary memories to clear out space in our heads.
But how will we know when we reach that point? Because somebody is going to find out the hard way, I assure you. Will your mind stop forming new memories? Will our minds automatically start overwriting old memories? Or will we go into vapor lock?

I for one am interested to see what happens. What are your thoughts?

reply to post by watchitburn


(Puts hand up)

My brain is full.

May I be excused?

I..... hm.... wow.
I don't know? But I can guarantee I will now spend a good portion of my current brain power mulling this over. Since our bodies are designed for efficiency, and the way we already store and access memories, is it plausible that the brain would just start dumping rarely or never accessed bits? You've raised a compelling question and I wish I had something more to add besides my blather....

reply to post by watchitburn


That's pretty cool. As for our brains getting full, OK... obviously you would start forgetting some things and replacing them with new memories. I sure as hell don't remember everything I've ever done....not consciously anyway. Besides, if technology keeps expanding as it has, I'm sure we'll solve that little problem with iCloud for the brain,.... or some kind of memory expansion device. I don't see problems. I only see solutions.

reply to post by watchitburn


To answer your question, we will most likely choose to discard all memories we do not wish to hold onto. We will always have space as there will always be events that occur in our lives that are not relevant to us anymore.

I for one am interested to see what happens. What are your thoughts?

Me too, but I thought brain function was significantly differnet than computers.
The article cites 10 reasons why,

Difference # 1: Brains are analogue; computers are digital-
It’s easy to think that neurons are essentially binary, given that they fire an action potential if they reach a certain threshold, and otherwise do not fire. This superficial similarity to digital “1′s and 0′s” belies a wide variety of continuous and non-linear processes that directly influence neuronal processing.

Difference # 2: The brain uses content-addressable memory-
In computers, information in memory is accessed by polling its precise memory address. This is known as byte-addressable memory. In contrast, the brain uses content-addressable memory, such that information can be accessed in memory through “spreading activation” from closely related concepts. For example, thinking of the word “fox” may automatically spread activation to memories related to other clever animals, fox-hunting horseback riders, or attractive members of the opposite sex.

Difference # 3: The brain is a massively parallel machine; computers are modular and serial-

Difference # 4: Processing speed is not fixed in the brain; there is no system clock-
The speed of neural information processing is subject to a variety of constraints, including the time for electrochemical signals to traverse axons and dendrites, axonal myelination, the diffusion time of neurotransmitters across the synaptic cleft, differences in synaptic efficacy, the coherence of neural firing, the current availability of neurotransmitters, and the prior history of neuronal firing. Although there are individual differences in something psychometricians call “processing speed,” this does not reflect a monolithic or unitary construct, and certainly nothing as concrete as the speed of a microprocessor. Instead, psychometric “processing speed” probably indexes a heterogenous combination of all the speed constraints mentioned above.

Difference # 5 – Short-term memory is not like RAM

Difference # 6: No hardware/software distinction can be made with respect to the brain or mind-
For years it was tempting to imagine that the brain was the hardware on which a “mind program” or “mind software” is executing. This gave rise to a variety of abstract program-like models of cognition, in which the details of how the brain actually executed those programs was considered irrelevant, in the same way that a Java program can accomplish the same function as a C++ program.

Difference # 7: Synapses are far more complex than electrical logic gates-
Another pernicious feature of the brain-computer metaphor is that it seems to suggest that brains might also operate on the basis of electrical signals (action potentials) traveling along individual logical gates. Unfortunately, this is only half true. The signals which are propagated along axons are actually electrochemical in nature, meaning that they travel much more slowly than electrical signals in a computer, and that they can be modulated in myriad ways.

Difference #8: Unlike computers, processing and memory are performed by the same components in the brain-
No such distinction exists in the brain.
As neurons process information they are also modifying their synapses – which are themselves the substrate of memory.

Difference # 9: The brain is a self-organizing system-
This point follows naturally from the previous point – experience profoundly and directly shapes the nature of neural information processing in a way that simply does not happen in traditional microprocessors.

Difference # 10: Brains have bodies-
This is not as trivial as it might seem: it turns out that the brain takes surprising advantage of the fact that it has a body at its disposal.

Now aside from that, I think the quantum computers may transform our current method of storing and processing which may go beyond brain comparison capacity all together. So I don't know if our brains will become full to the point of requiring management, but who knows. Surely if it becomes an issue, there will be ways to address it.

Maybe our brains will grow in size or density? Plus, how big is the sum of all knowledge anyway? Anyone know? Maybe our brains will begin to shrink because of efficient and compressed data processing and storage.
All speculation on my part, but a thought provoking thread for sure.

Peace,
spec

I have been accused of being full of something other than brain capacity, so it would be nice to be called something other than what I've been told.

I have a really small head for an adult. I have to wear a kid's size ball cap, so does that mean my brain will become full faster than others?

Really, thanks for the information, it's already got my head swimming! Very interesting!

Originally posted by 2manyquestions
reply to post by watchitburn

 

That's pretty cool. As for our brains getting full, OK... obviously you would start forgetting some things and replacing them with new memories. I sure as hell don't remember everything I've ever done....not consciously anyway. Besides, if technology keeps expanding as it has, I'm sure we'll solve that little problem with iCloud for the brain,.... or some kind of memory expansion device. I don't see problems. I only see solutions.

Our brains are good at remembering things our subconcious mind thinks are important. So if it works similar to this then we are more likely to forget things we don't consider valuable first.

Thanks for all the interest in this everyone.

reply to post by 2manyquestions


Just because you can't remember something doesn't mean it's not still in your head. It's just the process that we use to access those memories that becomes problematic.

reply to post by speculativeoptimist


I don't think the sum of all knowledge is what takes up the most space, even if one person could learn it all. It's everything you have done throughout your life, it's all still in there.

There is also a project ongoing right now called The Human Brain Project. Where they are building a digital brain, cell by cell, neuron by neuron. But I think last I heard it was going to take another 20 years or so.

Maybe we'll get all these answers around the same time, that would be convenient.

reply to post by watchitburn

I don't think the sum of all knowledge is what takes up the most space, even if one person could learn it all. It's everything you have done throughout your life, it's all still in there.

Good point, I was just trying to compare an individuals life experiences to something similar in quantity for an example. But that may be an inaccurate approach I guess.
Yea, the extended life span for humans would seem to require additional brain storage. Maybe external hardrives will become fashionable to wear.
They already have a pill to wipe memory from people that have had traumatic experiences that inhibit them from functioning normally. So either a pill, or some other technique for specified memories, or a general defrag like you mention for a clean slate, but man that would be tricky. Once they have that brain built, a whole new field of science will be spawned. I bet it will not take 20 years to build it at this point, as fast as Moore's law is becoming antiquated.

reply to post by speculativeoptimist


I was watching "Through the wormhole with Morgan Freeman" the other day. They were talking about some guy who had some kind of accident or disease (I can't remember , anyway, he couldn't form new memories and after a while he was unable to identify himself when looking in a mirror. This suggests that memory, even short term memory plays a large role in self perception and your ability to function in the world.

And leads me to think, getting rid of memories completely might not be such a hot idea.

Originally posted by speculativeoptimist
Maybe our brains will grow in size or density? Plus, how big is the sum of all knowledge anyway? Anyone know?

....Look no further than the NSA's new Utah center! They know. They know... everything...

*queue creepy music*

Those blasted yoda bites. I mean, yottabytes...

reply to post by watchitburn


I kind of like the idea that longer life would be possible, until I consider the goons around us today, and I realize these people don't deserve a natural life span. There's that issue of the evil ones living longer, probably, while the good people of the world can't afford it.

Heck, the power hungry can't stop their war machine. It seems odd we would be able to extend life through genetic means, while still killing using bullets and bombs.

I for one am not looking forward to a bright future. I've been around long enough to see the horrors that we commit, for regional "democracy" and "peace" of course. (When we don't even have democracy here....how the hell can we spread "it"?...what "it"..?)

Anyway, hate to be the downer here. Funny she mentions accidents or suicide. Lots of us do die by suicide, but it's just so gradual, that we don't realize it. Many illnesses are a direct result of us failing to eat healthy or stopping smoking or whatever. Diabetes, heart failure, lung cancer...lots of preventable diseases.

reply to post by watchitburn

Its happening NOW! Our brains our doing crazy miraculous things only you can imagine

reply to post by watchitburn


What if.. say the # 8, it represents Eternal Life, the, "forever," you mention.. One's center, HEART, working at it's best (meaning getting heart rate to maximum sustained & regular basis; there is a feeling of total peace, love, joy.. & one with HIM (GOD) TRIUNE, FATHER, SON, & HOLY SPIRIT. The body is like this, the 8, heart center & with GOD, the blood circulates through the body, toward the head, then back through, there is no end to this.. eating only what is healthy & what one needs, pleasing GOD..

Then when The Lord Returns & if a person is desirous of that connection with HIM, Forever, there is this HEART DESIRE, this LIGHT & LOVE, where embracing, GOD, self, others, the capacity is thus endless..
that's how I see it.
I don't think we need nanotechnology or computers.. at least when JESUS Comes Back.. it will be this magnificent event, soon likely..
Maybe spurred on by the sun's events (all that transition & what it does to the body).. but I think it's about being HEART CENTERED, that 8 (Eternal) & ready to transition.. LOVING, Believing, in HIM.
Thus the brain, heart, body, soul, is ALIVE & always taking in what matters.. pure & true..
The Veil Lifted, Eating from the fruit in Heaven & drinking from The River of Life..

Heavenly.

(can you see it?)

Also,
thinking like this & that God Knew, "us before we were in our mother's womb," thus there is this pure energy allowing all to flow, through self (with God of course!) that love & thoughts & Not just of this earth now but of the Heavens, & of the angels & the stars, this etheral self, that is able to hear not just what man says but what God Says, always, that connection..
to me that is what this capacity thing implies & more of a potential & connected to/with GOD. GOD Is The Alpha & Omega, & as His Servants, living forever in Heaven, with The Lord, I just can't even imagine how wonderful.. & living this NOW, by imagining that 8, eternal, as one is able, to be the best they can be here on this earth.. yeah I can see it.. 1000 yrs +.. Eternal...!

reply to post by Awakened2012


Yes! I got myself off of every single medication (I was still on one for medical reasons but got myself off that this last yr successfully & Much happier without it. It was for my thyroid & I had some telling me there is no way I could not take this.. It had built up to toxic levels after 10+ yrs taking it & was shutting my body down.. I am now free of it & feel remarkably better off of it!).. & I already love to exercise & eat healthy.. & feel that I am asking God To Help me to make this transition to highest self & with HIM.
I knew I had to be off ALL medication (or that was /is my intent).. to get to that place I wanted/needed to be.
I realize some are forced to take medicines & not saying anything for /about anyone else, but just that I think in Heaven, through this transit to.. Heaven, the journey HOME, will be about purity, so there is no false self, but authentic & believing in all things, as God Says.. & the capacity to be.. healthy, happy, loving, forever in the land of plenty.Where GOD feeds our brains, our very selves always.. The LIGHT /LOVE overtakes us, that we move through to be with HIM.amen.

I remember this episode on Outer Limits. It is about this guy who was injected with nanobots meant to repair damage and keep him young. Well, the nanobots went a little bit farther than that. It started making improvements, unwanted improvements to the man....like an eyeball in the back of the head so he could see from behind....

This thread reminded me of that episode....just something to think about....

Originally posted by watchitburn
That not just people being born now, but you and I could very well live to be 200 - 300 years old 1,000 yrs. Or forever.

Gods I hope not.

Well, look in the bible or mythology for verification. Some people could live to be eight hundred years old in the past. They were considered gods and the wisdom of someone three hundred years old would be great. I think there are very old people living in the world today, they aren't going to tell us or they would get no peace and would be looked at by scientists with hungry eyes. They would be smart and their brain would have to have balanced chemistry to allow repair of cells. I doubt if I will be offered these drugs because I am not willing to work till I am 755 years old to pay for the meds. I'll stick to being mortal, I tire of watching this world getting destroyed everyday and would not like to live another seven hundred years watching this happen. I wonder what the side effects of this new technology are? Greed or crabbiness?

reply to post by watchitburn

Man I love that show, and get excited after watching it so much I try and tell everyone about it!
Yea, losing one's identity capacity sounds frightening for sure, and makes me think of a society with no individuality, a collective hive of sorts. I sometimes wonder if we are heading in that direction or will individuality always be part of us.
I also wonder if dementia and Alzheimer's could be natures way of defragmenting information overload in some brains. I doubt it, but you know, in the spirit of wonder...