Anti-War Protestors Come Here!

I want an Anti-War Protestor, or more than one it
doesn't matter, me and every other proud american
that comes to this forum will. I want you to explain to me why you dont think this war is just.

What a lead in topic.... It should have been titled, "If you think violence is wrong come in here and I'll beat the hell out of you to prove it"

Wow. How can an intellect so awesome as Nightwalker's be kept in our small abode. He needs to be set free. He needs to be sent out to kill America haters all over the world or die trying... and this needs to be done quickly before he can reproduce!

Oscar Wilde once said, "Patriotism is the last refuge of the scoundrel." But before you start questioning yourself, nightstroller, take comfort in the knowledge that he was Irish and a fag, and can be dismissed on those basis alone.

What does one tell such an open-minded person about the anti-war movement? I can't think of anything. Surely this gentle man has thoroughly looked at all opposing view on this matter before starting such a revolutionary topic?
I won't waste his time pitifully attempting to assert so grievous a position as pacifism.
You are set free, stove Ranger. Breathe deep.

You can now return to watching television, night-whatever, I believe the O'Reilly factor is about to start.

If you think violence is so wrong, why dont you head over to Compton or LBC and protest some Crips or Bloods? Dont be hypocritical. Have you ever punched someone? Pushed someone? Slapped someone? Verbally abused someone? I bet you have. These are all forms of violence. Also, since youre new here, I wouldnt start off by insulting people.

Originally posted by Tetsuo-51
If you think violence is so wrong, why dont you head over to Compton or LBC and protest some Crips or Bloods? Dont be hypocritical. Have you ever punched someone? Pushed someone? Slapped someone? Verbally abused someone? I bet you have. These are all forms of violence. Also, since youre new here, I wouldnt start off by insulting people.

I believe Voice_of Doom made his comments based on the fact that violence is of course wrong.

Ill tell u why I hate this war. Its not good for America, thats why its unjust. Saddam is an asshole, yeah, so? he was a CONTAINED asshole.

Have any of u pro war dogs really measured the long term effects of this war? On US??? The economic, military, and social concequences? U think we gonna march in, and everyone gonna love it? Its not going to cost us a dime? that we will not create new enemies that will come to haunt us later?

I am a hawk, not a dove. But the people screaming for war are nots hawks, but vultures: big ungainly birds who pick at corpses. A hawk looks at his prey, sizes it up, stdies it, then dives in with prescision knowing that his prey was worth his time. Iraq isnt. Sure some people want us there. others dont. And there are so many #ing factions over there that basically were kept from killing each other when saddam was in power...now theres no such fist on them. What have we stirred up? Saddam was a beast, a amonster. true, i cant say i disapporve of seeing him bite the dust. But what about the people he supressed, and the rivalries he pretty much canned? How will this affect us in the long term? Hvae u thought of that?

We will spend billions to rebuild Iraqi schools and mosques, while we will close down more of our own. we will rebuild thier homes while we lose our jobs and get kicked out of ours. We will give them security from invasion while our own borders remain wide open. We will slowly drive up our national debt while they become the next Al Sauds.

Attacking iraq harms America. attacking Iraq benefits traitors like bush. It feeds the wealthy companies that have shipped american jobs overseas. It makes more people in the world hate us and look forward to our demise.

Have u even given a thought to the long term concequences? probably not.

Turn off the despicable brainwash machine called the boob tube and sit down and really think about it.

There are worse threats out there. We need to face them before they face us..behind our backs.

I can't wait for our 'leaders' to push things so far that revolution occurs. I can't wait for the whole corrupt machination to fall apart. Let them all stand trial for war crimes.
On a personal level, I think violence can be art (such as the movie The Matrix) I think conflict is the creator of all things. Tobe embraced and cherished as one of the truly human virtues.... I even believe violence can be fun. Do you know that there are similar brain changes and endorphins secretians when man is actively engaged in violence as when he is copulating.
Have you ever watched the raw power, the violence of animals in nature. I watch my cat chase bugs with prowess of a martial arts master. Its a beatuiful thing to see.
Imagine if Bushie Jr actually went into battle like the leaders of old did..... I might actually find a little respect for him... a little.

Its patriotism I can not stand. A patriot is one who mouths the same words that "authorities" put in there ear, bypassing the brain entirely. Patriotism is the lowest form of submission a human being can put themselves in. It reeks of the same sublimating and putrid stench as the christian religeon.
Both forms of atrocity make slavery and obediance a virtue. Pathetic

Finally, If this is the kind trollop that passes itself off as intellectual discussion at abovetopsecret, Im glad to be a newbie. This place needed fresh blood.

P.s I appreciate the support, Info. I love a pacifist with balls!

Originally posted by Voice_of Doom
P.s I appreciate the support, Info. I love a pacifist with balls!

No problem Voice, I knew you were a good guy after I read your post and wanted to make sure your hazing went smoothly.

This war is actually being fought for a very good reason. This reason has not been publicized widely simply because it is not what most of the world would consider to be "politically correct", especially since about 50% of the core of the world power structure is directly opposed to it.

Very simply, Iraq, along with Iran and Syria, favor converting the international oil standard currency from the US dollar, where it has been for the past 50+ years, to the Euro (which has only come into existence in the last few years). All three of these countries intended to force a vote in OPEC to do so this summer, with Iraq being the strongest of the lot as the 2nd largest oil producer in the world.

If this happens, first the entire US economy will collapse in short order. This is because the oil standard is the ONLY hard assett backing the US dollar currently has (the gold standard having been bastardized long ago). Soon thereafter, a good chunk of the rest of the world economy will slip into deep depression. The only way out of this enormous economic abyss will be world war, and we will see FAR more death and destruction than what we even expected to see in Iraq.

The main opposition to this is of course France and Germany. This is simply because they stand to win bigtime in terms of the economy when thier new currency suddenly gains a huge hard asset backing.

Is the US bloodthirsty because GW decided to risk American lives in Iraq, where he knew he could win with a minimum of bloodshed, versus waiting maybe 10 years, when the US will have 75% unemployment, and we will be desperate, and will have to wage a war with vast numbers of dead and wounded? Considering the alternative, I cannot fault his decision.

If you want to consider someone bloodthirsty, can we take a look at the EU? France and Germany, knowing full well what will come in terms of a global conflict and the massive loss of life that it entails if they persued this course of action, still happily did so for purely financial gain. In the short term, they also were fully aware that they were supporting a dictator who happily killed large numbers of his own people. So, who is the bloodthirsty one?

A peace activist was quoted as saying that "Violence never settles anything". This is only partially correct. Unfocused, unplanned, poorly executed violence indeed does not accomplish much at all. Well planned, well timed, well placed, ruthlessly executed, selective violence often solves many problems.

Originally posted by dragonrider
This war is actually being fought for a very good reason. This reason has not been publicized widely simply because it is not what most of the world would consider to be "politically correct", especially since about 50% of the core of the world power structure is directly opposed to it.

Very simply, Iraq, along with Iran and Syria, favor converting the international oil standard currency from the US dollar, where it has been for the past 50+ years, to the Euro (which has only come into existence in the last few years). All three of these countries intended to force a vote in OPEC to do so this summer, with Iraq being the strongest of the lot as the 2nd largest oil producer in the world.

If this happens, first the entire US economy will collapse in short order. This is because the oil standard is the ONLY hard assett backing the US dollar currently has (the gold standard having been bastardized long ago). Soon thereafter, a good chunk of the rest of the world economy will slip into deep depression. The only way out of this enormous economic abyss will be world war, and we will see FAR more death and destruction than what we even expected to see in Iraq.

The main opposition to this is of course France and Germany. This is simply because they stand to win bigtime in terms of the economy when thier new currency suddenly gains a huge hard asset backing.

Is the US bloodthirsty because GW decided to risk American lives in Iraq, where he knew he could win with a minimum of bloodshed, versus waiting maybe 10 years, when the US will have 75% unemployment, and we will be desperate, and will have to wage a war with vast numbers of dead and wounded? Considering the alternative, I cannot fault his decision.

If you want to consider someone bloodthirsty, can we take a look at the EU? France and Germany, knowing full well what will come in terms of a global conflict and the massive loss of life that it entails if they persued this course of action, still happily did so for purely financial gain. In the short term, they also were fully aware that they were supporting a dictator who happily killed large numbers of his own people. So, who is the bloodthirsty one?

A peace activist was quoted as saying that "Violence never settles anything". This is only partially correct. Unfocused, unplanned, poorly executed violence indeed does not accomplish much at all. Well planned, well timed, well placed, ruthlessly executed, selective violence often solves many problems.

Unemployment? If Americans have trouble finding jobs you wonder why?

Go around and take a look at everything you own, where was it made? Most likely it wasn't made in America. For crying out loud most of those "Patriotic American Flags" that you see so often now are made in China. *laugh*

Go around and take a look at everything you own, where was it made? Most likely it wasn't made in America. For crying out loud most of those "Patriotic American Flags" that you see so often now are made in China. *laugh Posted by Info

Can you say International Economy?

Why do you think I was saying that if the US economy fell through, the vast majority of the international economy would follow suit, resulting in a massive international depression that would require a massive world war to get out of?

Originally posted by dragonrider
Go around and take a look at everything you own, where was it made? Most likely it wasn't made in America. For crying out loud most of those "Patriotic American Flags" that you see so often now are made in China. *laugh Posted by Info

Can you say International Economy?

Why do you think I was saying that if the US economy fell through, the vast majority of the international economy would follow suit, resulting in a massive international depression that would require a massive world war to get out of?

Depression for what? We don't need other countries making products for us, we need to start making them for ourselves.

The reason America has everything it does is not because it's so great but because how little other people in other countries are willing to work for.

Slave labor?

The reason America has everything it does is not because it's so great but because how little other people in other countries are willing to work for. Posted by Info

That has nothing to do with what I was talking about.

What I am talking about is that if and when OPEC succeeds in changing the oil standard currency from the US Dollar to the Euro, there will be no hard assett backing for the dollar. The dollar will cease to have any value, and will be worthless. A gallon of gasoline that cost me $1.40 today will cost about $57 tomorrow, and $189 the next day.

Do you know what happened to the German economy after WWI? Their economy collapsed because the victors, the US, England, and France walked off with all hard assets (gold) that Germany had as "war reparations".... after that happened, the Germans were using the Deutsch Mark for toilet paper, as that was how valuable it was. A loaf of bread cost a couple hundred marks.

Originally posted by dragonrider
The reason America has everything it does is not because it's so great but because how little other people in other countries are willing to work for. Posted by Info

That has nothing to do with what I was talking about.

What I am talking about is that if and when OPEC succeeds in changing the oil standard currency from the US Dollar to the Euro, there will be no hard assett backing for the dollar. The dollar will cease to have any value, and will be worthless. A gallon of gasoline that cost me $1.40 today will cost about $57 tomorrow, and $189 the next day.

Do you know what happened to the German economy after WWI? Their economy collapsed because the victors, the US, England, and France walked off with all hard assets (gold) that Germany had as "war reparations".... after that happened, the Germans were using the Deutsch Mark for toilet paper, as that was how valuable it was. A loaf of bread cost a couple hundred marks.

Why don't we just say the hell with the rest of the world and become totally independent. The hell with the bankers, the hell with the federal reserve.

We make our own money our own products and tell the rest of the world they can kiss off?

Is this possible? Isn't that what we should do?

Its not possible. Just cant be done with the world today.

Originally posted by dragonrider
Its not possible. Just cant be done with the world today.

What about this oil. Now America has control of tons of oil, with this can't the dept to the Federal Reserve be paid off in full? Can't we now tell them to go to hell?

The Fed isnt who we owe the money to... We owe money to everyone in the world. Just because we have a hard asset backing to the dollar doesnt mean we have more dollars.... The Confederate States got into some serious trouble like that... they had limited gold backing, but went ahead and printed all the money they needed. Got to remember, your money value is dependent on the hard asset backing... If you have a finite amount of gold to back your money, and you just print a load of money, your money becomes worth less and less...

Originally posted by dragonrider
The Fed isnt who we owe the money to...

Check this out, I figured you already understood the system. But in case you don't.

www.flash.net...



[Edited on 23-4-2003 by Info]

Dragonrider we have not used the gold standard since Richard Nixon was president. You seem to want to emphasize that we are on the oil standard but neither is that valid conclusion.


"Info" credibility is an important standard as well???

Originally posted by Toltec
Dragonrider we have not used the gold standard since Richard Nixon was president. You seem to want to emphasize that we are on the oil standard but neither is that valid conclusion.


"Info" credibility is an important standard as well???

You always leave me guessing Will, talking to you is like an enigma.

What credibility, where, what, who and when? You confuse me Mr. Meagee.

My last name is not Meagee it is in fact a common Spanish name which the word Matus specifically defines.

My first name is Juan and with respect to your credibility you have failed to respond to my first post to you, which was quite clear.

What you do not say has a much more greater value that what you do say in a debate.

If what you are looking for is a mutual admiration society you have come to the wrong place